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Black Hand said:
Obi-Wan Cannoli said:
Does something being uncommon exclude it from being HC/PC?

How debatable is the actual commonality of inkle loomed textiles considering the massive amounts of imports from Countries where the inkle loom predated the colonies?

I didn't say it was uncommon, I said it didn't exist.

Material culture PC/HC is a matter of Item, Place AND Time. Inkle-woven products may have been available elsewhere, but not necessarily in the colonies.

It is difficult to believe that people from England would not have brought with them inkle woven textiles that were common in England, and that they would also not have imported them at all to any degree up until the Revolutionary War. Furthermore, it is also difficult to imagine that they would not have imported them from other European Nations during and after the Rev. War especially considering how essential textiles are to an Army on campaign.
 
Argument from Incredulity

Just because you might not believe it possible is not a valid reason to discount the facts/evidence.
 
http://www.carolingianrealm.info/PatternGenerator.php try this out.
Might get a book by,Helene Bress,,Inkle Weaving,ISBN- 0-684-13870-0
Then to get into the PC/HC discussion get "Card Weaving" by Candace Crockett ISBN 0-934026-61-0.
Card Weaving has been around for a very long time..
 
I agree, England placed allot of restrictions on incoming and outgoing trade items.

Just read the other day about the textile industry back then. Particularly textiles in the floral print were the majority of them came from india. Long story short, the crown placed a large restriction on these types of fabrics due to the impact they had on local manufacturers.

Case in point... maybe this is something similar? The out sourcing sounds familiar... :hmm:
 
Yikes, I did not know this would turn into a PC nightmare.

I just thought you all may have liked the items. But now a lot of things seem to make sense about this forum.

I am sorry if I have offended anyone with assuming inkle looming was period.
 
You offended no one (at least not me).

You were proud of your straps, as you should be. There are many that will enjoy them and put them to good use.

Just take this discussion as a history lesson and use it to improve your impression, if that is your desire. This forum is for sharing information so that all may learn. There is always more to learn...
 
OhioRamm said:
Yikes, I did not know this would turn into a PC nightmare.

I just thought you all may have liked the items. But now a lot of things seem to make sense about this forum.

I am sorry if I have offended anyone with assuming inkle looming was period.

You did ask "wanted to know what patterns and colors you all like and what would have been appropriate back then". What patterns and colors members like is only relevant if you're trying to sell them. Historically accurate is something different.

No one was offended. Take the advice for what it's worth, but also do some research yourself.

Not everything that looks "old timey" is appropriate for a given time period.
 
I think the Green one is stunning and you did very nice work on all of them, but I would not use them for a period impression.

The one thing I hope is that you won't be stymied or frustrated by learning some things are not HC/PC, since you have talent and it's obvious you have the mindset to make nice things.

I had to learn the hard and expensive way that a whole lot of the gear I initially made was not HC/PC. It was not cheap to replace it, but had I done it the right way from the beginning, it would often not cost more and/or it would last longer.

So my suggestion is USE the collective knowledge on this forum along with your talent and you most likely will be rewarded for your efforts.

Gus
 
I guess it was just that I had learned to weave from someone who has been doing this for years and believed it was correct.

This will not deter me from weaving, I enjoy it and will continue to make fun stuff.
 
Nor should you stop weaving. This may an opportunity to slightly alter your methods to yield a PC/HC item.

There is wisdom in the saying - trust but verify...
 
you do beautiful work & straps of this exact type are widely used by members over on "The Horner's Bench". look up my friend Kris Polizzi there or on facebook & you'll see scads of straps just like yours. if I ever need a strap I would certainly consider them. keep up the good work & just shine the nay-sayers on.
 
bubba.50 said:
...just shine the nay-sayers on...
This is poor advice.

Know your stuff, make a good product and you will earn respect. Try to fool people and you will lose customers....
 
I could care less if the loom is HC, the sashes and garters are beautiful, period.

HC, the colors by all means are for sure, the patterns I honestly don't have enough knowledge to comment. From examples I've seen allot of the patterns are solid backgrounds with different outline coloration along with chevron type weaves. I do know finger weaving has been a HC method for hundreds of years.

Please don't be set back, you have a talent for weaving as I've seen it first hand! Growing pains are all part of the process! Widening your knowledge base is personally one of my favorite aspects of the hobby. Certainly DON'T shine away the nay sayers... that's foolish advice IMO. Most of these people have been doing this longer than we both have been alive and are very knowledgeable! The history definitely needs to live on, and that's only through their knowledge that's passed on.

I can certainly say if you shine away the elders and more experienced folks advice in the Native community, best just not come back because being foolish is the least of the concerns IMO. :thumbsup:
 
I Inkle Weave also and I weave what I like,however I know my belts are not alphabet( p/c&h/c)nor do I profess to weave either one.IF I were to weave P/C H/C then I would change and follow form.unless you are selling the belts/straps to fit a persona and time period,,no harm, no foul.
Your straps are very nice, keep up the good work,weave on.
I give most of the ones I weave as gifts,To date I have not had one returned or refused.
Life is easier when you plow around the stumps...
 
Inkle is a 16th century Old English word that translates to drawstring or band. Other spellings include unckle, incle, yncull, and ynkell. In the colonies it was referred to as tape or ribbon.

The modern inkle loom was not invented until 1924, however, it is merely a modified rigid heddle loom. The only difference between a modern inkle loom and a rigid heddle loom is that a modern inkle loom uses string heddles to change the shed. This makes them easier to manufacture, while at the same time weaving an identical product as the older rigid heddle loom.

The rigid heddle loom was more common in Scandinavia while, during the same era, the box style tape loom was more common in the colonies. They are both able to produce identical ribbon. The box variant was a more stable platform, while the rigid heddle variant was faster....

So essentially the end result is that the ribbon/tape/inkle being made in this topic is HC/PC (assuming the coloration and materials are correct), while the loom that it is being made on is not.
 
No one is disputing inkle-woven items were available elsewhere at some time in history....
 
Not being a weaver I get confused in talking about the various types of looms and weaving. To begin with, the definition of 'inkle' is "a linen tape used for trimmings". So, an inkle loom would seem to be a loom for weaving inkles, but inkles were apparently being woven on other simple looms before the modern version, which we now call an inkle loom, was developed.

Here's an interesting bit from a book by Alice Morris Earle, HOME LIFE IN COLONIAL DAYS:
Originally published in 1898; American Classics Edition by Berkshire House Publishers, Stockbridge MA:1993: ISBN 0-936399-22-8: pg. 225 - 227.

"Smaller looms, called tape-looms, braid-looms, belt-looms, garter-looms, or "gallus-frames," were seen in many American homes and useful they were in days when linen, cotton, woollen, or silk tapes, bobbins, and webbings or ribbons were not common and cheap as to-day (1898). Narrow bands such as tapes, none-so-pretty's, ribbons, caddises, ferretings, inkles, were woven on these looms for use for garters, points, glove-ties, hair-laces, shoestrings, belts, hat-bands, stay-laces, breeches-suspenders, etc.... They are scarcely more than a slightly shaped board so cut in slits that the centre of the board is a row of narrow slats. These slats are pierced in a row by means of a heated wire and the warp-threads are passed through the holes. A common form of braid-loom was one that was laid upon a table. A still simpler form was held upright on the lap, the knees being firmly pressed into semicircular indentations cut for the purpose on either side of the board which formed the lower part of the loom. The top of the loom was steadied by being tied with a band to the top of a chair, or a hook in the wall."

Wouldn't it be the case that whichever of those simple looms was used to weave inkles could fairly be called an inkle loom?

Spence
 

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