why do we use wads in bp revolvers?

[crockett]

If I recall- Sam Colt on one of his patents for a combustible cartridge included some sort of wad- the material I can't recall- could have been cork or fiber of some type.
To wad or not to wad???? Whatever works for your pistol.

 

[mingo]

Bought my 1st C&B in 1967.
Never used a wad, breakfast food, and rarely grease.

Got .31s, 36's, 44's.

I've had a few chainfires over the years, almost all with balls I thought were a bit loose.

I only use BP and mold my own projectiles.

Folks should use whatever works for them.

 

[Stophel]

I've always wondered why people think wads or grease is necessary to prevent a chain fire from the front end...

If a spark can manage to work itself past an airtight sealed lead ball that you had to jam into place with a lever-assisted ramrod, shaving a ring of lead off, is that silly, porous little wad gonna be an obstacle???

:grin:

 

[FishDFly]

I've always wondered why people think wads or grease is necessary to prevent a chain fire from the front end.

If a spark can manage to work itself past an airtight sealed lead ball that you had to jam into place with a lever-assisted ramrod, shaving a ring of lead off, is that silly, porous little wad gonna be an obstacle???

:grin:

It's the end of the opera, the fat lady has sung, what else can be added?

Chain fires have been debated numerous times here for a long time; they are very rare (who has personally had one when a revolver is correctly loaded)? Chain fires do not occur from the front of the cylinder.

If the ball is so loose in the cylinder, so it cannot seal the chamber, it will fall out of the cylinder, would it not?

Grease or lubricant is added for lubricant for the ball/projectile. If lubricant was for SAFETY, the owner’s manual would mandate that it was needed and failure do to do so would be violating whatever in the Owners Manual, would it not?


RDE

 

[Stophel]

My repro Remington shoots HORRIBLE with wads under the ball. I ditched the wads, and the thing shoots AWESOME. Of course, it fouls up the barrel faster...

I may try wads on top of the balls for lube purposes....see how that does.

 

[FishDFly]

My repro Remington shoots HORRIBLE with wads under the ball. I ditched the wads, and the thing shoots AWESOME. Of course, it fouls up the barrel faster...

I may try wads on top of the balls for lube purposes....see how that does.

Wads, folks talk about them for rifles and pistols, but I have not seen one line shooter use them in National Matches.

There are as many ways to load a revolver as there are folks.

When I first when to the Winter Nationals, a person watched me for a bit and told me "you do not have a clue on what you are doing" and he was right.

I decided that I was going to the Winter Nationals, and bought the minimum number of pistols needed, sighted them in and off I went.
I had a dream of going and I did.

He loaned me his "Cream Of Wheat" (COW) as a filler which he said is better than Corn Meal. He said COW is better than Corn Meal because it will not compress. He is correct on that, COW will not compress at all, add a bit too much and the ball is not going to seat fully.

He loaned me his lubricant which is comprised of 3 different things, works fine when it's cold but is runny when it's 100 degrees. I now have cold and hot lubricant.

Fouling, get a bore brush and use it after 5 shots.

In summation, it's more the shooter than what you stuff into the cylinder that will get you into the winners awards, but there are a few tricks on the line which will put you into the medals.

RDE

 

[Steve French]

I've used lubricarted wads, but I prefer Mobil 1 synthetic grease. Not traditional, but it works.

I've been told by someone a while back that some automotive greases work real good and won't run in the heat. Would Bearing Grease work? Just wondering.

Pustic

 

[Steve French]

I've always wondered why people think wads or grease is necessary to prevent a chain fire from the front end...

If a spark can manage to work itself past an airtight sealed lead ball that you had to jam into place with a lever-assisted ramrod, shaving a ring of lead off, is that silly, porous little wad gonna be an obstacle???

:grin:

No. :haha: :wink:

 

[Steve French]

I've always wondered why people think wads or grease is necessary to prevent a chain fire from the front end.

If a spark can manage to work itself past an airtight sealed lead ball that you had to jam into place with a lever-assisted ramrod, shaving a ring of lead off, is that silly, porous little wad gonna be an obstacle???

:grin:

It's the end of the opera, the fat lady has sung, what else can be added?

Chain fires have been debated numerous times here for a long time; they are very rare (who has personally had one when a revolver is correctly loaded)? Chain fires do not occur from the front of the cylinder.

If the ball is so loose in the cylinder, so it cannot seal the chamber, it will fall out of the cylinder, would it not?

Grease or lubricant is added for lubricant for the ball/projectile. If lubricant was for SAFETY, the owner’s manual would mandate that it was needed and failure do to do so would be violating whatever in the Owners Manual, would it not?


RDE

Amen, you said it best of all, If lubricant was for SAFETY, the owner’s manual would of said so.
I use wads, but I've never creased the front end and never had a problem. Yet. :grin:

Pustic

 

[Pete Gaimari]

I think if someone actually got a chain fire from the ball side they had way too loose a fit on the ball.
I don't load the cylinder in the gun. It's too slow for CAS competition for me. I use Colt 60's, and have my wedge tuned for a thumb fit in and out. I can remove the cylinder faster than a Remington. That leaves me free to also keep the arbor lubed.
The cylinder loader I use is very sturdy and made with aluminum. It's very easy to load a .457 ball and shaves a good size ring from the ball. No way could a spark get by the ball.

As for filling the chamber? No problem. I shoot warthog style, and just fill the chamber with powder.

Big bang........big smoke...........priceless.

