USFA Cap and Ball Remington

[B. Miller]

I understand that U.S. Firearms is going to produce the 1858 Remington revolver under license from Remington. It is kind of strange that Remingtons are now being made in the old Colt factory. I would like to know if anyone has seen one of these yet or if any have been released yet?
Thanks
Bruce

 

[renovato]

That's news to me. It strikes me odd that they need a license from Remington though, as the patent on the gun expired long ago. Have you heard of what their expected price range will be?

 

[thewho66]

I cant answer any of your questions because like you I wanted to know whats up. So I went to remingtons web site and could only find a page in the catalog you can down load. No prices and no model numbers. There was a web site to go to but it will not allow pasage. So I went to usaf web site and got nuthing as well. I hope someone can get some info.

John

 

[rebel727]

It was posted on the SASS Wire awhile back as being confirmed as to MSRP for the 1875 at $1,895 and the 1858 at $1,495. Unfortunately SASS doesn't archive posts so don't know about production dates.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

Guns of the Old West lists the M.S.R.P. as being $1595.00 for the C&B revolver. This seems ridiculously high for one of these guns. Ought to be interesting to see how much business they do.

 

[bigbore442001]

I almost got light headed looking at the price.

 

[mazo kid]

Guns of the Old West lists the M.S.R.P. as being $1595.00 for the C&B revolver. This seems ridiculously high for one of these guns. Ought to be interesting to see how much business they do.

I agree, the price DOES seem to be high. Maybe they are anticipating sales to be slow, or tooling need be made/purchased? I have one of their Colt SAAs and the quality, fit and finish is first rate. However the price for that gun is ~$600 less than the proposed price for the new Remington.

 

[renovato]

Yeah, that does seem pretty high. For about the same money, one could buy the finely crafted version made by Feinwerkbau. That's one sweet and smooth operating piece.

 

[B. Miller]

I too thought the price was out of this world when I first saw it. That is why I asked figuring someone might have a real world price. The last price I saw on a Pedersoli Remingtion or Rodgers and Spencer was for about nine bills. Seven hundred more for one of the two existing best is hard to justify.

 

[rebel727]

You can get a shootable original for less money.

 

[kaac1221]

You're right! I have two in shooting condition and I have less than $1200 each in them.

Only thing is I don't shoot them that much because they are originals. But $1400 plus for what is really a repro? Well..............

 

[mykeal]

How much is an original, new-in-box, never been turned or fired 1858 Remington worth (if you could find one)?

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

But this isn't an original. It's not even made by Remington. And it doesn't cost $1400, it will cost $1595. :shocked2: That is a lot of extra money to get the Remington name stamped on a repo. I think I'd rather buy a Uberti and put the savings toward a custom rifle or fowler. That $1595 price tag equals a cynical rip-off in my book! :cursing:

 

[Poor Private]

Yep, they are goin to have trouble pushing thier inventory. For $1600, I can outfit myself for a civil war impression- including the cost of a long gun, and even have a few bucks left for gas money.

 

[mykeal]

Russ and Poor Private -

I understand you guys don't want to spend that much money for a USFA Remington - I don't either. But really, the comparison of prices between a well used, even 70% condition antique Remington and a NIB USFA Remington is apples and oranges. A more meaningful comparison would be between guns in the same condition, in my opinion.

So, how much is an original, new-in-box, never been turned or fired 1858 Remington worth (if you could find one)?

 

[kaac1221]

mykeal,

I believe you are inaccurate in your evaluation of the point made by rebel 727 in his post. :nono:

Nothing was mentioned about a nice bright shiny new-in-the-box original Remington. It is my opinion that rebel's point was(correct me if I'm wrong rebel!) that given a choice, for the price,one would rather buy a shootable original, that would appreciate in value, than waste money on what is for all pracical purposes a reproduction.

And speaking of apples and oranges,it would appear to me that your introduction, into the discussion, of an original pristine, unturned original Remington is really tossing the proverbial orange into the apple cart! :wink:

Just my humble opinion............. :grin:

Anyhow, have a great day, mykeal! Good to chat with ya'. Gotta love this forum!

Dryball

 

[mykeal]

I am aware that nobody else introduced the NIB original as an option. I am also aware that rebel's point was that he'd rather spend his money on an original in shootable condition than purchase a new USFA for the same amount. I did not miss his point. I think I clearly acknowledged that in my first sentence, and I agreed with the position.

