Powder Horn

[dispatch 510]

I am looking for a reasonable priced powder horn,just a plain jane but still fuctional.Anybody know of a good source. Thanks in advance for any info. :front:

 

[DGeraths]

About every supplier carries some form of powder horn... from the cheap $20 job to the fancy $300 carved beauties. I would check out the links section of this site. There seems to be some good suppliers listed there.

Dana

 

[Black Hand]

Personally,I would spend $7-10 on a clean cow horn and make my own. Easy to do with very basic tools, and you get what you want.
Black Hand

 

[soggy]

:agree:I agree with Black Hand. It is quite simple, and if you have any questions there's lots of members on this forum more than willing to advise you. There's nothing quite like being able to look at the finished project and saying "I made that!" :m2c:
Soggy

 

[onefeather]

well i was like him once and i got one from crazy crow trading post for 20 bucks with a threaded removable plug and it has some white and black near the tip but i make my own now the first one i made was ugly but functional. :front:

 

Hey Bud take a look at a few pics, now go buy a horn from Tandy's ... a little effort slam YOU got a horn and YOU will be better off for it... Try it the parts for the top can be picked up cheap... What do You have to loose... best regards loyalist dawg
:hatsoff:

 

I agree with making your own, I have one that I might have $25 into and to me it's priceless. ::


TheGunCellar

 

[DGeraths]

Maybe I am just overly safety aware (can you be too safety aware??) but I think it is very important that you know the important do's and don't of powder horns; especially if you do in fact decide to make your own.

First and foremost rule in horn design is AVOID THE USE OF METAL OTHER THAN BRASS in the construction of the powder horn. Ideally, a horn should be made with NO metal at all.

I have attached a photo of my horn that I made several years ago to illustrate what I am talking about.

This horn as NO metal on it anywhere. Why? Because metal can translate static electricity and can (although rarely and only through certain circumstances) ignite the powder. I have witnessed a powder horn explosion first hand and it is NOT pretty. The cause? after examining the horn (what was left of it anyway) it was determined that one of the iron nails used to hold the rear plug onto the horn had in fact been nailed in crooked, allowing the point of the nail to exit the wood inside of the horn, thereby touching the powder.

The owner of this horn had not had it long and was wearing it while wearing a wool capote. He was walking the trail when the horn went off. As near as could be figured, the iron nail head rubbing against his wool jacket translated a static charge which set off the powder inside the horn.

BOOM!

There was no injury to the person with the exception of being seriously shaken up, the thick wool jacket and leather shirt took much of the punishment. Had this happened in the heat of summer, he could have seen serious injury.

I know this sounds a little bit like a Mr. Wizard episode, but it can and has happened before.


The conclusion regarding the nail/static was based on several phone calls to different horn builders. All of them asked the same question.. what kind of nails were used on the horn? Another, more common culprit of this type of accident is the practice of using an iron staple as a strap holder. Builders must take great care not to drive the staple all the way through the wood plug. This can result in the same type of accident.

My horn (detail shot below) has been built using traditional methods, which include wood pins holding the plug in place.

This is done for two reasons. One, wood cannot translate a static charge and two, the plug will more easily blow out if the horn was to go off, releasing a lot of the explosive pressure. Brass nails are common in the construction of horns but the problem with their use is that the plug will not release and the horn itself will splinter, throwing a whole lot of very dangerous shrapnel around.

I know that this might seem paranoid to some, but one must remember that the only difference between a powder horn and a bomb is a single spark. You will be carrying around as much as a pound of black powder right against your ribs... to treat what you hold that powder in with anything but the greatest of care is just asking for serious trouble.

:m2c:

 

[rmay]

Here's a link that has a wide variety of powder horns, plain and reasonably priced to fancy and more expensive. I bought plain common man's horn for $36 and was very impressed with the quality and workmanship. Far beter than anything I could do myself.
:imo: :results:
http://www.waynezurl.com/

Russ52

 

[hobbles]

Mornin dispatch 510
http://www.possibleshop.com/powderhorn1.htm
bottom of page,,

 

[brubincam]

i found a small horn in a farmers field, must of gone out with the manure, made a very nice priming horn

 

[roundball]

I have witnessed a powder horn explosion first hand and it is NOT pretty. The cause? after examining the horn (what was left of it anyway) it was determined that one of the iron nails used to hold the rear plug onto the horn had in fact been nailed in crooked, allowing the point of the nail to exit the wood inside of the horn, thereby touching the powder.

The owner of this horn had not had it long and was wearing it while wearing a wool capote. He was walking the trail when the horn went off. As near as could be figured, the iron nail head rubbing against his wool jacket translated a static charge which set off the powder inside the horn.
BOOM!

IMHO, if I was investigating it, I'd still be looking for the cause...
:m2c:

 

[Stumpkiller]

Our very own Griz made mine. He can make them as plain or fancy as you like. (Price is between you and him).

It holds about 80 shots for my .54 and is a good general purpose size (a little over 11" long). I'm taking great risks with the two iron staples that keep the strap, but I seldom move fast enough to build up a good head of ions.

Hard to see, but it spells out S+T+U+M+P+K+I+L+L+E+R in the design around the base between the pegs. And, there's a little stump scrimshawed on the back with two arrows sticking out of it. I love those features. ::

The pictures don't begin to do it justice. There are two raised rings near the tip and the base is chip-carved. Note that the strap is not anchored on the front staple, it just serves to keep it from sliding out of place.

 

[DGeraths]

IMHO, if I was investigating it, I'd still be looking for the cause...

