CVA .45 kit rifle - max load?

[MN284]

Hello - I built a CVA percussion rifle, "Kentucky" model with full stock, no patch box, from a kit several years ago. The CVA literature dated 1981 which came with the gun "recommends" a charge of 75 gr of 3F powder.

Fadala's BP book shows and recommends hunting loads up to 120 gr of 3F with either round ball of Maxi-ball.

Have been target shooting with 60 and 70 gr loads, but would like to use it for deer hunting in Minnesota. Any recommendations on powder charge?

Thanks!

Tom

 

[roadgrader]

I have one i use for a deer rifle.IT is most accurate with 70 grains of 3f and a PRB.It will shoot through both sides no problem,Stacey

 

[Katahdin]

Stick with the mfg's recommendation.

 

[Cowboy]

Hello - I built a CVA percussion rifle, "Kentucky" model with full stock, no patch box, from a kit several years ago. The CVA literature dated 1981 which came with the gun "recommends" a charge of 75 gr of 3F powder.

Fadala's BP book shows and recommends hunting loads up to 120 gr of 3F with either round ball of Maxi-ball.

Have been target shooting with 60 and 70 gr loads, but would like to use it for deer hunting in Minnesota. Any recommendations on powder charge?

Thanks!

Tom

I shoot 50 grn of Goex 3f through my .45 muzzleloaders but am only punching paper. You mentioned a hunting load for deer hunting.

I would guess that your 70 grn of 3f BP would be more than proficient for a .45 Cal muzzleloader.

I would also add that Fadala's BP book showing 120 grn of 3F seems to be an extremely heavy load for a .45 Traditional Muzzleloader? :shocked2:

3F produces higher pressure than 2F and there for does not take as much powder to produce the same results. Not for sure but I would guess that for instance, 60 grn of 3F would be equivalent to 70-75 grn's of 2F. So if you shoot 70 grn of 3F it would be like 80 to 85 grn of 2F. That should be more than adequate for a deer hunting load in your .45 muzzleloader.

Of course each muzzleloader is different in what it likes and what is a good worked up load for one isn't necessarily going to be the same for the other.

Just saying that 70 grn of 3F in my mind would be a more than adequate load for .45 Cal.

Others will surely chime in.

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[coloradoclyde]

Have been target shooting with 60 and 70 gr loads, but would like to use it for deer hunting in Minnesota. Any recommendations on powder charge?

Thanks!

Tom

My target load is my hunting load......More than enough power to get the job done...
Doesn't matter how stout a load is if you cant hit the target...

 

[necchi]

Have been target shooting with 60 and 70 gr loads, but would like to use it for deer hunting in Minnesota. Any recommendations on powder charge?

Thanks!

Tom

My target load is my hunting load......More than enough power to get the job done...
Doesn't matter how stout a load is if you cant hit the target...

Yup, I live in Minn,, your current load is plenty powerful for our Whitetail, no need for anything more,, a .440 or .445 ball in the boiler room with that load is a great combination.
:thumbsup:
Use it for Black bear if you want too,,

 

[Grenadier1758]

Sam Fadala liked to shoot very powerful loads. Most often these were loaded in rifles that could take such a heavy load such as the CVA mountain rifle or the Hawken with at least a 15/16" barrel measured across the flats.

Your CVA Kentucky rifle has, if I remember correctly, a smaller barrel measured across the flats. For deer, a load of up to 70 grains of 3f black powder by volume should be more than adequate.

 

[coloradoclyde]

I would like to add that, powder charges in excess of 90 grains become increasingly, and very unpleasant to shoot in that rifle....

 

[hanshi]

Not to mention all the wasted powder. 60 grains of 3F in my .45 gives 1700fps and is my standard deer load. If I feel like it, I might go up as far as 70 grains but that's it.

 

[Katahdin]

Under the 'old" designations,a 70 grn of powder on a 45 cal would make it a 45/70 more than enough power to kill a deer,even the 700 lb, saber toothed,long clawed, meat eating,fire breathing ones,,,

 

[coloradoclyde]

Goex lists no data beyond 90 grains....for 45cal

Hodgdon 777 max load is 60 grains with a roundball

 

[azmntman]

whatever shoots best, just 50 gr will knock that ol buck down and change his coat into lil white packages of meat just fine.

 

[Cowboy]

Does anyone have a conversion chart or load chart for equivalent loads between using 3F BP and 2F BP? For .45 and up?

I looked around but couldn't find one.

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[Grenadier1758]

You are not likely to find such charts on line.

Some of the best were in the 1970's Lyman Black Powder Manuals. Lyman did a lot of testing with barrels with pressure sensors.

 

[Zonie]

Hello - I built a CVA percussion rifle, "Kentucky" model with full stock, no patch box, from a kit several years ago. The CVA literature dated 1981 which came with the gun "recommends" a charge of 75 gr of 3F powder.

