Think about this

[Stumpkiller]

In fact, we are discuss'n wether fellas would join "right now", and be will'n to wait 30-45 days for ther "goodies" to arrive.

I don't need no steenkin goodies. A e-newsletter (CHEAP! No postage or printing $) would be enough for starters. Just let me know who to send my dues to. :redthumb:

 

[Tahquamenon]

:hmm:
Come on folks. ::

The most traditional and primitive muzzleloader is the Flint-lock, not the percussion. The flintlock has many centuries behind it where the percussion had less than one. Up until BP cartridge and eventually smokeless powder development.

Really, if the in-line percussion design had caught on more in the 1800's then what do you think would be the rub today?

I'm sure something but what?

The percussion in-line and side-lock rifles are functionally identical . What's so different? They way you feel about them or the way they actually are?

I say real rub is because the In-line muzzleloader's developments, popularity and users have been allowed into the muzzleloading seasons.

More people that are not the same as me or just plain more people when I used to have the woods all to myself = I feel infringed upon. :boohoo:

Re-define what a muzzleloader is then. Ok, let's just call an inline ML a centerfire that is loaded through the muzzle and then it can be so different. Rubbish.

As far as the true traditionalist/historical folks (of which I am not one at this time) I would guess that any folks that are not traditionalist/historical must feel like an intrusion during the ML hunting seasons. Regardless of what ML design they are using or how period correct they may be.

In my view the muzzleloading seasons were not created for folks to be "period correct". What about "hunters orange"? That cannot be PC? Perhaps we should have PC seasons? Doubtful.

Let's lobby and champion for establishment of or make all ML seasons "Primitive Weapon Seasons" = Long bows and Flint-locks!

I'm also interested in the TMA and am looking forward to review and understanding of the charter and initiatives.

:m2c:

 

quote: "Re-define what a muzzleloader is then. Ok, let's just call an inline ML a centerfire that is loaded through the muzzle and then it can be so different. Rubbish."

For all "intent and design" modern inlines are "modified centerfires",....... no other muzzleloaders are thet way.

Quote: "As far as the true traditionalist/historical folks (of which I am not one at this time) I would guess that any folks that are not traditionalist/historical must feel like an intrusion during the ML hunting seasons. Regardless of what ML design they are using or how period correct they may be."

Wrong!!,.... As a "traditionalist/historian", I have no problem whatsoever with a hunter dressed in Levi's while carry'n a traditional muzzleloader,.... and,..... "wear'n hunter's orange" is the "law" while hunt'n in most states!!

BTW,.... My traditional muzzleloaders are true "convertibles", mean'n I can "switch" from flintlock to percussion (and "back" agin, in a matter of "minutes"),... I don't know if modern inlines can do thet or not!! ::

YMHS
rollingb

 

[Riley/MN]

we're work'n on a "raffle"

Hey rb, I remember a couple years ago the AMM did a buffalo hunt raffle. I recon I'd buy a ticket or two (or ten). Just a thought. Keep us posted.

 

Riley,.... Thanks fer remind'n me, it's sumpthin the TMA might consider "down the road"!! :applause: :: :thumbsup:

YMHS
rollingb

 

[wil]

I don't kmow if it is the actully the dumbing down of our socity. Most inline shooters I know bought an inline because it was a cheap way to get in on another season. I've done my best to convince them the way to go is a traditional. By saying that they can use it during the season and then they can particapate in off season primitive BP shoots. So far I've been able to convince 9 out of 10. But its an uphill struggle, and I can only disswad the ones who call before they go out and buy. :shake:. Then I start to berate them until they are sick of hering me. I also can usally put them on the strieght and narrow by letting them shoot my flintlock. It has a spell on it. :haha: Just something to think about.
Wil

"History preserved, through knowledge shared"

 

[jaybeach]

Just a question - is the TMA Constitution/Bylaws going to require that anyone owning an inline is forbidden to belong, or just forbidden to discuss them on a forum or use them in a sanctioned event?

