Warm/Hot water when cleaning and flash rust

[renegadehunter]

Just wanted to pass on a recent experience.
Every time I've ever cleaned with water that was any warmer than tepid I have experienced seeing flash rust on the first dry patch I run down the bore. (Brit, I know how trivial you feel flash rust is).
Quite a while back I remember reading someone say that they wondered if the reason some always see it and others don't may be because of additives to city water.
A week ago or so I went shooting. When I came home to clean, I had a jug of distilled water on hand, been meaning to try it and see if there was any difference.
I heated it up to boiling. Used half with a couple drops of dish soap to clean, then the other half for a rinse.
No flash rust this time. Only once so not a super remarkable experiment, but I'll be trying it again the next time I shoot. I just like how much quicker the barrel dries when I can use hot.

 

[Britsmoothy]

I think you are onto something.
Thank you

 

[SDSmlf]

Just wanted to pass on a recent experience.
Every time I've ever cleaned with water that was any warmer than tepid I have experienced seeing flash rust on the first dry patch I run down the bore. (Brit, I know how trivial you feel flash rust is).
Quite a while back I remember reading someone say that they wondered if the reason some always see it and others don't may be because of additives to city water.
A week ago or so I went shooting. When I came home to clean, I had a jug of distilled water on hand, been meaning to try it and see if there was any difference.
I heated it up to boiling. Used half with a couple drops of dish soap to clean, then the other half for a rinse.
No flash rust this time. Only once so not a super remarkable experiment, but I'll be trying it again the next time I shoot. I just like how much quicker the barrel dries when I can use hot.

The main filter on our waterline as it enters the house is a carbon wrapped type rated at 5 microns. The water at the kitchen sink goes through an under counter filter rated at 0.5 microns. I do NOT see flash rust when I use hot water to clean my barrels.

 

[Carbon 6]

The main filter on our waterline as it enters the house is a carbon wrapped type rated at 5 microns. The water at the kitchen sink goes through an under counter filter rated at 0.5 microns. I do NOT see flash rust when I use hot water to clean my barrels.

If you have the ability, do a pre-filter and post filters PH test. I'm curious if the filters change the PH of the water.
I'm told a carbon filter will raise the PH, but I have not confirmed it.

 

[Prairieofthedog]

With my water I got Flash Rust all the time. That is with super hot water,went to tepid and no problems.

 

[SDSmlf]

If you have the ability, do a pre-filter and post filters PH test. I'm curious if the filters change the PH of the water.
I'm told a carbon filter will raise the PH, but I have not confirmed it.

Something I could do in the future. Pre-pre-filtered water line is temporarily capped right now. Running a waterline to the garden and in no real hurry. Need to complete before I start spring planting.

 

[tenngun]

I use hot but not boiling, or cold or cool, or warm.I’ve not seen or at least never noted any flash rust

 

[hawkeye2]

I posted a while back on another thread about the difference in water. I used to get flash rust when I lived in town and after I moved here and am using well water with no additives I no longer see it. I haven't changed my cleaning regimen and the water only goes through sediment filters with the final one being 5 micron with carbon. Other than that it's as it comes from the ground.

 

[GregLaRoche]

I am a believer in flash rust. I’ve seen it happen many times on mild steel. Rust is a chemical reaction between iron and oxygen. Heat speeds up the reaction. Perhaps the amount on the inside of a barrel is insignificant. I don’t know, but try to avoid it. Also, I see no need for boiling water. Warm enough so it’s comfortable to work with, but not boiling. Perhaps some barrels are made of alloys that resist rust more than others.

 

[Art Caputo]

The flash rust is caused by iron and various derivatives(iron in combination with other compounds in the water), and influenced by the degree of filtration, I was raised in what was once an iron mining town. After a rain storm the black steaks of fine iron ran down the sides of our streets. As kids, we would take a magnet and easily fill a jar with pure iron ore. Our well water was unfiltered, and you could pull fine iron particles out of a bucket of water with a magnet. Needless to say, the appearance of the orange/brown flash rust was a very common sight, particularly in sinks, bathtubs, etc, and eventually, always when cleaning muzzleloaders with hot tap water.

 

[Ames]

I live with a dehumidifier in the basement of a 1800's farm house. I get a never ending supply of water from it. Sits over a 100 gallon stock tank that I pump out once a month. Going to have to experiment with it I think.

