The Search for a Vintage Cornbread

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The book is available through Amazon. I have the ebook which allows one to highlight and screenshot things... I am slowly learning that there are some benefits to ebooks

Thanks that's a very good reference. I like this reference that you found as it shows that very early they were adding milk, a sweetener (molasses) and wheat flour, rather similar to what we do today but without chemical leaven.

Here is a modernized version (the printing is a modern font) and also has some illustrations which were added later. This is free and is also searchable.
American Cookery 1796 - Via HathiTrust

IF you use the above link, on page 80 you find the author is using the word "cookies"..., the British then and even today use "biscuits" to refer to what we call cookies...., and in that recipe she is also using "peal ash" (sometimes found in references as Salts of Tartar) which is a chemical leaven also known as Potassium Carbonate, patented in 1790. Yet she doesn't apply the pearl ash to the corn recipes...,

LD
 
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From "The Southern Gardener and Receipt Book" by P. Thornton 1845. From the simplicity of this one I’d say it dates to a much earlier time. I have not tried it.
LIGHT CORN BREAD
Stir four pints of meal into three pints of warm water, add one large teaspoon of salt, let it rise five or six hours, then stir it up with the hand, and bake it in a brisk oven.
Another method is to make mush, and before it gets cold, stir in a half pint of meal. Let it rise, bake it as the first.
Forgot to mention that you can find the book as a pdf.
Yeah that's a pretty good reference. You're right, sometime folks use what is a very old recipe in a more recent work.

LD
 
Thanks that's a very good reference. I like this reference that you found as it shows that very early they were adding milk, a sweetener (molasses) and wheat flour, rather similar to what we do today but without chemical leaven.

Here is a modernized version (the printing is a modern font) and also has some illustrations which were added later. This is free and is also searchable.
American Cookery 1796 - Via HathiTrust

IF you use the above link, on page 80 you find the author is using the word "cookies"..., the British then and even today use "biscuits" to refer to what we call cookies...., and in that recipe she is also using "peal ash" (sometimes found in references as Salts of Tartar) which is a chemical leaven also known as Potassium Carbonate, patented in 1790. Yet she doesn't apply the pearl ash to the corn recipes...,

LD
You're welcome.
I see the book as a must have if one is interested in cooking from that period. And actually not just for cooks. There are so many good period material culture references and other life references.

I'll check out the free version. Does it have the author's backstory and everything.
 
Forgive my ignorance but are we talking about mixing actual ash from a wood fire into something to be eaten?

Yes, it was used instead of baking powder particularly when baking powder was not to be had.

Yes indeed, as opposed to the ash remaining on the outside of a toasted, ash cake. ;)

Pearl Ash was patented after the use of potash..., and potash was simply wood ashes dissolved in water, the water siphoned off, and then allowed to evaporate, which left the residue, potash. (Ash from the pot..., of water) .

The First American Patent
which was #X000,001, July 31, 1790..., was the discovery that if the wood ashes were further subjected to heat in a kiln, and then boiled in the water, the result after evaporation was pearl ash, instead of the less pure potash.

LD
 
Forgive my ignorance but are we talking about mixing actual ash from a wood fire into something to be eaten?
Yes.
But, we aren't talking about reaching into the fireplace and getting a scoop and throwing it into what we are cooking. Generally only white wood ash would have been used and it would have been sifted to get any lumps and bits of coals out.

About the same as collecting ash to make lye for soap making.

Edit: see Dave's reply directly above mine.
 
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Yes indeed, as opposed to the ash remaining on the outside of a toasted, ash cake. ;)

Pearl Ash was patented after the use of potash..., and potash was simply wood ashes dissolved in water, the water siphoned off, and then allowed to evaporate, which left the residue, potash. (Ash from the pot..., of water) .

The First American Patent
which was #X000,001, July 31, 1790..., was the discovery that if the wood ashes were further subjected to heat in a kiln, and then boiled in the water, the result after evaporation was pearl ash, instead of the less pure potash.

LD
:thumb:
 
Great Discussion !!

I use Masa and Lard.
One of the most important lesson I learned was that flour needs to Hydrate properly, at least one hour depending on the flour. So the Masa will puff up much better when fully hydrated and less crumble. Have used this for making pancakes too.


