Spiller & Burr

[sourdough]

For those of you who are familiar with me, you know I have a penchant for Pietta 1851 Navy .36 Confederate variants. That said, I got my $600 stimulus check a month ago and have been looking for another Confederate revolver.

I won at auction a Navy Arms/Pietta Spiller & Burr revolver (BL/1998) for $355 + $20 shipping. I received it Monday in the original plastic bag/box. 22 years in the bag left quite a few superficial marks on both brass and blued parts. A bit of #0000 steel wool removed them easily, but I am astounded, having it in hand, how much brass there is (I do have a Pietta G&G but it's not even close). This is a Pietta stock photo (the batteries in my digital cam need recharging) but is very representative of my polishing work.

I have never been a real fan of defarbing/antiquing, but I think this may be a good candidate. I am thinking of going with the services of Lodgewood Confederate Spiller and Burr Revolver (lodgewood.com) for this matter @$155 plus shipping both ways. That pretty much blows the whole $600. It has the Pietta "tail" and I am going to see if Lodgewood can take a bit of that off.

There will never be a chance that it will be mistaken for an original revolver as Pietta saw fit to make the frame different below the hammer where the wood meets it, as well as the trigger guard, recoil shield, hammer spur, among others.

Original revolver:

Opinions welcome!

Regards,

Jim

 

[Justin.44]

I think it would look great defarbed/antiqued. For some reason I prefer the aged look on a brass framed revolver.

 

[B P Arn]

I bought my Pietta Spiller & Burr revolver in 2014, as I recall. It shot way high when I got it, so the first thing I did was remove the front sight and made a new, taller one out of the shank of an old brass screw. I made the new sight by chucking the screw in my drill press and holding a file and then sand paper to it until it was the shape I wanted. Now it shoots to point of aim at 25 yards.

I then made a new set of grip panels for it out of plain American Black Walnut, like originals would have been. The wood that came with it did not look good, and wood stain did not help.

Finally, the best thing I did was to remove the excess flare from the grip frame. I removed material from the front and rear of the frame, to give the whole grip a more rear-ward sweep, like the originals. However, if you look at various photos of original S&G guns, the grip frames, trigger guard shapes, etc, will all show variations, since these were hand made, and all parts made were used, I would suspect, whether they exactly matched specifications or not.

My load is 17 grains of Goex FFF black powder under a lead ball. I see no point in shooting hot loads in this gun. I have enough other guns for that.

Finally, I made this holster for it.

 

[sourdough]

I then made a new set of grip panels for it out of plain American Black Walnut, like originals would have been. The wood that came with it did not look good, and wood stain did not help.

Finally, the best thing I did was to remove the excess flare from the grip frame. I removed material from the front and rear of the frame, to give the whole grip a more rear-ward sweep, like the originals. However, if you look at various photos of original S&G guns, the grip frames, trigger guard shapes, etc, will all show variations, since these were hand made, and all parts made were used, I would suspect, whether they exactly matched specifications or not.

I very much like your gripframe alterations. Much more historic.

Thank you!

Regards,

Jim

 

[GAry W. Anderson]

I love the look of the Spiller and Burr, but I'm on a rather rigid fixed income and it doesn't bend for me to get one. I would also like to obtain another 1851 Colt copy that I could do some work on to make it look like an AMW, or a Rigdon Ansley from Augusta Ga., or even a Leech and Rigdon.

 

[J dirt]

That is a fine looking rig. I need me a holster like that for a dragoon.

 

[sourdough]

I would also like to obtain another 1851 Colt copy that I could do some work on to make it look like an AMW, or a Rigdon Ansley from Augusta Ga., or even a Leech and Rigdon.

I appreciate your desire for a Confederate revolver of some type.

I am afflicted with "parts changer syndrome" and am a fan of Pietta 1851 Navy .36 "type" CNC revolvers manufactured since ~2002. They are almost like the Legos of the BP revolver realm.

A Leech & Rigdon is the easiest to produce. I used a Pietta 1851 Navy .36 as a donor revolver and added the part round/part octagon barrel and the smooth/plain/non engraved cylinder that Pietta produces for their Griswold & Gunnison. I added better wood for this one:

I procured the parts from VTI a few years ago, but during these pandemic times all bets are off as to parts availability.

I created an Augusta Machine Works and a Rigdon & Ansley using two Pietta .36 plain cylinders with no safety pins I acquired from a guy a few years ago and had my next-door neighbor machinist add the extra 6 safety stop slots with approaches on both cylinders for about $75 per cylinder.

The AMW has the octagon Navy barrel and the R&A has the part round/part octagon barrel.

Both of these may be out of your realm financially with the cylinder machine work.

AMW:

R&A:

Good luck with your endeavors during these times!

Regards,

Jim

 

[Zonie]

Folks wanting a Spiller & Burr might keep their eyes open for the gun it was based on, the 1861 Whitney, Second Model Navy.
This is the steel framed pistol produced by the Eli Whitney Company.
The pistol was the first solid frame Navy size revolver that went into production shortly after the Colt Patent expired in 1857**.
There were over 25,000 Whitney's made prior to and during the Civil War, with 4,300 of them being bought by the Navy.

The First Model Whitney Navy did not have a loading lever but apparently there were only about 1200 of them made.
The Second Model Whitney Navy, First type, had a beefier frame with a brass trigger guard. A loading lever was added and one safety notch similar to the later Remington was machined into the rear of the cylinder. The First Model, Second type had 6 safety notches in the rear of the cylinder.
The early 2nd Model Third type had a loading lever added. It used a spring loaded ball to keep it in the "up" position but soon after this was changed to the wedge type similar to the one used in the Colt 1851 Navy.