 

[N.Y. Yankee]

OK I have city water and did get flash rusting when I tried to use hot water so I changed to just warm water and no rusting. All you need to do to dry the bore is run a couple of patches through it slowly and then push one down into the patent breech if you have one. Oil the same way and you're good. The only thing hot water ever did for me was burn my fingers.

 

[Notchy Bob]

Just wanted to pass on a recent experience.
Every time I've ever cleaned with water that was any warmer than tepid I have experienced seeing flash rust on the first dry patch I run down the bore. (Brit, I know how trivial you feel flash rust is).
Quite a while back I remember reading someone say that they wondered if the reason some always see it and others don't may be because of additives to city water.
A week ago or so I went shooting. When I came home to clean, I had a jug of distilled water on hand, been meaning to try it and see if there was any difference.
I heated it up to boiling. Used half with a couple drops of dish soap to clean, then the other half for a rinse.
No flash rust this time. Only once so not a super remarkable experiment, but I'll be trying it again the next time I shoot. I just like how much quicker the barrel dries when I can use hot.

I think you are onto something.
Thank you

I think you are on to something, too.

I heat water for gun cleaning in my coffee maker, which is a Mr. Coffee brand. At the suggestion of a friend, I started using distilled or purified water for making coffee (okay, I'll admit it. I'm a coffee snob). This costs all of 89 cents per gallon at the local supermarket. It really does make better coffee, but an unexpected side benefit is that there is no mineral deposit in the coffeemaker. I haven't needed to clean Mr. Coffee in about five years, even with making two pots full every day. I use the same purified water for cleaning guns, so it won't leave the mineral deposit in Mr. Coffee. I have not noticed flash rust when cleaning guns.

Good call, RenegadeHunter!

Notchy Bob

 

[Whitworth]

FWIW, Chlorine is very corrosive. City water may contribute to the problem.

 

[toot]

thank you for the post.

 

[renegadehunter]

I definitely think it’s the city additives, but combined with the heat. I can’t even use warm or I get flash rust in both my TC renegade and my FIL’s CVA mountain rifle. Room temp or cooler and I don’t see flash rust.
Something else I just thought of. A couple months ago I was at deer camp. I had brought tap water from home. Did some shooting with the CVA. Cleaned it at camp with the cold tap water I had brought. When done I set the barrel on the wall tent stove we had going, figured it would start drying the barrel while I did a couple other things. Came back ten minutes later and started running dry patches...flash rust. I never see it with cold tap water, but by setting the wet bore on the stove and heating up the water still in it, I ended up with flash rust.
I have a Brita filtering container, I’ll have to try water ran through it next. Would save having to remember to buy distilled at the store if it works. Notchy Bob, we use the brita water for our coffee, flat tastes better than city water.
I use animal grease as a patch lube and find that hot water removes it much quicker since it melts. I haven’t had trouble getting the bore dry when using tepid or cold, and it removes fouling just fine, hot just flat dries faster. Saves time and some patches. So the only real reasons I’m wanting to use hot is the faster drying and melting out the grease.
Just found it interesting that distilled seems to have resolved the flash rust from appearing.

 

[Boatncamp]

I have to think that the chlorine in city water is huge contributor to the flash rust issue.

I use well water filtered through a PUR filter in my Keurig and have never had to clean it or had any problems with it. Shower heads etc all get clogged up with minerals from my well water. Brita filters don't pull much out of the water. I would recommend distilled or a PUR or Zero water filter for cleaning and drinking. Never noticed any flash rust with the hot water I use.

I don't remember flash rust being talked about 50 years ago. There has been a huge migration of people into cities over the past 50 years and a push to have city water everywhere. My town is putting in city water into a huge area currently because it helps with developers wanting to bring in businesses as they don't want to have to deal with well water etc.

Just my thoughts.

 

[hawkeye2]

Distilled water is great and cheap. I use in in my car batteries, mix it with antifreeze and use it in my steam locomotive. Do not ever use deionized water! It is not the same as distilled water and can really cause issues. Repeated use will actually destroy the boiler for a model steam engine.

 

[XVIIc Wheelock]

Back in the day, most probably doused the barrel in a stream, river or lake on the go...most likely cold. Doubt most hunters, etc., took the time to heat water to cleanup spend BP !!!

 

[Carbon 6]

Something I could do in the future. Pre-pre-filtered water line is temporarily capped right now. Running a waterline to the garden and in no real hurry. Need to complete before I start spring planting.

Just do it when you change the filter, put a bucket under the housing and crack the shut off valve.