AH YES I was wondering about saturation of the meal be it corn meal or hominy flour (masa). GREAT info.

ONE of the major problems appears to be that earlier than the 1790's, folks may have thought a super simple pone, or the above recipe bread, was for the poor, or for Indians ...:p..., so they might mention the food in a journal but not much about it..., because they as authors weren't "poor" themselves and surely wouldn't admit to LIKING the poor person or Indian food... "heaven forbid" 😧..., the dregs of society or the savages making something tasty? 🤯 EGAD!

AND some of those poor frontier folks might even be..., dare I write this???.... Scotch Irish! (btw they were referred to as Scotch Irish with a "ch" on the end back then...)
(Can't admit that THOSE PEOPLE might be producing something good....)

LD
 
(Can't admit that THOSE PEOPLE might be producing something good....)

LD
Anglos did the same silly stuff when it came to scurvy. Folks assumed that since Indians didn't suffer from scurvy from what could be seen in the Winter, it was a white guy malady..., nobody apparently asked the Indians about it until almost the 20th century if not into the 20th century. Had they asked, they would've found that a couple different, abundant plants provide the acid (the Vitamin C) that stops the scurvy, the Indians stored it and consumed it in winter, and lots of people wouldn't have died from that form of mal nutrition. But HECK what could the savages possibly know? <cue head shake and eyes roll>

(Staghorn sumac seed pods folks is one of them)

We now return to the discussion on cornbread...

LD
 
Cornbread is rather universal in many camps at living history events, and may come in all sorts of variations. I am experimenting with some "de-engineering" of the dish, to see exactly what a person on the frontier might have produced. Reason being, historic sources don't necessarily give you what "the poor" were making to eat. A lot of folks on a subsistence living style might also not be able to read, or perhaps were not able to spend money for a book that told them to use ingredients that they could not afford, or more properly may not have been available to due distance, time of the year, etc.

(The Following is SWAG Conjecture)...
The first thing that I did was removed the wheat flour. Wheat is labor intensive, and could be expensive in the days when folks crossed the Appalachian Mountains looking to homestead. I also removed the milk, as although some folks might have had an English Red-Cow for milk, that may have been a luxury. That left me with corn products, water, salt, and eggs. It would be a lot easier to take two to three laying hens West, than to take them and a cow, and the eggs would be a good source of protein.

Now they would have wood ash because they would have campfires and after the cabin was built, a hearth and fireplace. So they could've made hominy. If they were grinding dent corn or flint corn, then they could also grind the hominy. When one gets the hominy ground to a fine flour, you have Masa flour. Well known in Mexico and farther South, but I wondered IF it was known by another name on the early American frontier. SO ... I used Masa flour and eggs. I also added a bit of vinegar, because that would be easy to carry along too.

(I also know full well that I may discover that the earliest was cornpone or spoon bread, but this experimental archaeology doesn't take up too much of my time)

Here's the recipe


MASA CORN BREAD

First Recipe 03/04/2024​

2 Cups Masa Corn Flour

2 whole eggs

½ tablespoon of baking powder

2½ - 3 cups water

½ teaspoon salt.



1 Nine-inch pie tin, buttered

Oven preheated to 400°F

Wooden spoon



Mix dry ingredients. Add the eggs and mix, and finally add the water, two cups first, then as you stir the mixture, add water until the dough become more like a batter. Pour into buttered pie tin, and then place the filled pie tin into the oven. I used a buttered aluminum tin, but you could use lard or sweet oil and a cast iron skillet or a Dutch Oven... ;)

Bake for 30 minutes, perhaps longer. Remove and allow to cool before cutting.

RESULTS:
Crumb was present but loaf was still a little dough-like, and bottom had only started to brown. Be sure your oven temp is correct, and a good pre-heat is an excellent idea. Taste was very much the same as a corn tortilla or pupusa, which was to be expected. Adding salted butted improved the taste.

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So the next experiment is to see what happens without the baking powder, a 19th century product. I will do one without anything, and then one using ash from the fire, and see if any leavening happens. NOW I could use Soda Ash aka Sodium Carbonate (not Sodium BIcarbonate) but that wasn't a patented item until 1791, so a little "late" for wide use in baking in the 18th century,....,

I could try Ammonium Carbonate, aka hartshorn, but..., it's historically accurate for cookies (biscuits for you British folks) but thin cookies, not quick breads, because in a thicker mass a strong ammonia smell gets trapped, which is cooked off when baking cookies.

