Trouble Hitting Target

[trent/OH]

On a used gun I'd throw some suspicion toward the pistol. Are both sights nice and tight? Is the nipple worn out? Is the stock simply too big for your hand?
Is the barrel tightly attached to the stock? Is the muzzle nicked, dinged, or not squarely cut? Is the barrel actually straight?
There are a number of things that could be wrong before your finger even touches the trigger.

 

[Grumpa]

and fishmusic.

"Trust your wobble". As long as you keep the sights aligned, your shots will hit in a close group.

When you aim the gun as Gus has described, you are "aiming the gun with your feet", and it will be supported by your skeletal structure moreso than the muscles. The more you practice this, the sooner it will become natural.

Get a copy of Gil Hebard's The Pistol Shooter's Treasury. It is written for modern target pistols,but the principles it teaches will hold true for any gun you are shooting.

 

[don hepler]

I have a CVA 50 cal. that shoots excellent groups at 25 yards. I am pretty good will pistols, and when younger I used to shoot competitive matches.

Mine has an excellent trigger. I can not shoot a pistol with a lot of creep, or a lot of trigger pull weight, and expect good results. I am pretty sure the patch that I use is at least .018. I can only think of one gun, that I have, that uses a thinner patch.

 

[Khufu]

I have a CVA Mountain pistol, it is VERY accurate. I can easily hit pop cans at 50 yards.
if yours is not shooting straight, you should look for something grossly wrong. I have shot 25 to 50 gr of ffg, .490 and .495 balls as long as they are tight going down, groups were tight on paper.

 

[fishmusic]

Sights are tight and barrel is tight to the stock. I will get some new nipple as I have seen other posts recommending that. Thanks for the advice.

 

[fishmusic]

Nice looking pistol. I can't get any tighter than .010 patch. I will look at that issue after looking at the simpler solutions.

 

[don hepler]

It is harder to load a pistol, than a rifle. If you put your pistol in a loading stand, it will make it easier. However, using a loading stand, also increases the amount of pressure on the stock. It is easy to crack a pistol stock, when it is being loaded, in a stand. With all that being said, I still like to get a secure grip on the pistol and using a wooden mallet, load a tight ball/patch combination. Once the cloth compresses it will go down the barrel easier.

 

[crockett]

Does it look like this: http://www.bing.com/images/search?...a851e3cd5dded5a55f9749ca41bc880eo0&ajaxhist=0 If so- I have the same pistol. I started with a .010 patch and was getting 6" groups. I moved to a .018 patch and got 1" groups. I use 37 gr fffg.

 

[fishmusic]

Yes, that is the same pistol as mine. I will be investigating the simple fixes first. That I can't load with .015 patch concerns me when others use even thicker ones.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

1) Pistols go by a completely different set of rules than a rifle. Try backing your powder charge down to 25, 20 or even 15 grains. Many pistols really do not need a super tight patch/ball combo.

2) Little wiggles make a BIG difference. Gripping the gun too tight and becoming shaky causes big problems with a short barrel.

3) Get a grip; the way you hold your pistol is a really important factor in the way it behaves. My pistol will not shoot anywhere to point of aim unless I take about 10 seconds to ensure my drip is perfect. Also, try locking your elbows. if you can get your pistol to rock less, or at least consistently, you will be in good shape. The gun will start to move the instant the ball does.

4) Set triggers are your friend. Hard to throw off your aim with excessive human input when its not possible. The single set trigger on my pistol is safe and in good shape, but is adjusted light enough to go off with a stiff rap of the palm on the tang area of the gun. I touch it and the gun goes off. I only **** the hammer after the trigger is set and I am at the firing line.

5) Speed *can be* your friend. Speeding up your percussion lock will help more than you think. My L&R John Bailes is a rocket of a lock, with a very short hammer throw. All of that=very short lock time.

 

[Zonie]

Yes, that is the same pistol as mine. I will be investigating the simple fixes first. That I can't load with .015 patch concerns me when others use even thicker ones.

Most, if not all of the posts you see which talk about using thicker patches are speaking of rifle loads (or using undersize balls in a pistol).

Rifles take large powder loads which produce very high breech pressures.

