4F Blackpowder uses?

[Cowboy]

I was hoping you would chime in here. You always seem to answer all my questions point by point in fine detail. The clarity of your replies are freshing to me. Thankyou, Respectfully, cowboys1062.

 

[Twisted_1in66]

My experience with Elephant powder was terrible. Really dirty powder. I've never seen anything foul like it did. It was so well known for being a dirty powder that at a muzzleloader biathlon in Vermont that I attended, a pound of Elephant 3fg was given away as a door prize. That "prize" was donated back to the event three times before someone kept that pound of Elephant powder. If you have any other real black powder choices, I would buy something else.

Twisted_1in66:thumbsup:
Dan

 

[Tom Compton]

Simple solution......

1. buy the powder

2. buy a flintlock

3. live happily ever after.

:grin:

Where's the "Like" button? :metoo:

:metoo: Y yo tambien!! That's the 2nd best answer the best being to send me the 4F and I'll dispose of it properly. :grin:
TC

 

[Alden]

OK, so you and blackpowder62 promote using FFFFg black powder in .31 to .45 handguns, apparently especially in antiques. You own it.

Attack people personally if you think that's necessary when someone disagrees as long as it is permitted, but now those are both the worst suggestions here in my opinion...

...right next to bringing up making one's own impact-sensitive "flash" powder.

 

[faste350]

OK, so you and blackpowder62 promote using FFFFg black powder in .31 to .45 handguns, apparently especially in antiques. You own it.

Attack people personally if you think that's necessary when someone disagrees as long as it is permitted, but now those are both the worst suggestions here in my opinion...

...right next to bringing up making one's own impact-sensitive "flash" powder.

you sir, mentioned "antique" guns, not i. as for the attack, you started it, so i guess YOU it! again, the information is from the Lyman Blackpowder Handbook, not me! just passing on the information to the gentleman. maybe Lyman doesn't know what they are doing :idunno:

 

[Alden]

Facts are stubborn things old man.

Rowdah cited original black powder handguns, we call those antiques, using FFFFg -- I didn't. And your trying to hide behind Lyman's skirt when you are here, right now, paraphrasing, we call that promoting, using today's FFFFg in handguns up to .45* is your doing and your responsibility. Is it your legal liability that has you blaming them for what you posted? Already!?

*Yes, I "started" by pointing out how poor a suggestion I thought that was. Still do!

 

[Rifleman1776]

Haven't seen such personal bickering and attacks here for a while.
Last time was when I stomped all over WLB for knowing nuttin' about knives because he is not from Arkansas. :slap: :v

 

[George]

In the 1975 Lyman Black Powder Handbook, Lyman reports results of testing 4 pistols, a .31 cal. Baby Dragoon replica, a Ruger .45 cal. Old Army, and two Lyman pistols modified to measure pressures, a .36 1851 Navy and a .44 cal, 1860 Army. They tested all pistols with both C & H and G-O powders of 3F and 4F granulations. They loaded up to 41 grains 4F in the Old Army shooting RB, up to 35 grains 4F shooting conicals. In the .31 caliber they shot 13 gr. 4F and RB. In the .36 cal P & V gun they loaded up to 27 gr. 4F with RB, up to 15 gr. with conicals. The .44 cal. P & V gun was shot with 37 gr. 4F for RB, 28 gr. 4F with conicals.

Their conclusion: "We had no difficulties with any phase of the Revolver Sequence. Each piece of equipment performed as it should have and there were no signs of strain, bulging or other pressure problems."

I have fired many hundreds of rounds from an Old Army using round ball and as much 4F as the cylinder would hold, which is 41 grains. There was never a single problem.

Spence

 

[rodwha]

Since you seem to only read or retain what you wish:

"As no manufacturer states to use 4F other than Ruger so I certainly wouldn't suggest it. And as 3F Olde Eynsford and Triple 7 give plenty of power I see no need to use 4F in anything but maybe a small caliber handgun, and maybe a flash pan, though plenty of people get great ignition using 3F.
"

All I did was point out the historical (that's what this forum is about is it not?) use other than for flashpans.

And, again, since you only read or retain what you wish you'll need to go back and see who attacked who. And if you go back and look you'll note that he does that time and time again. You'll also note that it rarely ever helps the OP or the topic, but is meant to be nothing but inflammatory.

 

[rodwha]

"Facts are stubborn things old man."

Seems as though you like to be inflammatory as well.

Facts must be your bane.

 

[rodwha]

"*Yes, I "started" by pointing out how poor a suggestion I thought that was. Still do!"

You seem to suffer from poor readin comprehension skills as neither of us had suggested (in fact I said the opposite) it's use for anything, but instead stated facts. Maybe that's just too hard for you to chew on as its defies what you believe.

