Whats so great about real black powder?

[Sharp Shooter]

I could not get the links to work!

 

[paulvallandigham]

The original provision that classified Black Powder as an explosive was added to the Crime Control Bill of 1968 on the floor of the Senate, when it was considering a bill that had been in committee for several years. It was just after the bombing of a lab at the Univ. of Wisconsin, that killed one student, and the Senator falsely claimed that the bomb had been made from black powder. In truth, it was a van loaded with Amonium Nitrate, and fuel Oil, similar to the bomb used to destroy the Mirah Building in Oklahoma City several years ago. But, Black Powder got the blame and no one challenged him on it, and it became the law. The latest homeland security laws were passed with the same presumptions and ignorance. BP pipe bombs have been used in murders, and therefore there is some desire to regulate sales. We would all feel better about it the registration requirements if any of this information was ever actually used to solve a crime, ie., to identify the bomber. To date, I know of no such case. In fact, after the Oklahoma bombing, the Senate held hearing about adding identifying taggents to the powder, and even to the anhydrous Ammonium fertilizers, as a way to trace the explosive to the buyer, but found it was unfeasible. So, the end result of all these regulations provides no additional security to the public, but makes it next to impossible for law abiding gun owners to buy black powder from local dealers.

I suspect that is the result that the people who voted for the bill wanted. If you are not a member of the NRA, you aren't doing anything to stop this kind of thing. If you are not part of the solution, you become part of the problem.

 

[mikelange]

:thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

 

[roundball]

".....with a real round ball barrel & patched round ball you can't beat real black powder....."

Not sure what that means...speaking only from my personal experiences, I've never seen Goex perform differently depending upon barrel twist, caliber, etc...it's always been superior on all counts

 

[LittleMoe430]

I nearly sold my caplock...until I tried a 20-year old can of GOEX. Pyrodex was alright, but gave me hang-fires at the worst moments...like when I had a nice deer at 15 yards OR when target shooting in front of a bunch of close friends :redface: . That old can of GOEX performed flawlessly. So has every can since. Try it...

 

[bigbore442001]

I have not read all of the other posts so I do apologize if this information is already repeated.

Black powder is a very stable mixture. It will work well the day it was made as well as hundreds of years later. I remember hearing a story of some fully loaded cannons that were salvaged off the sea floor from a shipwreck. The cannon , fully loaded, had been submerged for centuries. When they fully dried someone who was smoking had accidentally ignited one of the cannon. That tells you something about the stability of black powder.

Second, it is easier to ignite compared to the sythetic brands. The ignition temperature is very low so flintlock shooters have better results with it.

 

[TANSTAAFL]

Not trying to be a wiseacre, but if you have to ask the question, you likely won't understand the answer.

If you shoot a rocklock, experiment with real black and the faux powders, the answer will be self explanatory.

 

[rabbit03]

In my honest opinion the pyrodex doesn't taste near as good sprinkled on the fried eggs as does Goex.

Rabbit03

 

[Stumpkiller]

Where I live all I have available locally is pyrodex. My understanding is that pyrodex is like black powder in most respects except that its cleaner, a little less smokey, and has a higher ignition temperature. These all sound like positives to me. What am I missing out on? And if I were to switch to BP what brand should I choose?
Taylor in Texas

I suppose if you are shooting a percussion muzzleloader it is less of an issue, but real, (as in flintlock :winking: ), muzzleloaders need an explosively reacting powder to fire from the frizzen spark and so require blackpowder.

I also use it in my percussions because it is traditional, cleans up with just soapy water and to help keep the supply lines busy. If only flint shooters asked for it there would probably not be enough action to justify most shops carrying it. Most gun shops in my region of NY have stopped.

 

In my honest opinion the pyrodex doesn't taste near as good sprinkled on the fried eggs as does Goex.

Rabbit03

I agree. The Goex tastes a lot better than Pyrodex or 777. Elephant was terrible for steak.

 

[RackwitzG]

Oh Yeah,
I forgot to mention that I love the smell of Real BP.The smell of Ballistoll also has a fond place in my heart. :hmm:

Same here. At a time I was sad that Pyrodex isn´t available in Germany (if it is, I don´t where), but after reading the remarks here I´m glad I have the priviledge to shoot real BP with all the smell, the smoke and the dirt.

Swiss BP is the most used here.