 

Jaybe,.... It's none of the TMA's business "what" a member owns,.... but, the TMA has "no provisions" for modern inlines.

YMHS
rollingb

 

[Tahquamenon]

Quote:
Wrong!!,.... As a "traditionalist/historian", I have no problem whatsoever with a hunter dressed in Levi's while carry'n a traditional muzzleloader,.... and,..... "wear'n hunter's orange" is the "law" while hunt'n in most states!!
[/quote]

I'm glad because if it's warm enough, I often wear jeans and even shorts a field with my ML's to include side-locks.
I sure like you rollingb! :thumbsup:

Well the law is in many states that you can use an inline rifle, because it's presently defined as a muzzleloading weapon the same as everything else.

So I would imagine that either the laws are wrong, the present definition of an "inline centerfire muzzleloader" allows them to be considered muzzleloaders - in which case "legal" for use is wrong. Or the laws are in fact correct regarding in-line ML's still being defined as a muzzleloader, but we just don't like the law as it's written?

What will happen with law re-definitions for say PRB and BP only is ML makers will offer slower-twist barrels for In-line rifles to shoot BP & PRB.

I still think primitive season legislation with a Flint requirement is the only way to go to make everyone happy a field.

If you wish to have predominantly classic styled muzzleloaders a field during ML seasons, focus on Flint ignitions.

Perhaps inline makers could conjure up a Flint-Inline, but I think it would take a long time to get one right that functions as well as the more sealed percussion or primer versions today.

Not trying to pick a fight here as that's not my style. I'd swing without saying anything if that were the case. :winking:

Still sounds more like sour emotional grapes than actual science rational to me. If you want to change things, just saying "I don't like it" is not likely to get any meaningful changes that everyone can ba happy with.

"I Love Ya Man"! :: :hmm:

 

[Claude Mathis]

Well the law is in many states that you can use an inline rifle, because it's presently defined as a muzzleloading weapon the same as everything else.

Not quite the same as "everything else". You can sell a traditional muzzleloader (antique replica) between private parties, whereas an inline must go through a gun dealer. They are in the same category as center-fire weapons as far as ownership goes.

 

[Huntinfool]

I just have one point I wish to state and that is the TMA is not about bashing inlines or .308's or .270 short mag.

We are about Traditional Muzzleloaders only. We are forming an Association so like minded individuals can associate period.
As a very smart man once said if a bunch of Harley Davidson owners form a HD Association would you concern yourself with it if you own a Honda 750. No it's a Harley Davidson Club or Association. But if you had asspirations of someday owning a Harley Davidson maybe you might join so as to associate yourself with people of a like mind. What better way to learn about HD than from a bunch of guys who own and ride them!

We want to promote the heritage and use of Traditional Muzzleloaders and we don't care how many modern guns a fellow has if he wants to shoot a Traditional Muzzleloaer he is welcome in our Association.

Our guidelines describe what we consider Traditional and that is it! We all for the most part own other weapons so we can't proclaim to be holier than thou. Our guidelines will be published soon!

Please don't judge us till you know us and what we stand for!

YMH&OS,
Chuck Goodall :redthumb:
TMA President

 

Wahl I "love" you to!! :crackup: :thumbsup:

If the "law" was changed, and required the "use" of roundball only,... yore right, the modern inline industry would simply slow ther "twist" down for better roundball accuracy with hunt'n charges.

But, slow twist and roundball do not make a traditional muzzleloader. "Gimmicks" are money-makers to the modern inline industry, so we're not likely to see the "end" of inlines on the market, and they're forever change'n ignition-systems and kinds of powder thet can be stuffed down the barrel.

Flintlock, or, percussion sidelock,.... makes no difference to me, they're both traditional "open ignition systems" and subject to the same attention dur'n damp weather. Both systems were be'n used when "traditional travel" was by horse, and "traditional fire start'n" was with flint and steel.

I've got the "critters" fer ride'n,... I've got my "flint and steel" fer my fires,.... and, I got my "riflegun" to feed me.

