Pemmican

[Nativearizonan]

As far as the service berries go, I would bet that choice had a lot to do with the fact they were abundant in the region. Different regions and different peoples may have used different berries.

Here in my region, the arid SW, we do have service berries in the mountains, as well as native currants, raspberries, gooseberries, chokecherries, 3 kinds of wild cherries, canyon grapes, barberry, manzanita berries, squawberries, some quite palatable juniper berries along with many unpalatable ones, cactus fruits, and other fruits that escape me at the moment. Any of these may have been used at one time or another, in pemmican-like food.

 

[Nativearizonan]

And yet, there are far more similarities than differences.

You are viewing this through a modern lens with modern preconceptions....

I would disagree with this assessment. I would say you are viewing this through a eurocentric lens of your own upbringing.

 

[Nativearizonan]

I should note, that although the original recipe was lost, my deep ancestors, the Neanderthal, were the true developers (inventors if you must) of pemmican.
Also, my understanding is that dried meat keeps some of the vitamins (i.e. vitamin C), which in turn will help prevent scurvy and help preserve the pemmican. Although, I cannot attest to the veracity of this statement.

:bow: :rotf:

 

[Black Hand]

And yet, there are far more similarities than differences.

You are viewing this through a modern lens with modern preconceptions....

I would disagree with this assessment. I would say you are viewing this through a eurocentric lens of your own upbringing.

Confident words from someone who knows little to nothing about me or what I know...

 

[necchi]

And yet, there are far more similarities than differences.

:thumbsup:
(dang it,, I agree with him!) :wink:

 

[kansas_volunteer]

Okay, Pemmican Nazis, try this recipe for pemmican as used on the Byrd expeditions to the antarctic.

Beef suet 32.66 percent
Whole milk powder 19.8 percent
Dried bacon 17.57 percent
Powdered beef liver 4.95 percent
Granulated, rolled dried beef 4.95 percent
Tomatoes vegetable concentrate dried 4.95 percent
Soy bean grits 4.95 percent
Oat meal quick cooking 2.47 percent
Pea soup powder 2.47 percent
Potatoes shredded dried 1.48 percent
Granulated bouillon .99 percent
Brewers yeast .99 percent
Onion salt .74 percent
Paprika .37 percent
Lemon powder .37 percent
Carraway seed .25 percent
Cayenne pepper. 025 percent
Black pepper .025 percent

 

[Nativearizonan]

And yet, there are far more similarities than differences.

You are viewing this through a modern lens with modern preconceptions....

I would disagree with this assessment. I would say you are viewing this through a eurocentric lens of your own upbringing.

Confident words from someone who knows little to nothing about me or what I know...

"Confident words from someone who knows little to nothing about me or what I know..."

I suppose I could say the same exact thing about your statement about my modern lens and modern preconceptions.

 

[Black Hand]

Your post, your words indicated your modern view - I only pointed it out. Also, your responses to varied other posts indicate the same.

 

[Black Hand]

Okay, Pemmican Nazis, try this recipe for pemmican as used on the Byrd expeditions to the antarctic.

Beef suet 32.66 percent
Whole milk powder 19.8 percent
Dried bacon 17.57 percent
Powdered beef liver 4.95 percent
Granulated, rolled dried beef 4.95 percent
Tomatoes vegetable concentrate dried 4.95 percent
Soy bean grits 4.95 percent
Oat meal quick cooking 2.47 percent
Pea soup powder 2.47 percent
Potatoes shredded dried 1.48 percent
Granulated bouillon .99 percent
Brewers yeast .99 percent
Onion salt .74 percent
Paprika .37 percent
Lemon powder .37 percent
Carraway seed .25 percent
Cayenne pepper. 025 percent
Black pepper .025 percent

Sounds delicious...???? Most especially, the powdered beef liver. I am excited about the bacon though.
That said, 1947 is a little late for our period of interest... :grin: :grin:

 

[Claude Mathis]

And yet, there are far more similarities than differences.

You are viewing this through a modern lens with modern preconceptions....

I would disagree with this assessment. I would say you are viewing this through a eurocentric lens of your own upbringing.

Confident words from someone who knows little to nothing about me or what I know...

"Confident words from someone who knows little to nothing about me or what I know..."

I suppose I could say the same exact thing about your statement about my modern lens and modern preconceptions.

PEMMICAN: Dried meat, fat, and sometimes berries.

Get on with your lives. :wink:

 

[Black Hand]

Pemmican still sounds better than soup made from scraped rawhide skins or eating moccasin soles. I've had modern pemmican made by friends and reminded me more of a dessert (some modern recipes are fruit- rather than meat-based). The last batch looked like the gifts one finds left behind by neighborhood cats...

Long-story-short, dried shredded/pulverized meat and marrowfat (other sources of fat have been used, but it is suggested one avoids the fat around internal organs as it is waxy and coats the mouth). Berries are optional and their residual moisture content can result in spoilage of the final product. Pemmican should store at ambient temperature, and was often stored in a container made from gut. It the broadest sense, it is similar to confit, where meat is cooked in fat and allowed to congeal, thereby preserving the meat for extended periods of time. However, since the meat was already dried, mixing and storing protected from light and air kept the fat from going rancid.

Nutritionally speaking:
Pemmican was a source of fats (concentrated source of energy, but was released slowly) and lean protein (good source of energy that was release a little more quickly than energy from fats). The berries, either mixed in or eaten separately, provided quick energy from the sugars contained therein.