Loose caps cause chainfires. Use Treso nipples and Rem #10 caps.

 

[bdhutier]

I NEVER used a wad.
I use to use grease over the balls when I first started shooting cap and ball revolvers over 30 years ago.
Now I only put grease over the ball about every 5-6 cylinder I fire. /.../
I believe with a proper size ball, that you have no more of a chance of a chain from the front of the cylinder than you would with a modern cartridge firing revolver.

I'm with ya. I usually spin every 5th cylinder or so, and spray the front with lithium grease. There's lithium grease on the arbor and internals already, so I've never had an issue there.

 

[phoenix511]

If accuracy is the main objective, I wonder if any of the high-scoring revolver shooters at Friendship/NMLRA matches would be willing to share their knowledge?

 

[Stophel]

Let me say, I do NOT shoot percussion pistols a lot, just every now and then.

Years ago, I tried shooting a Remington repro with Crisco or some other type of grease on top of the balls. Holy manure, what a mess. It blasted grease all over the place. Never tried it again since! :grin:

 

[FishDFly]

If Jim/OH will respond, you will learn from him.

You asked for high scoring shooters to respond, most do not come here, they are a quiet group.

I am learning by sitting with the Masters, carefully listening and keeping quiet when with them. You learn by listening and practicing to rid your self of what they say are your bad practices/habits as they watch you shoot and you are not aware of them watching you.

I have learned that pistol shooters will help their own more than rifle shooters.

Read, read, read, dry fire, dry fire, handle the pistol each day, handle the pistol each day and shoot as often as you can.

One secret is to get a "good" air pistol and shoot 10 shots each morning.

Without effort, there is no gain.

rde

 

[bezoar]

mister colt disproved the chain fire as being from the ball end.
provided that the chambers were drilled correctly in a true circular shape, and thatthe projectiles are truely spherical and that they fit in the chamber properly.

meaning if the chambers are circles, and the balls are circles, and are not loaded sprue to the side, flame not going through.

he discovered chain fire came from teh nipple. most normally by having a loose cylinder go rearward upon discharging it, and the capped nipples hitting the recoil shield.

thats why the brass frame revolvers are not so good as they tend to pound into the frame so much and leave those indents in it. the dents get deep enough, the user uses nipples that are to long, and boom.

 

[mjn]

FWIW, I've been shooting C&B revolvers since 1996. I do not use wads. At most, sometimes I will roll the balls in a 50/50 bees wax and tallow mix before loading. I had 1 chainfire and that was my fault. I used balls that were undersized.

 

[Kevin Makel]

I've used lubricarted wads, but I prefer Mobil 1 synthetic grease. Not traditional, but it works.

I've been told by someone a while back that some automotive greases work real good and won't run in the heat. Would Bearing Grease work? Just wondering.

Pustic

As long as it is non petroleum based, should work fine.

Mobil 1 S G has not run on me in the heat yet, but I'll be testing it again from now to August.

 

[aap2]

I don't use wads in either my Lyman 1853 Rem .36 or my original Colt 1851 (which doesn't get shot much). I use soft lead buckshot for balls and they fit tightly; IMHO no chainfire is going to happen from the front end unless the ball is a loose fit. Chainfires usually happen from the nipples and that's from poor fitting caps. The Lyman has been fired many thousands of times with no lube and no chain firing (just like the origials were). Surprizingly, the bore does not seem to lead at all and accuracy is about equal with a Colt SAA prewar .38 special that I also shoot a lot. A few of the really cheap repro revolvers have tapered cylinder bores, so if you ram the ball (any size) down on a light powder charge, the ball gets swaged down and this loose fit kills accuracy and sets you up for a chain fire from the front if you don't use lube over the ball or greased wads. Some revolvers shoot better with wads, probably because they have tapered cylinder bores and the wad keeps the ball from getting swaged undersized as it's seated deeply. Just my opinion. It's fairly simple to have tapered cylinder bores reamed out. Most good quality revolvers probably don't need reaming, but the Lyman that I bought in 1972 for $95 did. It now outshoots every BP revolver that I have ever used.

 

[Norinco]

I heard the originals had tapered cylinders as well.

 

[TFoley]

I don't use wads in either my Lyman 1853 Rem .36 or my original Colt 1851 (which doesn't get shot much). I use soft lead buckshot for balls and they fit tightly; IMHO no chainfire is going to happen from the front end unless the ball is a loose fit. Chainfires usually happen from the nipples and that's from poor fitting caps. The Lyman has been fired many thousands of times with no lube and no chain firing (just like the origials were). Surprizingly, the bore does not seem to lead at all and accuracy is about equal with a Colt SAA prewar .38 special that I also shoot a lot. A few of the really cheap repro revolvers have tapered cylinder bores, so if you ram the ball (any size) down on a light powder charge, the ball gets swaged down and this loose fit kills accuracy and sets you up for a chain fire from the front if you don't use lube over the ball or greased wads. Some revolvers shoot better with wads, probably because they have tapered cylinder bores and the wad keeps the ball from getting swaged undersized as it's seated deeply. Just my opinion. It's fairly simple to have tapered cylinder bores reamed out. Most good quality revolvers probably don't need reaming, but the Lyman that I bought in 1972 for $95 did. It now outshoots every BP revolver that I have ever used.

I've only been shooting BP since the late 1960's, but -

1. I've never had, or seen a 'chain-fire'.

2. I've never used wads.

tac