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Yes, i do know a non violent felon who hunts with a conventional muzzleloader in Indiana.

Federal law does not define muzzleloaders as firearms. Thus, a felon in Indiana may legally possess a muzzleloader if they are not a serious violent felon and have not been convicted of a crime involving domestic violence so long as they are not on probation or otherwise prohibited.

There are many factors outside of being a felon under both state and federal law that regulate whom may possess a firearm. Anyone who is seeking to determine whether or not they may legally possess a firearm should contact an attorney with knowledge of state and federal firearm laws.
https://www.avvo.com/legal-answers/can-a-prior-nonviolent-felon-in-indiana-possess-a--1950123.html
 
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Be aware that a Permission Slip, so to speak, from the current Attorney General, would be worthless if his or her successor had a different olinion on the matter.

What's legal today may not be tomorrow, and vice-versa
 
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Not having the Indiana Code at hand, I do wonder if that section applies to modern firearms and not muzzleloaders? The reason I ask is because I lived in Indiana in the last half of the 70's and knew a couple of guys who owned and used muzzle loaders and who had been convicted of minor felonies. However, that was a long time ago, now.

With the MOST sincere respect and admiration for most LE Officers, I have found that in most states, most of them really DON'T know firearms laws all that well. We got some HORRIBLE advice from one County Sheriff (not a Deputy, but the actual elected Sheriff) here in Virginia on self defense shooting years ago. A couple of years ago, a 12 year veteran of the Police Force also gave improper instruction on it to me as well. I didn't argue about it, I just let it pass.

I completely agree the best advice is that Josh contact the State AG, as he has stated he has now done. Just make sure to keep a positive answer letter on file and I would further suggest keeping a copy of that letter in with his shooting gear, in case an LE Officer questions him on it.

Gus

Oh, a P.S. I would further suggest the copy kept with the shooting gear would be one notarized by a Notary Public.
 
Jack Wilson said:
Josh Smith said:
I've written the Indiana AG and am awaiting a reply. I'm afraid this will ultimately need to be challenged in court.
That's all you needed to do in the first place. All the anecdotal evidence and opinions on the internet are irrelevant. (but you know that)

Have you checked with the Indiana wildlife agency / game commission, or whatever its called there? Chances are they may have the most informed answer for you, as their officers would be the primary enforcement arm.
 
never count on law enforcement
to give you accurate legal information.there job is to enforce existing laws and they are under no obligation to provide accurate information,there sole job is to detain anyone they believe commited a crime,period.your states hunting regulations are a good place to start.i carry a copy when I shoot on private property,the state statue is right there in black and white.if someone doesn't agree write there congressman is all I can say
 
Actually LEO's are required to actually know the laws and how they are applied. They don't have to answer legal questions, and can't be held liable if they are wrong with their answer, but the excuse "I thought that was the law" does not shield us LEO's from criminal and civil prosecution if a judge decides we had a "duty to know", nor does it indemnify the civilian who got bad information.

There are problems these days with the OP's question no matter what state..., here's why...

In the State of Maryland, we used to have convicted felons using black powder guns to hunt. In one case a man was using a repro 1858 Remington as a home defense handgun, after being convicted of a crime where he could have been imprisoned for more than two years..., this is important, folks, because some states like Maryland have misdemeanors which have max penalties of more than two year in jail. The federal laws do apply to misdemeanors with possible penalties that exceed 2 years.

According to the feds the word "felony" is not needed, just the fact that the conviction could have resulted in a sentence of more than two years . What the person received as the actual sentence is moot....and if you have "common law" as we used to have, with a vague penalty of "whatever the judge deems is reasonable"...that falls into that category too. So for a while in the 1990's men were pleading guilty to common law assault on their spouse or girlfriend, which means they "put them in fear" of being hit (while not actually striking the women) and in a day or two after the conviction the State Troopers were showing up to collect the man's guns. :shocked2:

So the guys were fine, using caplocks or flinters or even cap-n-ball revolvers for a while....,then came Cowboy Action Shooting....

The Federal Law reads thus:

18 U.S. Code § 921....

(a)(16)The term “antique firearm” means”” ...

(C) any muzzle loading rifle, muzzle loading shotgun, or muzzle loading pistol, which is designed to use black powder, or a black powder substitute, and which cannot use fixed ammunition. (so far so good...)

For purposes of this subparagraph, the term “antique firearm” shall not include any weapon which incorporates a firearm frame or receiver, any firearm which is converted into a muzzle loading weapon, or any muzzle loading weapon which can be readily converted to fire fixed ammunition by replacing the barrel, bolt, breechblock, or any combination thereof.

So this paragraph does NOT use the term cylinder...it uses "breechblock" so in my mind they are referring to rifles. So I would argue that any of the repro antique, cap-n-ball revolvers used in CAS, which MAY be readily converted to use cartridges with a drop-in cylinder (black powder cartridges count folks) would not fall under this due to the lack of the word "cylinder", BUT ..., would an Assistant United States Attorney agree with me? Would a Federal Judge? I have had several AUSA's tell me the charge would work against a felon using an 1858 Remington with a drop in cylinder that uses .45 Colt ammo with black powder or Pyrodex. ???

..., OK so we decide to play-it-safe and the felons simply don't use cap-n-ball revolvers...

Second, you have the following, as a felon (or a person convicted of a misdemeanor with a possible penalty of more than 24 months in jail) cannot possess "ammunition"...,

18 U.S. Code § 921 (a)(17)(A)
The term “ammunition” means ammunition or cartridge cases, primers, bullets, or propellant powder designed for use in any firearm.