I figure some traditional folks have "less" then me, and some traditional folks have "more" then me,.... but, "one thing" we all got,... is our fondness fer "tradition"!! ::

YMHS
rollingb

 

[Tahquamenon]

Well the law is in many states that you can use an inline rifle, because it's presently defined as a muzzleloading weapon the same as everything else.

Not quite the same as "everything else". You can sell a traditional muzzleloader (antique replica) between private parties, whereas an inline must go through a gun dealer. They are in the same category as center-fire weapons as far as ownership goes.

Actually only rifles with the option and capability of interchangeable centerfire barrels (there is not that many other than the T/C Encore and Contender) require FFL sales and transfers.

Most inlines are of a fixed muzzleloading capability only. They may have a shotgun or other ML barrel caliber options but not centerfire interchangeability.

 

[Tahquamenon]

Please include me on any information and announcements regarding the TMA.

Thanks much.

 

[sse]

rollingb fer prezeedint!!!!!!! Wauuggghhh!!!!!

 

[Livbucks]

I don't shoot modern ML. I shoot flint. I wonder what a guy from 200 years ago would say though if'n he came back today somehow and saw modern guns. I bet he would say "Why the hell are you messin with that old junk we used to use?" Those guys didn't use Traditional weapons because they had some fond nostalgia about them, they used the best there was available, period. If better came along, believe me, they used it. I really don't get the conflict that is going on. I do agree that primitive seasons should exclude modern ML. If someone wants to shoot modern, they can use them all season in regular firearms season, that should be good enough.
Imagine though if some group forms that wants to use primitive personal computers...say, a Tandy whatyamacallit model from 1979...dress up in disco era clothes and play BeeGees music at their meetings. Imagine if they started ridiculing us for using the latest in computing technology. The whole argument would be ridiculous! Get a life!
Many modern guys end up trying out a traditional gun sooner or later, and the ones that don't, probably never would have anyway.

 

[alisal]

Livbucks-Thank you The reason of my post was GUN GUYS DONT FIGHT GUN GUYS.

 

[TexiKan]

As a very smart man once said if a bunch of Harley Davidson owners form a HD Association would you concern yourself with it if you own a Honda 750. No it's a Harley Davidson Club or Association. But if you had asspirations of someday owning a Harley Davidson maybe you might join so as to associate yourself with people of a like mind. What better way to learn about HD than from a bunch of guys who own and ride them!

Yes, if the Harley Davidson Club started out like that, then that would be the expectation and qualification for membership. But if the club started out as a motorcycle club, then all cycles were acceptable. The Harley owners have the option to form their own club but cannot dictate what bikes the rest of the members should ride. Likewise, when Harley designs a new, radical, untraditional bike, will it be accepted? It's STILL a Harley and it is STILL a bike....

I see similar correlations on this topic. Likewise, as a united, strong group, there is more power when it comes to political issues, etc. The NRA is a good example. They accept ALL guns. Now take each brand, type, caliber, and other differences, and put them in their own organizations without the NRA umbrella........how influential will they be?

I am not against the formation of one's specific interests. I am for a strong, united voice.

TexiKan
-----------------
If you continue to do what you've always done, you will always get what you've always got.

 

Livbucks,....Quote: "I bet he would say "Why the hell are you messin with that old junk we used to use?" Those guys didn't use Traditional weapons because they had some fond nostalgia about them, they used the best there was available, period. If better came along, believe me, they used it. I really don't get the conflict that is going on."

Don'cha ya reckon "back then", thet unlike today's hunters them feller's "lives" depended on ther guns????

Kind'a silly to compare "weapon choices" from two completely different
"cultural eras", wouldn't you agree????

YMHS
rollingb

 

[Ohio Joe]

With the growing controversy of traditional verus in-line,we must bear in mind that the main goal of those who would wish to divide us is to deprive us of the right to own and enjoy the sport of shooting.

Then that would be the manufactures of inlines, as they are the ones who make the outlandish claims that their product is the same as a traditional muzzleloading rifle, and it obviously is not. It is those modern inline manufactures that have fueled the anti-gunners, so why support them? :hmm: