"Use of shot is not permitted"

brownac1983 said:

That's a weird rule. Are .32 caliber round balls permitted? If so, just use a bunch of those.

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It says “.530 caliber or larger if they shoot roundballs.”

QuinnTheEskimo said:

It says “.530 caliber or larger if they shoot roundballs.”

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That's specific to handguns I believe. Regardless, caliber is bore size. It would still be .69 caliber.

It's almost as if whoever wrote these rules doesn't know what they're talking about. Or they work for the ATF.

I mean, technically, a solid round ball of any size is "shot".

brownac1983 said:

That's a weird rule. Are .32 caliber round balls permitted? If so, just use a bunch of those.

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Nope, the caliber of the projectile isn't even mentioned. Only the caliber of the gun. You could sabot down to a .22lr bullet, the actual lethality of the load is completely immaterial.

thesethawa said:

I saw a demonstration where a guy was using old wasp nest as wadding. Could maybe try that too

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thesethawa said:

I've only tried them with birdshot, I'll go shoot today and show how it does with buck

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I thought rolling my own paper cups would help with #6 birdshot. Nope.

I appreciate your input.

thesethawa said:

Nope, the caliber of the projectile isn't even mentioned. Only the caliber of the gun. You could sabot down to a .22lr bullet, the actual lethality of the load is completely immaterial.

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Just cram it full of .22 bullets. Those technically aren't shot.

brownac1983 said:

That's specific to handguns I believe. Regardless, caliber is bore size. It would still be .69 caliber.

It's almost as if whoever wrote these rules doesn't know what they're talking about. Or they work for the ATF.

I mean, technically, a solid round ball of any size is "shot".

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If you use the naval definition, any projectile that doesn't have explosive filler is "shot"

brownac1983 said:

Just cram it full of .22 bullets. Those technically aren't shot.

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Maybe I could use a stack of domed pennies... I don't think that would count as shot

Always pays to check first, the good news is if you take up historical trekking or just use your smoothbore as a hiking gun you have a nice defensive load against medium sized critters, two or four legged.

This is an off the mark question but this is the only place, now, that I find to ask. I've a Pedersoli 45 cal flinter with 1 in 48 twist. a couple years ago someone wrote an article in BWM mag about using a "twisted" barrel to run shot. Has anyone here done so and plz give details. I'm asking about using a slow twist as a fowler, if my question or wording is unclear. Thanks...

Rifleman1776 said:

I have no experience or knowledge on the subject. However, the use of buckshot in modern shotguns for deer was/is widely practiced.

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Shoot what ya want, I am not the one losing shot up deer.

It's called hunting season, not wounding season.

64Springer said:

This is something that's been bouncing around in my head. I've search for 16ga wad/cups and can't locate any.

May I ask where you found the 16ga components?

Thank you.

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Quite a few sources. At present MidwayUSA comes to mind. I just checked and they have a number of choices for 16 ga plastic wads. We used to call them power pistons years ago but maybe that was a brand name at the time. But the plastic sleeve cups helps keep the shot together a little longer when it leaves the barrel. Sort of like a choke does.

16ga. 1oz. wad/cup ordered through Midway USA.

Thank you.

Having grown up in NJ when buckshot for deer was mandated, I say don't bother. I had a Ithica double 12, both full chokes, and wouldn't chance a shot past 25 yds.

waksupi said:

In this area, few landowners will let hunters use buckshot. Too many wounded deer get away,

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nothing worse than a gut shot animal. my state banned it several years ago. remember a hunters prayer- OH LORD LET ME KILL CLEAN OR MISS CLEAN!

a slug or a RB, takes care of that!

Ballistic Products has all your reloading needs meaning shot ups. I use there BP12s in my double Pedersoli for waterfowl and it patterns well. Hope this helps!!!

French Colonial said:

Note that he says a smooth bored gun was a rarity, this was in the 1839-to-1842-time frame in your neck of the woods Arkansas.

This persistent opinion is wishful thinking of those who prefer smooth bores not supportable by documentation.

In the course of the day, we had seen a man pass by with a smooth-bored gun, and as such a thing was a rarity in the backwoods, the conversation turned on this circumstance.

Gerstäcker, Friedrich. Wild Sports in the Far West (p. 212). Good Press. Kindle Edition.

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Smoothbores may have been a rarity in some areas, but they were around in large numbers elsewhere. Surplus muskets, Northwest fusils and fowlers were hardly rare.

A second for Ballistic Products on any scatter gun supplies. Wads/shot cups, flight control, whatever the product is named, that is the choke these days. Properly set up, a 10" pattern at 50+ yards is possible in a 12 gauge cylinder bore. That's how we get big, fast, high flying waterfowl.
Front stuffers perform nearly identically to cartridge shotguns. Shell loads are easily translated to BP muzzle loading.
And large shot/buck does not pattern well on a full/tight choke at all.
I suggest "Shotguns by Keith" 1950.
BP also has superb manuals and books on loads.
However, shot is a very poor big game choice.
Laws, rules, regulations are beside the point. It is not an ethical deer load for good reason.

thesethawa said:

..., I looked a second time at the rules and noticed an unassuming little sentence that completely threw a wrench into my idea. 'Use of shot is not allowed.'
..., I ask you all, why should buckshot not be allowed in large bore muzzleloaders? This gun is easily as deadly as a modern 20 gauge, and can be loaded with much larger buckshot. Even in the original military loads, which were of course black powder, it was called BUCK shot. There is no reason why I shouldn't be allowed to use buckshot in a muzzleloading shotgun....,

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SO..., what you have is people making regulations who are not very well educated on what they regulate. Welcome to the 21st century. I can give you dozens of examples in my own state where this happens, and not just in hunting, although the hunting laws here are "odd" as well. We can't use buckshot in any gun, and it's been that way for 60 years at least. Too many wounded deer.... at least that's the belief.....

Another question should be, WHY are .390, .440, .490 or .520 round ball not allowed for deer in Arkansas? Millions of deer have been successfully taken with those size round balls, and millions more will be taken with them, no worries. AND any caliber muzzleloading handgun may be carried as a "backup" when hunting deer? AH the answer lies in my first paragraph, above.

In my state there is a legal minimum of 60 grains of BP or substitute BP propellant required for a muzzleloading rifle or shotgun when going for deer. No mention of it being 1Fg, 2Fg, or 3Fg. The minimum caliber here is .40. Now 60 grains of 3Fg and a .390 round ball is a screemin' fast load, but 60 grains of 2Fg and a .610 ball is kind of a light load (according to the .62/20 gauge crowd). It's rather anemic for a .715 round ball (imho). Also one projectile at a time. NO putting two ball into a single barrel, and as I mentioned, no buckshot here.

LD