Dry Ball

[M. De Land]

I think the advice of shooting out balls with ball puller screws and rod tips attached is poor council and said so. I also went to the trouble to explain why and gave a couple of remedies that I have actually accomplished personally. I fail to see how that constitutes a merry go round. It's just a difference of opinion based on experience. Personally I like hearing different methods of doing things and am able to sort out the good ones for myself. MD

 

[cschibi]

Because I can't predict where I am am going to be in between "Public Range" sessions I have resorted to using visual aid(s).

Good ole fashioned post it notes..."Ready to Swab", "Swabbed", "Range Loaded". These three states seem to help me keep in mind where I am when the "Range Master" makes that call for "Cease fire"..and the "Range is Hot"!

 

[Billnpatti]

I had an acquaintance who made little signs like you describe only his were perminant and he attached his to small dowell rods to make little flag-like memory devices which he could place in his bore if he happened to be interrupted while he was loading, swabbing, etc. I have a different memory system. First of all, I have a file mark on my range rod that is level with the muzzle when the gun is loaded. If I am swabbing the bore, I will leave the range rod with the patch on it in the bore. If there is nothing in the bore, it is empty and ready to be loaded. If I have added powder but not yet seated the ball, I leave the funnel of the powder measure sitting in the muzzle. If I have seated the ball and it is ready to shoot, I leave the range rod in the bore. The difference between a loaded gun and one where I am swabbing the bore is that if the loaded mark on the rod is below the muzzle and the rod has a patch on it, I know that I stopped while I was swabbing. If, on the other hand, the rod has nothing on the end and the loaded mark on the rod is even with the muzzle, it is loaded and ready to go. Everyone should have a system so that they can stop in the middle of loading and return and know where they left off. This one is what works for me.

 

[Okie Hog]

First got into muzzleloading in the early 1960s. My mentor was a man who was over 80 years old when we met. "Uncle Joe" was also a gunsmith.

Uncle Joe seldom attempted to pull a ball: Said it failed too often. He would remove the nipple and put a few grains of 4F BP into the bolster or carefully work a few grains of 4F BP into the flash channel with a flexible wire. He would then make sure the ball was seated and fire the gun. Never seen it fail. In all my days on the firing range i have seen one shooter successfully pull a ball. All the other attempts failed due to broken ramrods, threads stripped in the ball, etc.

Loaned a guy my New Englander for deer muzzleloading season. Never again!!! The gun came back nice and clean. Checked the bore with the ramrod. It indicated a complete load in the gun. Capped the gun and attempted to fire it twice with no luck.

Removed the musket cap nipple, cleaned the flash channel out with a wire, worked a few grains of 3F Pinnacle into the flash channel and put a few grains under the nipple seat.

Re-installed the nipple and fired the gun into a sand bank. There was black crud and a patched ball in the sand. The idiot had cleaned the bore of my gun with a load in it: The powder got wet.

 

[cynthialee]

I have only dry balled a revolver. Once.
I have however loaded powder into a wet barrel. :redface:
The way I get it all out is to put some fresh powder under the nipple and fire it out. I don't even attempt to pull the ball. I figured it is alot less work to shoot it out.

 

[majg1234]

I've been shooting muzzleloaders since 1973 and untill recently had 0 success with pulling a ball,dryballed or just to add a new charge or unload it with out shooting.I made a couple of ramrods last year with TOTW covered screws (thought they would look nice)and since that time have NOT failed to pull any stuck or dry balled charges.even pulled a severely fouled ball out of a Hawken my grandson was unable to seat.Did add some moose snot into the bore first though.I highly recomend the TOTW screw

 

[M. De Land]

A range rod is the way to go with loading in general and absolutely critical for pulling balls.
The screw ball pullers should have a caliber specific brass flange on them to keep them centered so they won't allow the screw to bore into the ball at an angle. I've removed balls that had screws pierce them and where angled off almost making contact with the barrel wall on the far side.You would not want to try an shoot this out with the balls screw still attached in my opinion.
I've pulled several balls with my range rod by screwing it into the stuck ball and then hooking the other end, which is an 1.5 inch polycarbonate sphere, into a roof support at our range or a car bumper and pull the rifle away from the rod.This gives you much more leverage and gets you away from the muzzle.
The thing about pulling balls with a screw that works against you is that the lead ball is being expanded as the screw goes in and is getting an even tighter grip on the barrel wall.MD

