Pure Lead vs Alloy

[hthomso]

I understand the reason for using pure lead for casting round balls for use in rifled barrels. However, is there be any downside to using alloy metal for use in a smoothbore barrel? Is obturation of the ball still an important issue? Just came into possession of mucho precast .45 bullets and would like to cast some round balls for my smoothbore musket. Thanks.

 

[BrownBear]

No probs, though you might need a thinner patch since alloys come out of a mold a little bigger. Up here and in Canada, alloy balls are fairly popular for moose. Back in the days of rounds balls in Africa, alloy was used to prevent expansion for a little more penetration. Same thinking behind the moose clanking up this way.

 

[Col. Batguano]

Will a RB go through and through a moose (sideways)?

 

[BrownBear]

Within 75 yards or so, heck even a 54 alloy ball is likely to do it. Of course, a 58 is mobetta and a 62 whistles. :thumbsup:

 

[faste350]

Will a RB go through and through a moose (sideways)?

i'll let you know after my September moose hunt with my .62

 

[curator]

Tex,

I use wheel weight alloy when casting for my smooth bore guns. I also tumble them so the "sprue" is worn down to nothing. That way I can load the balls without worry about the raised area of the sprue interfering with the shot. The tumbled balls shoot great both loaded naked and with a thin greased patch. I also make up paper cartridges for the military calibre guns like my Brown Bess and, U.S. 1816, Charleville muskets allowing the paper to act as wadding. .690 alloy round balls loaded in 12 gauge double barrel guns with a .018 greased patch will easily make 5" groups at 50 yards for serious hog or deer hunting. No need to use precious store of pure lead when alloy works just a good.

 

[Stumpkiller]

This one is scrap plumbing seal lead (some solder & some ??) and it went lengthwise through a whitetail. About 32" of meat and bone. How wide is a moose? ;-)

Barely deformed (went from 0.490 to 0.52" diameter at the largest.

It's the only round ball I ever recovered. Most go right on through.

I know: moose ain't whitetail. I'd feel up to the task with a .54, however.

 

[nkbj]

Balls for smoothies is a great place to use the pile of mystery metal that behaves weird and doesn't want to fill out corners in a mold.

 

[BrownBear]

About 32" of meat and bone. How wide is a moose? ;-)

On a broadside shot 32" would include a whole lot of blue sky behind the moose. What you're buying with extra penetration is some small angling possibilities, since moose won't always be zackly 90 degrees to the shot.

I wouldn't try a lengthwise shot with any round ball, but like the extra penetration from an alloy ball as well as a larger ball chugging along at a pretty good clip. There's also the potential of a shoulder bone adding to obstacles between your side of a moose and the blue sky behind it.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Is obturation of the ball still an important issue?

It's not an issue at all. The patched round ball should be a sphere coming out, and the ball does not itself, engage the rifling. The patch is there for that. Otherwise the guys who shoot modern bullet alloy round balls from rifled barrels would not experience the same amount of accuracy as they do when shooting all lead round ball.

LD

 

[Rifleman1776]

Balls for smoothies is a great place to use the pile of mystery metal that behaves weird and doesn't want to fill out corners in a mold.

That is probably true. I cast up a big batch of pot (and other names) metal [80-90% zinc] into .590" rb for my smoothie. They only weigh 271 gr. compared to about 300 gr. for pure lead. I say "probably" because health problems have kept me from the range for over a year. No first hand experience with these yet. I'm sure they will kill paper and most any four footed target you encounter, albiet with a different poi.

 

[hanshi]

I much prefer WW metal for my .62 flint smoothbore. And I don't hunt anything larger than deer/bear. I still have well over 100 pounds of WW I collected back in the 1960s when I use to cast lots of handgun bullets. I've even used WW in a couple of rifles and they did just fine.

 

[ohio ramrod]

I just pulled the targets from a shoot last week and someone shot a fifty caliber ball right through a 3/16 inch plate gong at seventy five yards. I had hung the gongs that morning so I know it was done during the shoot. I can't believe that whoever hit it was using pure lead! :idunno:

 

[Stumpkiller]

About 32" of meat and bone. How wide is a moose? ;-)

I wouldn't try a lengthwise shot with any round ball, but like the extra penetration from an alloy ball as well as a larger ball chugging along at a pretty good clip.

Truly - I wouldn't normally, either. This six-point deer walked up around 10:00AM when I was sitting on a stump on a morning that never got above -10°F and I put the ball just over his heart, splitting the aorta, at 10 yards. He reared up and fell without ever moving his hind legs. Ball lodged in the hide behind his rear leg.

I had been sitting about three hours and it felt like my stiff hands were in hot coals when I field dressed him.

I made a promise to myself - not to avoid frontal shots, but to never again head out deer hunting when the thermometer was -15°F.

 

[Rifleman1776]

I just pulled the targets from a shoot last week and someone shot a fifty caliber ball right through a 3/16 inch plate gong at seventy five yards. I had hung the gongs that morning so I know it was done during the shoot. I can't believe that whoever hit it was using pure lead! :idunno:

That is amazing. :shocked2: I used to manufacture steel targets and did a lot of testing. I have often had huge bulges on the back side of targets with heavy loads and thick steel. But nothing to match what you describe from an ml gun. Would be interesting to know his caliber, charge, projectile and type of alloy.

 

[BrownBear]

I just pulled the targets from a shoot last week and someone shot a fifty caliber ball right through a 3/16 inch plate gong at seventy five yards. I had hung the gongs that morning so I know it was done during the shoot. I can't believe that whoever hit it was using pure lead!

I'd be curious if it was a heavy conical rather than a round ball.

Sorry to break into modern talk, but it's about a conical lead slug hitting steel and will illustrate why I think that you're looking at a conical hole:

I'm blessed with an original 450 Alaskan on a Model 71 Winnie, launching 500 grain hard lead bullets at a chronoed 2000fps. At a club open house they'd borrowed a full size pig silhouette rigged with chains to a metal frame you drove into the ground. Set it up at 100 yards for everyone to shoot at.

Club pres was all giddy about my rifle and asked me to poke the pig. Folks had been shooting it all day with 06 and a few heavier, and all they did was dimple it. When I uncorked the pig swung so far back it pulled the heavy stakes out of the ground and lay flat. Pres and I and a few others walked up to survey and set it back up.

There was a cratered hole big as a half dollar on the front, diminished to quarter size where it went out the back. Club pres was more than embarrassed because the owner was right there with us! :rotf:

 

[coloradoclyde]

That is amazing. I used to manufacture steel targets and did a lot of testing.

Same here!....And not at all surprised...
3/16" is a little light for targets...As the target is repeatedly shot, the metal becomes thinner and brittle. Shooting puts the target under extreme stress....I have seen holes, targets bend, welds break and metal tear...all from repeated impacts.
Repairs are a constant activity.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

Ya know what else doesn't work? A used cast iron skillet...standard .530 round ball and 70 grains of 3Fg blows right through that at 50 yards. :shocked2: :shake: :redface:

LD

 

[hanshi]

I would rather doubt it was a simple soft lead ball; more likely and alloy or, as mentioned, a conical.

 

[coloradoclyde]

Bullet hardness plays only a small role....Velocity and mass are the critical factors...
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Power_factor_(shooting_sports)