Traditions Kentucky Rifle Help

[BuffaloCarton]

I bought this rifle preassembled. I was wondering if any of these issues could be fixed? I will be using this rifle this upcoming deer season and for target shooting. Will these issues affect performance and or safety? The gap on stock joining plate is about 1/16 of an inch on the the side closest to the trigger and on the bottom at both sides. I read that the pins are supposed to be flush with the stock on both side the the left side of the gun the gap to both pins is about 1/8 of an inch, and the right side is about 1/16 of an inch to the pins for both holes. I know I can replace the pins, but unsure if the fixing the gap in the stock joining plate would screw up the alignment.
Thanks!

 

[bang]

I have a Traditions Kentucky. The gap can be filled with more brass or replace the brass with a wood plate.
Lug pins are ok below flush as long as they pick up plenty of wood.
Should you move the front stock back the pin hole in lug will have to be redrilled or possibly replaced plus the fastener holes at the muzzle piece will move so the holes would need to be moved to match barrel. The ram rod themble cut outs will have to be moved.
Just square the gap and put in more or thicker brass or wood plate is simplest fix.

 

[SDSmlf]

Welcome to the forum from North Carolina.

Carefully remove the cross pins that hold the barrel to the stock. Once barrel is removed guessing you can close up the gap between the two piece stock and brass spacer. If I’m correct, ‘fix’ will be to elongate the holes in the barrel lugs that those cross pins pass through. This something that is typically done to allow for expansion and contraction of the wood.

Cross pin length is in my opinion personal preference. Just make sure once you gently get them out of the stock the first that you radius the ends a bit so they don’t chip the wood when you remove them in the future.

Let us know what happens when you remove the cross pins and someone will help you correct your issue.

 

[russellshaffer]

I bought an old 1976 CVA Kentucky that was built from a kit. It has that same space in the joining plate and being that it is pretty roughly assembled anyhow, I just slid the forend piece ahead and filled the gap with wood putty. Pushed it back together and stained it and it doesn't look too bad at all. It shoots very well so I am just going to leave well enough alone. I may end up selling it very cheap or donating it for a raffle prize at a rondy.

 

[BuffaloCarton]

Thanks for replying so fast! I’ll keep y’all updated!

 

[mooman76]

I don't see the gaps hurting performance or saftey. These kits are at the low end of the scale but they are still good starter guns and usually shoot very accurate once you find the best load. Most people like to do their little things to make their guns look better or how they want them so by all means, do what you like.

 

[BuffaloCarton]

Alright. I was able to get the pins out easily! No chipping. Man was it rough under the barrel. It looked like a kindergartner with not enough sleep put this together. Lots of rough spots and tons of metal fragments everywhere. I was able to join the pieces of stocks together with no force at all. Just slid down into place. This, I think I’ll have to elongate the holes in the barrel lugs as @SDSmlf said. Also, I was able to rummage around and find some 3mm pins that fit perfectly . The craftsmanship has me concerned about the guts of the lock. I’ll have to look at that next.

 

[SDSmlf]

I think I’ll have to elongate the holes in the barrel lugs

You don’t mention how you intend to elongate the holes, but DO NOT use something like Dremel. Use a rattail file and go slow. Elongate until you have a good fit between the stock pieces and the brass spacer, then go at least 1/16” to 3/32” more. Wood expands and contracts. Just for a visual, here is a picture out of one George Shumway’s books on what tI ou are trying to accomplish.

I’ve seen guns where amateur and commercial builders alike skip this step, and then people wonder why their point of impact changes over time as the wood stock naturally expand and contract over time, putting pressure on the barrel, sometimes to the point where the wood cracks.

 

[BuffaloCarton]

You don’t mention how you intend to elongate the holes, but DO NOT use something like Dremel. Use a rattail file and go slow. Elongate until you have a good fit between the stock pieces and the brass spacer, then go at least 1/16” to 3/32” more. Wood expands and contracts. Just for a visual, here is a picture out of one George Shumway’s books on what tI ou are trying to accomplish.
View attachment 35242
I’ve seen guns where amateur and commercial builders alike skip this step, and then people wonder why their point of impact changes over time as the wood stock naturally expand and contract over time, putting pressure on the barrel, sometimes to the point where the wood cracks.

Thanks for the info and photo! This helps a lot. I will be working on this Sunday. Do you file just horizontally or should you file a hair vertically also?

 

[Grenadier1758]

Horizontally only.

 

[87TT]

Don't forget to elongate the nose cap screw holes or you can get a gap on the wood where it connects. They have to be counter sunk too. Just that if you move the front stock back, it affects the front of the stock too.

 

[bang]

A filler would be so much simpler.

 

[87TT]

I have one that I got back in the 70's. It was a kit and percussion. A guy got it for Christmas and sold it to me un assembled for $50. Had it for a while and put it together. Then I met a guy that had one in flintlock but wanted percussion. So we swapped barrels and locks. Problem was, the flint barrel was over a 1/4 of an inch longer. I slotted the holes and made a wider spacer out of brass. There was only so much I could do with the nose cap that hold the fore stock to the barrel.

 

[SDSmlf]

A filler would be so much simpler.

How do you allow for stock’s wood expanding and contraction without slotting the barrel tenons?

 

[87TT]

Those two piece stocks have so much play in them, I don't think that's an issue. At least never has for mine.

 

[SDSmlf]

Those two piece stocks have so much play in them, I don't think that's an issue. At least never has for mine.

The stock changed enough to open up a 1/16” gap on the OP’s gun. Why not correct it to look as good as possible? If you are going to play with muzzleloaders you should learn how to maintain them and make repairs, at least in my opinion.

 

[87TT]

I guess but it probably was always that opened up from the beginning. They pre drilled the underlugs at he factory and it may have had that gap all along. I doubt they checked it. (not the worst thing I've seen on them). My lugs are slotted. The nose cap screws to the barrel through the wood. So when you move the stock, you have to slot something up there too. Then the whole fore stock can and does "move" apart with handling and use. I have another two piece stocked gun that has a brass band that just covers the gap and holds the stock in line (no pins between stocks like CVA) I looks worse but is actually more secure.

 

[Grenadier1758]

I have one that I got back in the 70's. It was a kit and percussion. A guy got it for Christmas and sold it to me un assembled for $50. Had it for a while and put it together. Then I met a guy that had one in flintlock but wanted percussion. So we swapped barrels and locks. Problem was, the flint barrel was over a 1/4 of an inch longer. I slotted the holes and made a wider spacer out of brass. There was only so much I could do with the nose cap that hold the fore stock to the barrel.

Its the under barrel lugs that hold the stock to the barrel. The nose cap shouldn't be holding on to the barrel.

 

[87TT]

Ah, but it does. Two screws through the nose cap (under the ram rod) and stock into the barrel.

 

[2 shots]

howdy, just finished reworking a cva kentucky pistol. one thing i did was to replace the cva heavy cast nose cap with a rivet [ or glue] on sheet brass one from t.o.w. for $10.00 . i added a pin tenon up front to replace the screws. it was like i removed a half pound from the front of the pistol and looked better also. i made it inch and a half long for the pistol but you could leave it as is [ 2 inch] for the rifle. no need to drill, tap or counter sink and makes the balance much better . just a thought.