Also, many of the rifle barrels have rather deep rifling grooves that need a thick patch to seal off the powder gasses.

These high pressures need a very tight fitting patch that completely fills the grooves so patch thicknesses of .015-.020 are often used.

With a rifle it is easy to get a good grip on the barrel. It is also easy to rest the butt of the gun on the ground so any hard pounding that might be needed with a short starter to get the patched ball started is of no consequence.

Pistols on the other hand use light powder charges. Most of the factory made pistols have fairly shallow grooves.
The gun is difficult to get a good hold on it and resting the butt of the grip against hard things is a good way to crack or break the stock.

These things make using a fairly thin patch like a .010 (or even slightly less) not only possible, but recommended (by me).
The important thing is the patch should be at least as thick as the rifling grooves are deep.

 

[Grizzly Adams]

My pistol probably has a somewhat loose bore, because a .440" ball from a Lee mold and some 17 thou pillow ticking yields a firm fitting combo. A little thicker patch is able to crush a little, which may help with sealing.

 

[Artificer]

Great post, I'm copying this to my computer! Your pie chart too. I don't have a pistol yet but just wrote the exam to get my license.
Jamie

Thank you for the kind words and best wishes to you on pistol shooting as well.

Gus,

Excellent tips. Where do you find nipple protectors? I have tried leather from old boots but couldn't figure out how to keep it in place. Makes dry firing a three handed effort!

Sorry it took a bit to answer, but I really had to think about this as it has been a long time since I dry fired with a percussion rifle and had to remember how I used to do it. I do not know if anyone makes a commercial nipple protector for a standard ¼ x 28 rifle/pistol nipple.

Back in the “Darker Ages” of the 1970’s, I used an old nipple for dry firing. Then I cut a thick piece of leather that fit inside the hammer recess and used black/electrician’s tape to hold it in place. I already had leather crafting hole punches that cut nice small circles of leather for that.

Nowadays, I would look for some plastic tubing in hardware or craft stores that fit over the old nipple and cut it off a bit above the nipple to act as a cushion. There may also be some electrical caps or other plastic parts that would fit over the nipple tight enough to hold and not fall off. I would suggest taking a nipple to the hardware or craft store and see what may work.

Gus

 

[Tom Compton]

1/4" gas hose from auto parts store cut to length needed.
TC

 

[don hepler]

Faucet washer will fit, if you find the old style.

 

[crockett]

Good point, one thing that never gets discussed is seating a ball in a single shot pistol. The rifle is easy because there is a butt plate resting on the ground but the grip on the pistol seems to want to "kick out" when you seat the ball. I do a certain amount of range shooting so I built a stand similar to what I've seen other guys using, it holds ten balls and has a depression for the handle with a stop to help in seating the ball. In any event the .018 is hard to seat but the accuracy really does improve. As I said I was getting 6" groups and the only thing I did was change the patch and the groups went to 1". Huge difference.

 

[FishDFly]

Either one works fine.

You can dry fire in your house at the light switches, dry firing does wonders.

Find the book, "The Pistol Shooter's Treasury" by Gil Hebard, it is the best book on pistol shooting.

Look at the Bullseye Shooting website, a wealth of information.

Handle the pistol for 15 minutes each day and become familiar with it.

Back down on the powder charge.

There are no secrets to pistol shooting, folks think there. It takes time and hard work to shooting a pistol well.

 

[Khufu]

I thought everyone loaded a single shot pistol by placing the butt against the inguinal area of the groin or thigh and rammed the ball down with the muzzle away from you.

 

[FishDFly]

Nope.

Not allowed in NMLRA sanctioned matches and most other places.

 

[Khufu]

its OK, the bunnies and gophers promised not to report me! besides, they are too busy trying to get out of my way. I am sure they would whine about the way I load my musket too, tear open the cartridge and pour some powder in the pan, close the frizzen THEN pour in the main charge and ram the cartridge home. some say its unsafe, but it IS how it was done. and everyone I hunt with loads their pistol against their body when ramming down the ball. we do have enough smarts to watch where the muzzle is pointed and our pistols to not get banged up, and we do not need a bench or contraption to load in the field.