Where do you draw the line?

[Bob McBride]

“Sitting here in a bush like Jane Goodall and watching Anti-Thread-Counting Richards in their natural habitat I can’t help but notice that the differences between them and Richardicus Thread-Counticus himself are so small as to be non existent, giving me the distinct notion that they are indeed the same species of Primate….”, I write in my little diary before putting my binoculars back up to my eyes and continuing my observations.

 

[Tanglefoot]

Well shucks ..... ! Some years ago, I was invited to a "Primitive ML Match" at a site 3 or 4 hours drive away from where I was living. I loaded my tin pony and went. Got there in my buckskin britches and calico shirt and moccasins and discovered that the host club's idea of a "primitive match" was shooting at paper targets of birds and critters instead of bullseyes, on a formal range and under a shed roof. With the exception of gullible ol' me, the other shooters were all loading from tackle boxes full of gear that were sitting on fixed benches, most using steel range rods. , mallets, and false muzzles and wearing modern clothing and "gimme caps" with their shooting glasses and ear muff hearing protectors. So, I hunted up the Range Officer and asked for directions to the primitive area and he just laughed and said this was it, but I was welcome to stay and shoot if I wanted, so I entered two or three matches. I fired them standing on the line and loading my Plains rifle from pouch and horn. When those matches were done I thanked them for their courtesy, took my winnings and drove home. By my lights, those folks weren't primitive, but they were muzzleloaders and shooters and they welcomed me too. Fair enough.

 

[Stantheman86]

That becomes a slippery slope. They could of sewed up Levi 501 jeans in colonial times materially.
Togas pre date rendezvous so should be acceptable right?
On the other hand calzones weren’t part of colonial diet, but meat pies were. Plain folded dough with meat and cheese or veggie fillings folded like a taco and baked, but not a calzone.
No togas, but plenty of match coats (don’t call it a great kilt)
I went to an 1812 event. The captain for the event said my coat buttons were colonial not federal period. I was there as a civilian, coming up as part of the militia.
He was right, as my coat was cr 1800-1830 short woolen coat, not unlike a civilian working man’s coat of 1770 or a shell jacket of 1860. The upright collar it’s mark for federal times.
But the buttons were colonial.
I was 62 at the time, meaning I would have been born about 1750.
When I bought buttons they would have been colonial style.
Buttons don’t take a lot of wear.
I recall my mother saving buttons as I was growing up. She made clothing and reused buttons.
I don’t think some one threw out buttons when clothing was worn out.
My answer was of course There colonial buttons. Wife made my coat new two years ago, took buttons off my old one. Three or four times now since we was married. Waste nought want nought.
Did some one join the militia with a fifty year old gun? I’m hard pressed to think no,
Did a Scotsman come to America wear a great kilt?
Hmmm
I’m going to doubt it.
So I look at my coat with the wrong buttons.
Is it HC, or am I justifying something I did.
Would you see a dog lock musket during the revolution? How about MM period
Slippery slope

There are known, written accounts of some of the Northern and Southern militiamen showing up to the 1st Bull Run wearing Continental Army uniforms and carrying flintlock muskets , because this is what was available at their armory . So I mean a real, well done HC reenactment of the First Bull Run would look totally non HC if in fact it was 100% HC ......Nothern troops in Gray , Southern troops in Blue, State Guardsmen dressed like its 1778....... sometimes trying TOO hard to be HC can look "wrong "

Like my living history stint....people expect a pretty blue uniform and a 61 Springfield rifle if you're a Union reenactor , they don't want to hear about Militia, or Home Guard, or irregular forces , etc even if you are 100% HC with Colonial era buttons on an 1840s coat , which makes perfect sense but is "farby" to a thread counter

 

[Griz44Mag]

Then just don't go. They have their rules and if that causes you to need mydol, don't go. If you go to someone's event and don't like the rules, leave. Make your own event. I get so tired of the snarky, offended crowd.

Anyway, how many non-injuns were there in the mountains during the trapping hey day? Not that many. Most of this is cosplay in buckskin AND THAT'S FINE. Like the SCA, it's a modern recreated society. Just breathe and stop being offended. Don't come to something and try and change it to your way. Ugh.

Try reading my entire post. Don't give me your lame advice when I already stated that I rejected them, I "did not go" as you put it.
You tell me that if I don't like the rules to leave - I already stated that I did leave. You are talking just to hear your own hollow rattle.
Offended? No I was not offended. I never stated that I was offended did I. I was just not impressed with the snotty attitude, so I did leave.
Maybe instead of giving me your hateful advice that I did not need you should take a reading comprehension course ......

 

[appalichian hunter]

As a long time reenactor of both the civil war and the F&I period this is amusing, Not all are equally well off, sure there are those who think they are the cats meow and that is O.K. GUIDENCE IN A CONSTRUCTIVE METHOD GOES A LONG WAY. Snobbery does not. Why get your panties all up in a knot. A lot of times a few suggestions in a casual conservation goes a long way. No one is perfect in there representations I do not care who you profess to be or what you think you know.