 

[Elkinde]

Shoot pyrodex exclusively now after using almost a can of GOEX. Very large fouling build-up was present after every shot. Could not get away from cleaning the barrel after every shot with GOEX. Second ball and patch after one shot had to be forced down the barrel. Get a can and try it like I did. It's all in the learning experiance... experimenting. AND by the way, I've never had ignition or any type of problem with pyrodex RS. Has been 100% reliable in all my BP guns.

 

[Old Ironsights]

Black powder is a very stable mixture. It will work well the day it was made as well as hundreds of years later. I remember hearing a story of some fully loaded cannons that were salvaged off the sea floor from a shipwreck. The cannon , fully loaded, had been submerged for centuries. When they fully dried someone who was smoking had accidentally ignited one of the cannon. That tells you something about the stability of black powder.

When I was doing EOD, we had a little story that circulated a bit about some UXO - at least it was thought to be Modern UXO from an impact area untill the blast sceen was reconstructed.

It appears that, many years ago, a family found/dug up some old CW-Era cannonballs in a feild not controlled by the Feds. Since there were a half dozen or so, they decided to weld them together in little pyramid stacks as fireplace ornaments.

Fast forward a few decades: Grandkids now owning home are surprised when their livingroom explodes. Turuns out these were powder-filled iron balls rather than solids. Powder was saturated through the fuze hole. After many years of being warmed by the fireplace the nicely dry powder decides it has had enough. Boom.

Funny stuff Black Powder.

 

[MikeChapin]

In my honest opinion the pyrodex doesn't taste near as good sprinkled on the fried eggs as does Goex.

Rabbit03

Since BP is about 75% saltpeter that condiment should keep you from getting too distracted at a shoot. :rotf: :rotf:

 

[Twisted_1in66]

The key here, as others have said, is that Pyrodex has a higher ignition temperature. That means it takes more and hotter sparks to ignite it. That in NOT an advantage. I've used pyrodex just fine in the inline that I used to shoot, but when I tried it in my flintlock when I first bought it, I couldn't get it to ignite. Put it down the barrel as the main charge and used some left over FFFg Black Powder in the pan (I had originally bought the GOEX for my percussion Kentucky pistol) and then it worked. Pyrodex had a little less smoke, but wasn't any cleaner than real BP.

Bought some 777 and tried that out because I couldn't find real BP locally, and I got that to work most of the time. Still not as depedable as real BP. It didn't seem to be much cleaner burning, but it really did clean by just pouring water across any fouling. In a pinch it might do, but at $25 a pound??? OUCH.

Finally found a GOEX dealer close by and havent' touched either Pyrodex or 777 since. I still have it, but haven't used it in years. Real BP ignites dependably and cleans up easily (Goex or Swiss, not Elephant brand BP). And YES...there is something about the smell of burnt black powder in the morning....or afternoon....or evening
:rotf: :rotf: :rotf:


------------------------------------------
Twisted_1in66 :thumbsup:

 

[Wink]

What BP is better GoexFFF or Swiss FFF. Can they be used the same on a volume to volume basis?

 

[Old Ironsights]

What BP is better GoexFFF or Swiss FFF. Can they be used the same on a volume to volume basis?

I'm in the process of testing that, but "Better" will always be subjective.

However, there is more 3F in a can of Swiss than there is in a can of Goex (Red) 3F See my thread called "The Great Powder Test".

(It rained all weekend, again, and I couldn't continue/finish it yet).

As for Volume? Yes, though if using unsifted powder 100gr of Goex 3F could have as much as 80gr 4F in your measure...

 

[Sharp Shooter]

I think Pyrodex and Goex both foul the same.

 

[Rebel]

I haven't found that to be the case. I can shoot my double barrel all day with no swabbing using Pyrodex RS, but not using Goex 2f. Same thing with Pyrodex P in rifles or revolvers, shoot and shoot. Can't do that with Goex 3f. But then cleanup takes maybe a bit longer with Pyrodex. Only thing i use it in now is my double barrel, and since i got my smoothbore flinter i don't shoot that much any more. So it is real Goex most of the time.

 

[Bill Bryan]

I started shooting muzzle loaders in high school in the late 1960's in South Carolina. Black powder was easy and cheap to buy so that's what I used. Then I moved to California. Pyrodex was what was readily available and I used it for years. In caplock rifles, shotguns and pistols I saw little difference. I think the Pyrodex is more corrosive. You better do a good job of cleanup at the range. Now I've moved to Georgia. I've turned to flintlocks and there is no question. I use GOEX black powder exclusively.