I know, it sounds far fetched, but it does indeed happen. When we disected what had happened and put that together with the ideas put forth by horn builders, the culprit became clear. The plug had one nail clearly jutting out into what would have been the powder.

Since the horn was sealed and he was not even using it but was in fact just walking down a trail, there was little else that could have done it.

Why do you think all powder measures, flasks, measure tips and all of that are made of brass? Because brass is less likely to carry a tranfer a static charge.

This person using iron nails to secure the horn plug is what caused this horn to explode.

Dana

 

[scott k]

Why do you think all powder measures, flasks, measure tips and all of that are made of brass? Because brass is less likely to carry a tranfer a static charge.

Brass is a good conducter of electicity. But is real hard to make a spark with. :m2c:
Lehigh...

 

[Stumpkiller]

Electrostatic sparks from brass?

Holy Van de Graff Generator, Batman!

 

[roundball]

IMHO, if I was investigating it, I'd still be looking for the cause...

I know, it sounds far fetched, but it does indeed happen. When we disected what had happened and put that together with the ideas put forth by horn builders, the culprit became clear. The plug had one nail clearly jutting out into what would have been the powder.

Since the horn was sealed and he was not even using it but was in fact just walking down a trail, there was little else that could have done it.

Why do you think all powder measures, flasks, measure tips and all of that are made of brass? Because brass is less likely to carry a tranfer a static charge.

This person using iron nails to secure the horn plug is what caused this horn to explode.

Dana

Dana, I don't doubt for a minute that you're convinced of the deductions and therefore the conclusions that you've made about this situation...I just don't personally happen to necessarily believe that conclusion was the failure mechanism.

And please don't take my different opinion as any indictment of your ability to draw conclusions, I just see the circumstances differently so I come to a different conclusion...doesn't mean my conclusion is right, just different.

For example, we both would probably agree that people can build up a static charge walking across a nylon carpet, but I have never experienced a static charge while walking through the woods in a lot of years wearing / carrying a lot of things since the 60's.

In addition, there are now some excellent study results (one of which in in this Forum's "Muzzleloading Links" with high magnification photographs) that disprove the theory that BP will ignite from static electricity.

Also, as a metal, brass actually is an exellent conductor of electricty;

And although they certainly aren't PC...cappers, powder flasks, powder measures, speedloaders, etc, have now been made out of plastic and in use for the past 15-20 years that I know of.

Cases of Goex BP are shipped all over the country every day in nothing more than a basic Goex cardboard box...not much protection from anything for 25 lbs of blackpowder massed together.

Those are the sorts of considerations for me that make me wonder if there might not be another reason for that accident that just hasn't been discovered yet, that's all.

eace:

 

[DGeraths]

For example, we both would probably agree that people can build up a static charge walking across a nylon carpet, but I have never experienced a static charge while walking through the woods in a lot of years wearing / carrying a lot of things since the 60's.

If you have nothing to release that charge you would be hard pressed to tell it was even there. Take for example when you are walking on carpet, can you feel the charge building up? Of course not. If you could, you wouldn't reach over and touch that metal object and get a shock.
:shocking: Youch!!

There is really no doubt that anyone walking around can generate a static charge, it is as common as anything else on Earth. The amount of charge generated can change with the what you are wearing, the humidity at the time, etc...

I know from experience that at the Home Depot here in Salem I get shocked constantly. I don't know why since the floors are cement, but in that place, out of all of the retail places I frequent, I get a constant static charge. According to an employee there, they are constantly having to deal with painful little electric snaps. :: Strange...

In addition, there are now some excellent study results (one of which in in this Forum's "Muzzleloading Links" with high magnification photographs) that disprove the theory that BP will not ignite from static electricity.

I am not sure if this is a typo. Did you mean to say that it won't ignite? A direct link to the study would be appreciated. It sounds like a good read.

Also, as a metal, brass actually is an excellent conductor of electricity;

Indeed it is, but it will not translate that charge in the form of a spark. That is what I meant in my statement.

And although they certainly aren't PC...cappers, powder flasks, powder measures, speedloaders, etc, have now been made out of plastic and in use for the past 15-20 years that I know of.

Most of the flasks, measures, tips and about everything else that I see hanging on store shelves are all brass. I have seen speedloaders in plastic but that is about it, at least around these parts. If you go to the local Sportsman's Warehouse and look in the BP isle you will find a solid wall of brass items.

Those are the sorts of considerations for me that make me wonder if there might not be another reason for that accident that just hasn't been discovered yet, that's all.

Understood, and do not get me wrong. I understand that if could have been something else that ignited the powder, but under the circumstances this was the most logical conclusion. I have seen three horn ignition accidents and all but this one happened during firing of the weapon.

If you search around the net you will find all types of warning regarding static charge and black powder and the safety issues related to it. Some people have grown kind of complacent about BP and the need for caution when handling it. Throughout the years I have seen some real bonehead moves by people in regards to how they handle their powder...

- Sitting next to their fires while refilling their horn.
- Pouring directly into the barrel of their gun from the horn, instead of using a measure.

My personal favorite was seeing some idiot in camp using a candle to re-melt the beeswax seal on the rear of his horn... yes, the horn still had powder in it.

:shake:

Dana

 

[Griz]

I have to agree with roundball, and to help prove the case, take a look at this site.
http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/mlexperiments/sparks/sparks.html
:m2c:

 

[roundball]

[quote
I am not sure if this is a typo. Did you mean to say that it won't ignite?
[/quote]

Yes, I was probably correcting that while you were typing your reply