 

[seleach]

Admittedly, I have not been at this (BP shootin') very long at all and as I mentioned earlier in the thread I always shoot the ball out. I tried pulling the ball once with no success and I figured the reason was as you said MD, "... with a screw that works against you...the lead ball is being expanded as the screw goes in...". I think those TOW would be the way to go except for the expansion of the ball (granted it is working for some folks). I think what would be the berries is if you had two attachments made with caliber specific centering disk and one had a pilot bit and the other had the screw. Sometimes I'd rather NOT shoot the dry ball out.

Am I :youcrazy: or what?

 

[M. De Land]

Well, it just depends on the circumstance.I have shot out dry balls with no trouble for years but when you have a hardened screw possibly threaded through the ball and out the back along with a portion of ram rod busted off in there it makes no sense at all to shoot it out in my mind.
I guess the idea of removing a breech plug seems so scary to most people that they will take chances on ruining a bore to avoid it.
It really is not that big of a deal with the right equipment and I feel it should be done periodically anyway to check for corrosion and to re-lube the threads.
It is more of a problem with a patten breech because they are usually draw filed with the barrel in place and the joint line with browning or bluing is disrupted at that point a bit,when removed.
Having installed and removed both I know from experience that the problem plugs are the ones that have been corroded in place. They almost always require soaking and heat to get out and in some cases have to be bored out. Corrosion always weakens them and on occasion they actually need to be adjusted for a crush fit to the interior shoulder else you may have a very efficient fouling trap that almost insures corrosion. This is one of the reasons I have never cared for under bore size powder chambers.
The silver lining I guess is that barrel breech plugs usually are so massive and have so long a thread that they can sustain a lot of corrosion and still not come apart. MD

 

[Zonie]

If it is possible, I shoot out dry balls by putting a small powder load behind the ball and firing the gun.

For those times this isn't practical and a ball screw is going to be used, pour about a teaspoon of water down the bore before screwing in the ball screw.

The water will do wonders to loosen up the stuck ball/patch.

 

[M. De Land]

I like that! A very good and practical idea. It will soften the fouling under the patch by absorption through the cloth and dissolve the barrel fouling ahead.Had not thought or heard of that before about a week ago when some one else also mentioned that on here.MD

 

[mdbeck1]

I saw one of the CO2 bullet pushers when I was first learning about black powders and bought one. Then I ran out of CO2 canisters. So I bought some from the local store. Later I found out that the local store only carries 12 Gram cylinders and the tool only accepts 14 gram cylinders. There's enough difference that the 12 gram cylinders don't work.

 

[robinsroost]

Go to the Walmart sporting goods section and buy the cylinders for a BB/Pellet rifle. They work fine.....Robin

 

[mdbeck1]

They don't work with my bullet pusher. I found a supplier on E-Bay and bought like 25 of them (14 gram) so I'm set for quite a while.

Thanks for the thought.

BTW: I tried the air compressor thing. I had the nipple out and the rifle set in the vice (150 psi). The bullet came out with enough force to go through the cabinet door.

 

[Joel/Calgary]

I saw one of the CO2 bullet pushers when I was first learning about black powders and bought one. Then I ran out of CO2 canisters. So I bought some from the local store. Later I found out that the local store only carries 12 Gram cylinders and the tool only accepts 14 gram cylinders. There's enough difference that the 12 gram cylinders don't work.

I have one that that is meant for the larger cylinders, but included a spacer to use under the 12g ones if needed. Perhaps you could fabricate a spacer for yours.

Regards,
Joel

 

[seleach]

Hmm, sounds like a good idea to me. I will try that in the [strike]un[/strike]likely :rotf: chance of me ever doing that again.

Thanks Zonie (about two weeks late :redface: )