 

[zimmerstutzen]

I planted some saskatoons (service berries here) they are actually a relative of the crabapple that looks and tastes like a blueberry (at least the ones I have)

I don't see how dried berries would cause anything to go bad. Service berries are easy to dry.

As for Byrds recipe, the liver powder and soybean grits ? no No NO

 

[Black Hand]

I don't see how dried berries would cause anything to go bad. Service berries are easy to dry.

Dried berries are rich in sugar and contain residual moisture - bacteria & fungi (in which dried berries are covered) grow well in moist, sugar-containing environments. Fats and proteins require more specialized enzymes to break them down, while sugar is readily metabolized by (nearly all) bacteria & fungi..

 

[kansas_volunteer]

In the broadest sense, it is similar to confit, where meat is cooked in fat and allowed to congeal, thereby preserving the meat for extended periods of time. However, since the meat was already dried, mixing and storing protected from light and air kept the fat from going rancid.

Nutritionally speaking:
Pemmican was a source of fats (concentrated source of energy, but was released slowly) and lean protein (good source of energy that was release a little more quickly than energy from fats). The berries, either mixed in or eaten separately, provided quick energy from the sugars contained therein.

The comfit I suppose is similar to an old way of preserving meet that might be HC/PC. Hot fried meat is layered in a crock and hot melted fat is poured over it. The meat is preserved for quite a while as it would be very hot and germ free, and likewise the fat would be hot and germ free. In use only the top bit of fat might go bad. The crock would be covered with cloth tied on with string.

I've long understood ***** pemmican was made of dried pulverized meat and pulverized berries. Berries would no be mixed in whole.

 

[Billnpatti]

Boy, did I ever open a Pandora's Box just suggesting a recipe for making Pemmican. I know it wasn't authentic since it called for modern store bought ingredients to make it. But, jeeze, who would have thunk it would have stirred up such a stink. :idunno: :surrender:

Here's a thought, what about those blocks of store bought mincemeat. :hmm: It contains dried fruit, meat and fat plus a bunch of seasonings. Except for all of the seasonings, it is sort of a modern day pemmican. Probably more agreeable to the modern taste. I've never tried to eat it just as it comes from the store because my wife always made it into pies at Thanksgiving and Christmas. Aw well, best to just forget it, it's just more food for another argument. :yakyak: :blah: :rotf:

Whenever I get around to making some pemmican, I am going to use store bought fruit and nut trail mix, store bought jerky and probably some butter instead of animal fat. I just think the butter, while it may not keep for months will just taste better. Besides, I am no long hunter and my time in the woods is measured mostly in hours at a time and only occasionally a day or two. Any pemmican that I make will swerve mostly as a midday snack. Yes, it will be soft but I can roll it into balls and wrap it in waxed paper. I may think of something to thicken it with or just change the ratio of butter to jerky and trail mix. :thumbsup:

I guess I could take a can of Vienna sausages and some fruit and nut trail mix and eat them separately and they would turn into sort of a pemmican in my stomach. Yep, I do often march to my own drum beat. :grin:

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Actually it is the similarity that some find fascinating. For example, Ötzi the 5300 year old mummy from the Alps, has a clout and leggings very similar to those used by paleolithic peoples in North America. Silimar foods preserved in similar ways might be considered equally interesting, between cultures which developed the preservation methods before contact.

LD

 

[Black Hand]

Whenever I get around to making some pemmican, I am going to use store bought fruit and nut trail mix, store bought jerky and probably some butter instead of animal fat.

I would avoid butter as it contains milk-solids which could go rancid (the presence of salt in butter allows it to be stored at ambient temperature, while unsalted butter will go rancid without refrigeration). Go to your local butcher and get some cow femurs (Marrow bones, also found in some Supermarkets/Grocery stores) and render the marrowfat from the bones. If the (potential) taste is of concern, the flavor of marrowfat is far less assertive than even butter - very neutral with a hint of roasted meat flavor at the back end (I call it meat butter). Just crack the bones (or have your butcher cut them into lengths), remove the marrow and render it over low heat to extract the fat. Very easy to accomplish.

 

[Black Hand]

Actually it is the similarity that some find fascinating. For example, Ötzi the 5300 year old mummy from the Alps, has a clout and leggings very similar to those used by paleolithic peoples in North America. Silimar foods preserved in similar ways might be considered equally interesting, between cultures which developed the preservation methods before contact.

LD

Considering the native cultures in the Americas grew out of travelers from the Old World, it isn't surprising the cultures are similar. The prevailing hypothesis is they crossed into North America on the Bering Land Bridge or when the sea level was far lower than now. If I am remembering correctly, NA's are genetically related to the Ainu of Japan.

 

[Bo T]

I have read that the Ainu may have comprised a large proportion of the 3rd migration from Siberia. So yes, genetically, many NA would be related.

I believe that surviving groups (cultures) would have needed to develop techniques of food preservation, so what we refer to as pemmican was most likely discovered by numerous groups across the world (it isn't rocket science).
Now, Ludfisk might be unique to Scandinavia.

 

[Gene L]

Considering the native cultures in the Americas grew out of travelers from the Old World, it isn't surprising the cultures are similar. The prevailing hypothesis is they crossed into North America on the Bering Land Bridge or when the sea level was far lower than now. If I am remembering correctly, NA's are genetically related to the Ainu of Japan.

I think the Bering Land Bridge only partly explains NAs. Widespread colonization traces have been discovered as far south as SA dating back to era previous to the Land Bridge. Theory is they got there by boat along the Pacific coast. Also, traces of a butchered bones from a mastadon were found in FL! dating back 13,500 years.

Right now, anthropologists are somewhat confused.