Well, before CAS, and the return of fixed ammunition using black powder, all of the traditional rifles, and guns, and pistols and cap-n-ball revolvers were "antiques", and black powder and pyrodex was intended for use in "antique firearms" (which means repros too)..., NOW, however, you have Black Powder being used to manufacture cartridges which may be readily used in modern firearms such as a Marlin or Winchester lever action rifle, THUS Black Powder is now "propellant powder designed for use in any firearm" and even if using a traditional rifle or gun... having BP might be a violation, and anti-gun prosecutors and judges may decide that BP or any substitute is now no longer legal for use by the convicted felon. There may be a section the specifically lists black powder as an exception to this..., I can't find it right now..., but I doubt it lists the black powder substitute powders along with the black powder.

LD
 
it would be nice if LEOS did know the laws they were tasked with enforcing and no doubt many of them do ,to an axtent,however,without attending law school it seems unlikely.i don't have the statue handy,and I may very well be mistaken,but last I checked ammo was defined as a cartridge,a propellant,a projectile and a primer.if you shoot RB with a slingshot are you in poss. of ammo?Fl. law clearly states all but post 1918 originals or repros are apparently legal. LEOS are not Judges or attorneys,if they have reasonable cause to believe a crime has been commited,there job is to arrest,transport to detention and secure person till a judge can make the determination.that being said,i am glad they wake up every day and do what they do. :thumbsup:
 
Fl statue 790.001(19)"ammunition"means an objectconsisting of all of the following,a fixed metallic or non metallic hull or caseing containing a primer.one or more projectiles one or more bullets or shot.gunpowder.this is straight from fl statues. not sure about Indiana law but this should give you a starting point and remember,state laws vary widely
 
Several times you've mentioned "1918 originals or repros" as a cutoff date to determine if a firearm is an antique in Florida.

You may be correct but that date surprises me.

The Federal cutoff date for an antique is 1898, and even that has an additional requirement.

The firearm must shoot ammunition that is no longer commercially made.

This removes the Colt single action .45 and a lot of other pre 1898 guns from the possible classification of it being an antique.

That said, back to muzzle-loaders and cap and ball pistols. :grin:
 
Here in AZ a game warden (not having just had a fight with the wife anyway) is not likely to screw with a felon with a BP gun. They of course can. Treated with respect and being freindly they are too (in all my "run ins" anyway). I would be MUCH more concerned about the short lil occifer on the city force pulling you over for failure to signal, running yer license and of course then searching your vehicle and finding a "weapon" and off you go. Up to you and the bail bondsman to get ya home now.

Up here we have a few cops with a definite case of shortman syndrome. Did I mention 3 officer involved shootings in 60 days? Then over east a bit a lady with a pair of scissors was lead to the pearly gates.

I see NOTHING wrong with archery in these cases. If it were me I would not do a damn thing that a cop could get me on EVER. Had a buddy was a felon for a BS DV charge and he was finally able to get his rights back to vote and possess firearms. He will tell ya...it aint worth it. We all tried to get him to apply for a BP hunt and he wouldnt budge. Wrong guy on the end of the badge can make yer life a living hell.

Now that said please dont think I am anti cop, my dad was one. I respect em (almost :grin: ) all. As said above if I had paid my debt to society for that which remains unknown I'd be in the same boat FOR SURE :shocked2:
 
I am a lawyer, although I do not know Indiana law, I can tell you that here in Pennsylvania, anybody barred from fixed ammo guns is barred by state law from "antique firearms. In fact, under our law any protection from domestic abuse order prevents the defendant from possessing ANY firearm. Being on probation for any reason, being admitted to a mental health facility against you will is another bar to possession, there are even those who claim anyone charged with DUI, is barred under federal law, and therefore also state law as an illegal user of a central nervous system depressant. Looking at the federal law is just the beginning of the search for the answer. Fortunately, we have a fairly straightforward procedure for restoration of state firearms rights.
 
zimmerstutzen said:
I am a lawyer, although I do not know Indiana law, I can tell you that here in Pennsylvania, anybody barred from fixed ammo guns is barred by state law from "antique firearms...Fortunately, we have a fairly straightforward procedure for restoration of state firearms rights.

So Counselor, is that to say that a convicted felon who has served his sentence, and is released from all forms of imprisonment and parole could get his state rights restored and therefore legally possess an antique firearm?
 
In Texas, felons can hunt with any muzzleloader as long as it doesn't use 209 ignition.
Although, parole restrictions might prohibit even that. I knew one guy who's parole officer said he couldn't use a crossbow cuz it had a trigger.
 
If people had a full understanding of the consequences of their actions, before they committed a crime........There would be less crime. IMO.
 
so,you have never committed a felony?good for you, :bow: glad 4 u.or have u never got caught?if not U must be JC.for your information,we have all done felonys,just the most fortunate of us(like you)have never got caught.(count your blessings) :bow: so b4 u look down your nose,remember the sins of your past that only JC knows!need more people like U in the world!! your quite the upstanding fella!!! :haha:
 
so you have never broke the law? :shocked2: my point is,if u think u aint you have selective memory at the least or your name is JC.if im wrong,well my hat is off 2 U Sir :thumbsup:
 
aint argueing with you,have heard the same misinformation,if it be so,can we use a spray bottle?after all,it is a trigger.what say U?
 
Skychief said:
:shocked2: :shocked2: :shocked2: We have all comitted felonies?

Like what, for example? :idunno:

I agree - it would be helpful to have a list of all those felonies I'm liable to commit, so I can do my best to avoid them.
 
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