Fadala's BP book shows and recommends hunting loads up to 120 gr of 3F with either round ball of Maxi-ball.

Have been target shooting with 60 and 70 gr loads, but would like to use it for deer hunting in Minnesota. Any recommendations on powder charge?

Thanks!

Tom

Just in case you don't know, your 60 grain powder load will be pushing the ball to over 1600 fps at the muzzle.
A 75 grain powder load of 3Fg powder will produce over 1800 fps in your .45.

Even at 100 yards, the ball will still be moving along at over 1000 fps. More than enough for deer if your shot is well placed.

Your mentioning Fadala's ridiculous 120 grain powder load causes me to mention an odd thing about roundballs at really high velocities.

The Lyman Black Powder Handbook says that 120 grain powder load will produce a mv of about 2100 fps. Sounds good doesn't it? :grin:

Well, the faster a supersonic roundball flys, the faster it slows down so at 100 yards most of his extra "power" is gone. :hmm:

 

[nightwolf1974]

Not to mention all the wasted powder. 60 grains of 3F in my .45 gives 1700fps and is my standard deer load. If I feel like it, I might go up as far as 70 grains but that's it.

What about 2F loads?

 

[Gooddaytoya!]

I shoot 50 grn of Goex 3f through my .45 muzzleloaders but am only punching paper. You mentioned a hunting load for deer hunting.

I would guess that your 70 grn of 3f BP would be more than proficient for a .45 Cal muzzleloader.

I would also add that Fadala's BP book showing 120 grn of 3F seems to be an extremely heavy load for a .45 Traditional Muzzleloader? :shocked2:

3F produces higher pressure than 2F and there for does not take as much powder to produce the same results. Not for sure but I would guess that for instance, 60 grn of 3F would be equivalent to 70-75 grn's of 2F. So if you shoot 70 grn of 3F it would be like 80 to 85 grn of 2F. That should be more than adequate for a deer hunting load in your .45 muzzleloader.

Of course each muzzleloader is different in what it likes and what is a good worked up load for one isn't necessarily going to be the same for the other.

Just saying that 70 grn of 3F in my mind would be a more than adequate load for .45 Cal.

Others will surely chime in.

Respectfully, Cowboy

 

[Gooddaytoya!]

I don't want to be obvious, but 3F burns more rapidly than two f. Therefore it creates a higher "shock load" within the barrel upon ignition. More pressure at the breach. To speak ad absurdum, smokeless powder creates a really high shock load with its obvious downsides. I've read over and over that the maximum load for any barrel is given by the manufacturer of the barrel. If you had a .45 barrel that was an inch and a quarter in diameter at the butt and an inch and an eighth at the muzzle, you could probably put almost any load of any kind of black powder in it, and if you shoot it at night you can see the fireworks fly 50 feet down range from the unburned powder gouting out the barrel. Fun LOL.

 

[deerstalkert]

I don't want to be obvious, but 3F burns more rapidly than two f. Therefore it creates a higher "shock load" within the barrel upon ignition. More pressure at the breach. To speak ad absurdum, smokeless powder creates a really high shock load with its obvious downsides. I've read over and over that the maximum load for any barrel is given by the manufacturer of the barrel. If you had a .45 barrel that was an inch and a quarter in diameter at the butt and an inch and an eighth at the muzzle, you could probably put almost any load of any kind of black powder in it, and if you shoot it at night you can see the fireworks fly 50 feet down range from the unburned powder gouting out the barrel. Fun LOL.

that was the original use of BP! fired without a projectile just to demoralize the opposing troops with a shower of sparks!

 

[PastorB]

70 grains of 3f is plenty for hunting in a .45, with a PRB or conical. More powder will give you more muzzle blast and recoil, along with less accuracy, but no more killing power. A load of 70 grains will give you 1700fps-ish, depending on the brand of powder, which is about as efficient as it gets with a PRB. More velocity offers nothing of value, as a previous poster pointed out. PRB's slow down quicker the faster you drive them. An additional 300fps at the muzzle, achievable with 90-100 grains of powder, is down to around 100fps advantage out where the action takes place. I personally hunt with 60 grains Goex 3f in my .45 flinter, and during youth season I load it with 40 grains for reduced recoil. Those loads go 1600fps and 1400fps, and kill deer just fine. Most antique original powder measures for .45 caliber class rifles, throw charges in the 60 to 70 grain range. They most likely did not get the fps we get, due to inferior quality powder, yet they killed all sorts of game just fine. Rifles were generally loaded until they "cracked", breaking the sound barrier, and that was considered the proper load for most uses. If they killed deer and bear with a .45 round ball at 1200 to 1300 fps, certainly it can be done efficiently at 1700fps. Just the experience and observations of a muzzleloading hunter/shooter, first starting in 1977.