I also found that Sodium Bicarbonate is a 19th century thing....

And Again...., I may find that cornpone, spoonbread, or perhaps corn fritters were the simplest forms of bread, and not really documented because the folks resorting to those on a daily basis had more important things to do than keep a detailed journal, etc.

LD
I think you are wrong about the cow, cows, pigs, chickens, geese, etc were very common.
 
AH YES I was wondering about saturation of the meal be it corn meal or hominy flour (masa). GREAT info.

ONE of the major problems appears to be that earlier than the 1790's, folks may have thought a super simple pone, or the above recipe bread, was for the poor, or for Indians ...:p..., so they might mention the food in a journal but not much about it..., because they as authors weren't "poor" themselves and surely wouldn't admit to LIKING the poor person or Indian food... "heaven forbid" 😧..., the dregs of society or the savages making something tasty? 🤯 EGAD!

AND some of those poor frontier folks might even be..., dare I write this???.... Scotch Irish! (btw they were referred to as Scotch Irish with a "ch" on the end back then...)
(Can't admit that THOSE PEOPLE might be producing something good....)

LD
We still do this.
There was a time when my dad's family was laughed at for picking the muscles off the rocks at the beach for dinner.... now they are served in restaurants and often are not cheap. When I was a kid no one else we knew ate artichokes,,,, now they are common in many forms. Same with sushi..... I had access through a friend and enjoyed it,,,, most other people were aghast. Food and cooking can be a great view into culture and changes in culinary habits are thus a great view into cultural changes.
 
Forgive my ignorance but are we talking about mixing actual ash from a wood fire into something to be eaten?
Boiling the dry corn in hardwood ashes removes the outer skin from the kernel. This is how traditional hominy was made. After boiling the ash residue is rinsed away.

 
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View attachment 301325View attachment 301326

The book is available through Amazon. I have the ebook which allows one to highlight and screenshot things... I am slowly learning that there are some benefits to ebooks
Was just coming back to bring Amelia into the discussion! Her book is also one of the first to mention chemical leavening- Pearl Ash. Which she uses in a cookie recipe of all things.
Jay
 
think you are wrong about the cow, cows, .......... were very common.
Where and when?
Sure they were common once a place was established. But moving into the frontier (the location of Dave's intended op) with all of one's livestock before even establishing a cabin, or even clearing some land for it, seems a bad idea.
 
I think you are wrong about the cow, cows, pigs, chickens, geese, etc were very common.

The question wasn't how "common" or not, the animals were there no question, but going West to the frontier as a former indentured servant, they were not well laden with livestock and poultry is all. When we read journals of folks homesteading with a red cow, a couple pack horses, and poultry, maybe even a cart pulled by oxen, they are normally leaving an established homestead a -la the Boone families... for new lands. Very different situation, and a cornbread was easy for them to make, and probably very close to what we have.

The question is how simply may it be made, and the idea then is the simpler, the farther back it might go.

LD
 
Boiling the dry corn in hardwood ashes removes the outer skin from the kernel. This is how traditional hominy was made. After boiling the ash residue to rinsed away.


Thanks for the video, even just that initial picture, with the title is important.
People often seen to forget that corn has some issues nutritionally for humans. The process of nixtimalization is very important for us to be able to get any nutritional value out of it. It gets mentioned here from time to time,, but I think most people gloss right over it and forget about it.
 
Thanks for the video, even just that initial picture, with the title is important.
People often seen to forget that corn has some issues nutritionally for humans. The process of nixtimalization is very important for us to be able to get any nutritional value out of it. It gets mentioned here from time to time,, but I think most people gloss right over it and forget about it.
Its a bit amazing that Native Americans discovered this process. I make my own with sifted ashes from the wood stove.
 
Its a bit amazing that Native Americans discovered this process. I make my own with sifted ashes from the wood stove.
I can't help but wonder how long it took for Natives to realize the relationship between the process and the benefits. How many generations before someone realized that people's that didn't do this got sick and those that did didn't.
Aldo important to remember that the corn was different than the nutritional void we call corn now.
 
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