I'm not sure when my reproduction Whitney was made although I'm sure it was made in Italy. Strangely, although it does have the Italian proof marks on it, the date code is nowhere to be seen.
The only other markings are the serial numbers on several parts, Black Powder Only, DIXIE GUN WORKS, INC on the barrel and and 1861 E. WHITNEY .36 CALIBER on the top strap.

** (Although we call the Remington a 1858, that is due to the patent date, not to when the Remington first went into production which was in 1861.
The Whitney Navy was produced in the late 1850's, thru the WBS.)

I must apologize for the scratches and dings on this pistol. It was among the guns stolen from my house and recovered at a Pawn shop by the Police. It's the only one I've gotten back but I keep hoping.

 

[B P Arn]

I love the look of the Spiller and Burr, but I'm on a rather rigid fixed income and it doesn't bend for me to get one. I would also like to obtain another 1851 Colt copy that I could do some work on to make it look like an AMW, or a Rigdon Ansley from Augusta Ga., or even a Leech and Rigdon.

What is an "AMW"?

 

[sourdough]

Zonie,

That is still a very nice Whitney. It is a First Model because it shows the barrel threads. The Spiller & Burr repros all have the Second Model frame that abuts the cylinder.

Your gun has the correct positioning of the cylinder pin "key" as the original Whitneys had. There are photos of original Spiller revolvers that are reversed. Fact is, it worked either way.

Thanks for posting.

Regards,

Jim

 

[sourdough]

[QUOTE="B P Arn, post: 1791799, member: 34450"What is an "AMW"?[/QUOTE]

Augusta Machine Works. You gotta invest in some books for research.

See post #7.

Regards,

Jim

 

[jonathan butcher]

Agree 100%

I think it would look great defarbed/antiqued. For some reason I prefer the aged look on a brass framed revolver.

 

[B P Arn]

Augusta Machine Works. You gotta invest in some books for research.

See post #7.

Regards,

Jim

[/QUOTE][/QUOTE]

 

[JCKelly]

This is a late one from Georgia, trigger guard replaced in brass, during service.
I bought a Pietta replica but it would not consistently work right if cocked to quickly. As in, normal use. Disappointed.
Original has gain twist rifling, probably steel barrel & cylinder and 88% Copper 5.8% Tin 3.8% Zinc 1.5% Lead cast frame. Cracked over the decades of being stored in a Kentucky horse barn after the shootin' stopped. Yeah, I'm a metallurgist.

 

[GAry W. Anderson]

The AMW that I mentioned stands for AUGUSTA MACHINE WORKS. I originally thought that they were made at the Rigdon Ansley factory, but a little more searching found that the two guns were actually made at two different location just blocks from each other. I am still trying to find another '51 replica to try and "make" a copy of one or the other of these guns, Also would like to find a Spiller&Burr that wasn't an arm or leg.

 

[B P Arn]

^^^ Thank you for your courteous and informative reply.

 

[B P Arn]

This is a late one from Georgia, trigger guard replaced in brass, during service.
I bought a Pietta replica but it would not consistently work right if cocked to quickly. As in, normal use. Disappointed.
Original has gain twist rifling, probably steel barrel & cylinder and 88% Copper 5.8% Tin 3.8% Zinc 1.5% Lead cast frame. Cracked over the decades of being stored in a Kentucky horse barn after the shootin' stopped. Yeah, I'm a metallurgist.

I don't know, but I would imagine they were not very concerned about the exact composition of the alloy, and used whatever they could procure.

I have a Pietta replica Spiller & Burr (see post #3), and have been very satisfied with it. I'm sure yours could be made to work. Do you still have it?

 

[Smokey Plainsman]

The Spiller & Burr is such a good gun. It’s surprisingly small and compact compared to many cap and ball revolvers yet the .36 isn’t a toy and believe me WILL put a man down with a solid center mass hit. It’s also lightweight and makes for a wonderful packing field revolver useful for everything from bunnies to attackers.

 

[rdavidson]

I bought my Pietta Spiller & Burr revolver in 2014, as I recall. It shot way high when I got it, so the first thing I did was remove the front sight and made a new, taller one out of the shank of an old brass screw. I made the new sight by chucking the screw in my drill press and holding a file and then sand paper to it until it was the shape I wanted. Now it shoots to point of aim at 25 yards.

I then made a new set of grip panels for it out of plain American Black Walnut, like originals would have been. The wood that came with it did not look good, and wood stain did not help.

Finally, the best thing I did was to remove the excess flare from the grip frame. I removed material from the front and rear of the frame, to give the whole grip a more rear-ward sweep, like the originals. However, if you look at various photos of original S&G guns, the grip frames, trigger guard shapes, etc, will all show variations, since these were hand made, and all parts made were used, I would suspect, whether they exactly matched specifications or not.

My load is 17 grains of Goex FFF black powder under a lead ball. I see no point in shooting hot loads in this gun. I have enough other guns for that.

Finally, I made this holster for it.

View attachment 63646
View attachment 63647
View attachment 63648

I really like that holster. Good job.

 

[ThreeCrows]

Any of the members that own a Piata S&B can answer this so how tight is the cylinder pin locking set up? I recently bought one from the classifieds and it seems very loose but the screw is in as tight as it can go. Also my cylinder pin is very rough, any of yours rough? It seems to me it should be smooth.
Thanks,
ThreeCrows