 

[faste350]

you also might consider looking at the latest edition of the Lyman blackpowder handbook. it must have been written when elephant powder was popular, or at least on the market. they did alot of comparison loads in rifles, shotguns and handguns, with other powder brands of the time. it will give you more information to work with.

 

[trent/OH]

One other consideration is that you might buy those cans of powder for less than the value of the empty cans. I've seen empty Meteor cans fetching $40!

And a final consideration is that your shop owner will remember YOU when somebody brings in something "interesting". Maybe a custom rifle for cheap, or maybe hundreds of round ball he knows you can use.

 

[Zonie]

you also might consider looking at the latest edition of the Lyman blackpowder handbook...

Just the intro I was looking for.

Although the first edition of the Lyman BLACK POWDER HANDBOOK & LOADING MANUAL had several listings for loads of 4F powder in pistols, the latest edition has eliminated all references to 4F powder loads from the pistol data.

I am surprised you didn't mention this when you referred to Lymans listings.

 

[Alden]

I'm not bickering at all Rifleman, but some people must think that we are really stupid.

That we're so blind we don't know any better and can't see them back-pedal on what they clearly wrote, and that we'll accept it when they parrot some old, bad, advice only to blame the original authors for writing it in the first place. I expect this from the left-wing media -- "we're not saying this but sources tell us..." -- not from members here.

And then to attack me personally!?

 

[faste350]

you also might consider looking at the latest edition of the Lyman blackpowder handbook...

Just the intro I was looking for.

Although the first edition of the Lyman BLACK POWDER HANDBOOK & LOADING MANUAL had several listings for loads of 4F powder in pistols, the latest edition has eliminated all references to 4F powder loads from the pistol data.

I am surprised you didn't mention this when you referred to Lymans listings.

i didn't mention it, because why would they publish the same test from an earlier publication. if you noticed, the new edition has more and different information on other things. additional info on sabots and powders, ect. heck, if they included everything from the first it would be 2 inches thick.

 

[rodwha]

"I'm not bickering at all Rifleman, but some people must think that we are really stupid."

Accept that you were. It's right there for all to see how you responded.

"That we're so blind we don't know any better and can't see them back-pedal on what they clearly wrote, and that we'll accept it when they parrot some old, bad, advice only to blame the original authors for writing it in the first place."

Nobody back-pedaled. What happened was someone decided to put words in people's mouths because they had an agenda and lacked reading comprehension. It's right there for you and anyone else willing to read. But I don't expect that from someone behaving in that manner to do.

Please back up your claim of "old bad advice." Show how it was bad. Show us how out forfathers were idiots.

" I expect this from the left-wing media -- "we're not saying this but sources tell us..." -- not from members here."

You are the only one showing left-wing political tactics. You've put words in mouths that never were spoken, which is easy to see as it's all in black and white right here. You need to check yourself.

"
10-25-15 07:00 PM - Post#1520229
In response to Rifleman1776

I'm not bickering at all Rifleman, but some people must think that we are really stupid.

That we're so blind we don't know any better and can't see them back-pedal on what they clearly wrote, and that we'll accept it when they parrot some old, bad, advice only to blame the original authors for writing it in the first place. I expect this from the left-wing media -- "we're not saying this but sources tell us..." -- not from members here.

"And then to attack me personally!?"

You do realize you started that too, right? You'll have to own that too.

 

[faste350]

I'm not bickering at all Rifleman, but some people must think that we are really stupid.

That we're so blind we don't know any better and can't see them back-pedal on what they clearly wrote, and that we'll accept it when they parrot some old, bad, advice only to blame the original authors for writing it in the first place. I expect this from the left-wing media -- "we're not saying this but sources tell us..." -- not from members here.

And then to attack me personally!?

isn't that what you do, is quote writings from the past to push your purest/historically correct theories, or were you there. i cannot believe you are allowed to come on here and continually attack people and get away with it. you clearly only see what you want to see in a post and try to make something out of nothing. what a great example to set for young or new people coming to this site and being belittled and insulted when they ask a question. you should be proud. i took the high road to stay away from this, but you insist on carrying on with the insults and attacks.

 

[rodwha]

I find it absolutely amazing that we post muzzleloading data from a book or historical findings and get flamed as we did.

They can argue and misstate all they want but it changes nothing.

It really is disheartening how many here behave. This is by far the most controversial forum I've ever been to. On the other hand it's also been a very informative one. Not what I would expect. Too many lack class and behave immaturely. And many are our elders who we should look up to.

 

[necchi]

This is by far the most controversial forum I've ever been on.

Wow, this one ain't nuthin,, Claude actually takes pretty good care of the place.
Every site has a few closed minded narcissistic curmudgeons,,