 

[Snake Pleskin]

Some time back I was invited to a "meet" but was also told that if I did not pass historical muster that I would have to leave at 10AM so as to not offend the "purists".
So instead of becoming a paying member of the group which I wanted to join and volunteer for range upkeep, etc.....
I gave them nothing - not my time - not my money.
These are the A-holes that drive 60k pickups to the matches and live in modern houses with AC-central heat etc.......
This is the reason so many groups have faded from existence, become smaller and smaller and eventually faded into oblivion.
Three groups I have ventured out to shoot with and enjoy like minded company - could only raise 4-8 people for a club meeting and shoot.
Not much of club is it? Most folks don'y need or want to play dress up in order to go out and enjoy the sport.
We enjoy the sport as a hobby - not a way of life.
Unfortunately it's the self centered fascist perfectionists that are destroying the organized enjoyment of being a black powder enthusiast.

well said

 

[colimr]

" GUIDENCE IN A CONSTRUCTIVE METHOD GOES A LONG WAY. Snobbery does not. Why get your panties all up in a knot. " I believe the HC term is " Bloomers or corset in a knot " LMAO

 

[LME]

The last time I looked this was a muzzle loading forum. lets get back on subject before more member decide they will leave. No one is better nor worse than anyone else. I have seen people refuse to post that had a wealth of information that they would gladly share but don't because of of crap just like this.

 

[sturmkatze]

There's reenacting and there's those who want to shoot and dress up as they do so. If the first group has rules and the second group doesn't meet them, they get their panties wadded up that they might not meet the standards. There is a reason for standards.

 

[appalichian hunter]

" GUIDENCE IN A CONSTRUCTIVE METHOD GOES A LONG WAY. Snobbery does not. Why get your panties all up in a knot. " I believe the HC term is " Bloomers or corset in a knot " LMAO

Yes but how many here wear bloomers or a corset.

 

[Idaho Ron]

I'm reminded of a western national rendezvous, where I was a dog soldier. A lady came to the chief dog soldier's camp to complaining about someone not being period correct. As she was complaining, she took out a filtered cigarette and a Bic lighter to fire it up!

Exactly %

 

[cornstalk]

… for a hundred grand I’ll set you up with a kit no one could nit pick
Ah,cash only

And that my friends is not as far off the actual amount needed as you might think it be.

 

[Colonial Boy]

When I first joined a muzzle loading club, well, not really joined; when we first formed the club, we decided to wear period dress for public appearances, we scraped together what we could of clothing that looked ‘old time’ and the onlookers loved it.
The local military re-enactors go all out to have the correct uniforms and gear, but they sorta have to, most civilians in period dress at shoots just do as we did 60 years ago.
Appearance is what counts not if your shirt buttons are horn or plastic look alikes.

That said we don’t have an historical time frame as the US does, after all the colony of New South Wales only came into existence because England couldn’t dump convicts in America, we’re one of the spin offs of 1776 !!

 

[LME]

When I first joined a muzzle loading club, well, not really joined; when we first formed the club, we decided to wear period dress for public appearances, we scraped together what we could of clothing that looked ‘old time’ and the onlookers loved it.
The local military re-enactors go all out to have the correct uniforms and gear, but they sorta have to, most civilians in period dress at shoots just do as we did 60 years ago.
Appearance is what counts not if your shirt buttons are horn or plastic look alikes.

That said we don’t have an historical time frame as the US does, after all the colony of New South Wales only came into existence because England couldn’t dump convicts in America, we’re one of the spin offs of 1776 !!

You forgot that England did dump criminals in America. Georgia was a penal colony. I believe James Oglethorpe ran the show.

 

[tenngun]

You forgot that England did dump criminals in America. Georgia was a penal colony. I believe James Oglethorpe ran the show.

I think he said that in his post

 

[Dark Angel]

If the rules stated muzzleloaders only, you were in the wrong regardless if your gun was period correct. Would it have been okay if guys showed up with Henry's, Burnsides, or other CW cartridge gun? I think not.

Muzzle Loader, purist don't know or don't care to know that the 'black powder' era of firearms had many innovations that made their way to modern firearms, ie; breech loaders, multi-shot and so forth. would even the most ardent of black powder purist refuse to let a shooter with a Furgeson 'breech-loading' Rifle shoot at their club or event? Sadly, yes.

 

[mushka]

Down here in Yuma when we had our shoots you could wear anything you darn well pleased and be welcome. We had some in shorts and T's and a couple now and then with leather stuff. We do require black powder or substitutes. I was told I could shoot my BP cartridge guns here but I haven't. Unfortunately I think we are closed for regular shoots for the summer. I haven't seen a nit picker here yet since I joined this group two years ago. A small friendly bunch here. Active from about late Sept to late May I think.

 

[sturmkatze]

Wow, this thread needs to be locked

 

[Grenadier1758]

If I am asked, I will offer, hopefully, constructive criticism. Otherwise I have to assess the situation. If the person is new to historically correct reenacting and is looking for a suggestion for improvement, then I try to be accepting and helpful.

 

[LME]

I think he said that in his post

If my eyes don't deceive me he said,"""England couldn't dump criminals in America"". I don't know what he meant but I know what he wrote?