However, you're not buying the same thing. They are comparable in price but not in anything else; one is used and has all the issues associated with age, wear and fatigue, and the other has none of those. Realistically, which one is going to last longer given the same usage?

I have no problem with someone saying he'd rather spend his money on a used original gun than a new replica. I have a problem with implying they are the same value for that money; some in this thread have done that, and they clearly are not. To compare value (NOT worth, which is subjective) you must have items in the same condition, because value assumes future usage in it's criteria.

And by the way, nobody has yet answered the question: how much is an original, new-in-box, never been turned or fired 1858 Remington worth (if you could find one)?

 

[Poor Private]

Obviously your not going to get an answer,it may be cause this thread is not about a NIB original Remy. And why muddy up this thread by changing the topic? If your interested in the cost start a new thread. Because maybe the ones who can answer your question may not be interested in what this thread is about. And don't see your question.

 

[rebel727]

I am aware that nobody else introduced the NIB original as an option. I am also aware that rebel's point was that he'd rather spend his money on an original in shootable condition than purchase a new USFA for the same amount. I did not miss his point. I think I clearly acknowledged that in my first sentence, and I agreed with the position.

However, you're not buying the same thing. They are comparable in price but not in anything else; one is used and has all the issues associated with age, wear and fatigue, and the other has none of those. Realistically, which one is going to last longer given the same usage?

I have no problem with someone saying he'd rather spend his money on a used original gun than a new replica. I have a problem with implying they are the same value for that money; some in this thread have done that, and they clearly are not. To compare value (NOT worth, which is subjective) you must have items in the same condition, because value assumes future usage in it's criteria.

And by the way, nobody has yet answered the question: how much is an original, new-in-box, never been turned or fired 1858 Remington worth (if you could find one)?

OK, which one is going to give you the most use for the money USFA or Uberti or even Pietta? None of them are made by Remington. Is looking at the top flat on the barrel and reading E. Remington and sons Ilion N.Y. on a repro worth 1200 bucks or so? I think not, a repro is still a repro no matter how it's marked. As for your question a NIB Remington(did they even come in boxes?)would be a name your own price kinda deal but I fail to see the connection. I wish I'd kept my original now, Jeez they've gone up in the last ten years.

 

[mykeal]

OK, which one is going to give you the most use for the money USFA or Uberti or even Pietta? None of them are made by Remington.

I think I'm beginning to see the problem. The answer to your question is, by far, USFA. Yes, it's not made by Remington. But USFA guns are light years better than Uberti or Pietta. If you're lumping USFA into the same category as Uberti and Pietta and then comparing the category to Remington, I can see why you feel the way you do. You need to get your hands on a USFA revolver.

Is looking at the top flat on the barrel and reading E. Remington and sons Ilion N.Y. on a repro worth 1200 bucks or so? I think not, a repro is still a repro no matter how it's marked.

If all you were getting for $1200 was the stamp, I'd agree completely. But you get a great deal more than that. USFA's guns are very fine quality handguns. It's not just another repro by any standard. I'm not trying to claim it's a genuine Remington, but it's certainly not 'just another repro'.

As for your question a NIB Remington(did they even come in boxes?)would be a name your own price kinda deal but I fail to see the connection. I wish I'd kept my original now, Jeez they've gone up in the last ten years.

Yes, they came in boxes. Wood boxes, 25, 50 or 100 to the box. One of those boxes is probably worth more than a USFA Remington.

The connection: In order to afford a genuine Remington you (and I, and just about everyone else) have to compromise and buy a used gun. To get a new gun you'd have to make a different compromise: a replica, not a genuine Remington at all. Either choice is a compromise because the most desired combination of new and genuine is out of reach price wise; something desired must be given up to get the gun.

So, what's the price of the compromise? For $1600 or so USFA gives you a very high quality handgun that looks and feels like an 1858 Remington New Army. For something about ten times that you can get the real thing. Except, of course, you can't shoot it, like you can the USFA replica. Or you can spend the $1600 and get a genuine article that is a lot closer to being worn out than the new replica. And you can shoot it if you want to, but it won't take as many rounds as the replica.

I'm not saying you're making the wrong choice. I do feel that you have misunderstood what a USFA Remington really is. Not that it will change your mind or anything - you're not wrong, so there's no need to change it. But it would be nice if you could accept the USFA Remington as a better choice than the previous other options.