Weird blown patches

[Black Jaque Janaviac]

Today I shot some of the pillow ticking patches with a light charge and they came out looking fine. So damage may have been caused during firing.

I also shot two other patch materials with a full charge. Some linen which is a tad thinner than the pillow ticking. That showed patch damage around the circumference of the ball where it contacts the bore.

Also tried 100% cotton drill. That held together the best. Patches looked fine.

However. . . No matter what I tried, the groups were the same miserable 4-5 inches at 50 yards.

 

[TreeMan]

Someone gave me a box of old muzzleloading stuff a while back. There was a nice brand new short starter in there with a built in bore protector. Using that short starter instead of my old one done the exact same thing to my patches as what yours is doing. This new one is way too big for my bore. It was holding my patch at the muzzle and forcing the ball through the patch. I had one ball go completely through and roll down the barrel. I went back to using my old starter with the smaller diameter shaft and all is well.

 

[Grenadier1758]

I cut my patches at the muzzle. I don't have excess patch material for the short starter to catch up on and tear up the patches.

You have stopped the tearing through of the patch. Now its time to try to determine why the accuracy has fallen off. Has anything else changed other than the patching? Powder changed? Powder charge changed? Brand of ball changed? Lubricant changed? Wiping between shots? Not wiping between shots? Sudden windy day? Clouds and sun changing the view of the sights?

What was the specific loading procedure when you, @Black Jaque Janaviac, were getting the 1.5" groups? Type of powder, grains, patch material and thickness, ball diameter and bore wiping procedure. Also any rest or changes to the rest.

Have the sights gotten loose in their dovetails? Anything else become loose?

 

[longcruise]

If the short starter is the problem a smaller diameter starter is a solution.

 

[rickystl]

The material also looks to have a sheen to it. Possibly not 100% cotton and it does appear to have a loose weave.

I remember once back in the early 1980's using some ticking someone gave me. Did the same thing. Never had the problem before. Turned out the ticking was a slightly looser weave, and had polyester blended in. Switched to using all cotton and the problem stopped.

Rick

 

[renegadehunter]

Try just burning a bit of your patch material with a lighter to make sure it really is 100% cotton. If it does any melting rather than just burning to ash, then it has something else blended with it.

 

[hanshi]

I'd consider using heavier, thicker material. Polish the rifle crown using sandpaper and your thumb and you should be able to load tighter loads fairly easily. Stronger patches better resist damage caused by loading. It sounds sort of "counter intuitive" to say a thicker patch and polished crown works better; but your patch material isn't tough enough to stand up to the seating force.

 

[Col. Batguano]

If you're really curious you could load one normally and then pull it. See if it's split. I would put powder under it just in case you can't get a good grab on the ball with the puller. At least then you could shoot it out.

 

[Flinty Scot]

I'll second both coning and cutting the patch at the muzzle, as helping me avoid a lot of similar loading problems.
c, Could you have some leading of the bore, along with the split patches?

I would have sworn mine was cleaned to near-new brightness - until I put bore scope down it and saw the patchy white deposits. I wrapped a .45 brush (mine's .50) w/ 0000 steel wool and saturated it with Hoppes. A few passes, with a few minutes soak after the first pass has cleared most of it. It goes against my "do it traditionally" mindset, but I'm going to watch for the white blooms, and reach for Hoppes if they come back.
(Can't figure how it leads through a 0.15-0.18 greased patch ???)

 

[Col. Batguano]

I for one am glad that worked for you. I was afraid you were leading in to yet another; "My brush is stuck in my bore. Now what do I do?" thread.

 

[PADave]

Possibly too dry and might try a threaded short starter with a near full bore ball started jag. I'm I big fan

 

[necchi]

Easy starting. bore and crown are smooth. The material is old, but it has been sitting in the closet, clean and dry. It was not exposed to lube until minutes before shooting.

View attachment 69876View attachment 69877

I don't log in too much anymore,, but these photo's plainly show the fabric is not 100% cotton. It's not your fault,, they are lying/deceiving us more and more about fabric content. Cotton burns, polyesters "melt",, it's a simple test done when someone doesn't have a predetermined result in mind. Even fabric listed as 100% Cotton/Algodon has "guide" fibers of poly. Scrap/ find another use for the fabric and move on,,

 

[oldwood]

To eliminate the short starter tip damaging a patch , use a simple early style short starter w/o a metal tip. Any cal. from .54 down , use a 5" tipless 5/16" dowel , hickory , or some other good hardwood drilled and glued into a palm saver . The trick to prevent starter dowels from splitting on the edges , is to dress a little draft on the edge of the dowel so it always contacts the ball with the center of the starter dowel. I quit using tipped short starters back in the early 1980's. Was shooting a lot of iron targets with many shots in a match , and found they're just not needed for patched round balls. When shooting .58 and bigger , moved up to 3/8" and 1/2" dowels . Shotgun and muskets using wads require can use a near bore diameter metal tip to straighten wads in the bore. Beyond that , the only metal tip I use is on my ramrod. ....oldwood