Elephant Powder

[Rebel]

Yea, i was a member of that sight for a time. Had a disagreement with the board owner so to speak, and was no longer welcome. No lose. This is a much nicer place to hang out.

 

[Dave K]

An earlier post mentioned using Elephant, in a shotgun. That is actually why I bought a case of it. It was cheap and there were at the time good reports on it. But, the batch I got fouled so badly that after about 2 shots it was a struggle to load a shotgun. The fouling was like cement. I don't have that problem with Goex or Schuetzen. I don't shoot Swiss in my shotguns, I really don't need that good of powder for that purpose.
Yes Rebel, I think I heard the same about other very intellegent members from that board. ::

 

[Rebel]

Yea, seems there were a few of us that wore out our welcome by disagreeing with his highness. But, like i said, this is a so much better sight, that i don't know way anyone would want to visit that other place anyway. Great bunch of people here. Thanks to Claude and the moderators for such a great sight.

 

[scott k]

Yea, i was a member of that sight for a time. Had a disagreement with the board owner so to speak, and was no longer welcome. No lose. This is a much nicer place to hang out.

Yea I sort of remember that little disagreement :crackup:
The first BP I got was elephant 2f never had a problem with it going off, It's ok, Geox is cleaner though. Still have part of that can Elephant. ::
Lehigh...

 

[Claude Mathis]

The chief reason Muzzleloading Forum is my favorate site, is, as many of you are finding out, you can be critical of a product or a supplier without fear of being barred.

Do you think those other sites fear losing an advertiser or is it personal bias?

 

[Bob J]

Well, whatever the reason, thankfully they are no longer producing lawn fertilizer, 'er i mean powder.

:haha: My only experience with Elephant was an unopened 1991 can I tried last year in my Kodiak .58. Had just developed THE load for the Kodiak, 100 grains Goex 2f and wonder-lubed ticking prb, when being temporarily out of Goex, decided to pop open the elephant can and try it. :shocking: My beautiful 50 yd Goex group became a buckshot pattern AND the barrel was full of course crud. One of the range officers walking by saw the can and mentioned his buddy reloads black powder cartridges with Elephant Powder. I "donated" the can to him :winking:

 

I think it was personal bias and personality...I then wondered if he owned stock in Elephant...he is one of those people who can't stand it if anyone disagrees with him on any topic and he will constantly nitpick, belittle and criticise those that do in the most unfair ways--goading you into a response which then gives him the excuse to bounce you off the site...my transgression was pointing out that he was violating his own rules of online behavior--he dropped me at once. No loss. There were (are) some nice folks on that site, but I don't know how they put up with his bullying. :imo: I can only thank you for running this much better place to meet and talk....

 

[Tahquamenon]

I can only thank you for running this much better place to meet and talk....

Right on!!!

The Muzzleloading Forum, Claude, the moderators here and the folks that participate are all top shelf in my book!

:hatsoff:

 

[Stumpkiller]

:nono: ff: :nono:


:crackup: :crackup: :crackup: :crackup:
:crackup: :crackup: :crackup:
:crackup: :crackup:
:crackup:

Jus' funnin!

Couldn't resist. :: Not often I get to do that where Claude is involved.

 

[roundball]

I think it was personal bias and personality...I then wondered if he owned stock in Elephant...

he is one of those people who can't stand it if anyone disagrees with him on any topic and he will constantly nitpick, belittle and criticise those that do in the most unfair ways--goading you into a response which then gives him the excuse to bounce you off the site...

Saw that happen several times...went to the brink myself back during those Elephant vs. Goex discussions...there's no question that there had to be good batches of Elephant...but there's also no question that there were horrible batches of Elephant too...and in spite of that logic being put forward by multiple people's personal hands-on experience, and in spite of specifically addressing a certain set of cans from a certain batch #, the reaction was always the same: No, all Elephant is excellent...it must be you, your rifle, your flints, the way you store it, etc, etc, etc...really an interesting (bizarre?) experience to go through

 

[Rebel]

The one i was refering to was Personal bias. That is what the owner used, and so, everyone else should think it is great stuff too.

 

[Rebel]

Lehigh, so, you were a member of that board then too huh? Did you use the same name there? Were a lot of good folks there at one time, but they either got fed up and left, or got booted for disagreeing.

 

...and not just "your rifle, etc"... was the fault, but he would belittle the people, saying that they were incompetent or liars; he would ridicule people...I was quite plain that my problems addressed only one batch of Elephant. Not only was I ridiculed, but also friends of mine, including a fine BP gunsmith friend who agreed with me after working with my techniques, rifles and powder, that the powder was the problem. This proved true when ALL problems went away when I switched powders, everything else remaining the same. He called all of us incompetent or liars, it simply could not be the fault of his precious Elephant. A more closed-minded man I never talked to....be that as it may, I know people who like Elephant powder and the reason I bought it in the first place was that it was recommended by a person who sold a bunch of it to BP cartridge reloaders--he said they loved it; I temporarily could not get Goex and took the chance...it was not just dirty, it would often fail to ignite in my custom flintlock (which has no problems with my current Goex)and several times I had to pull the charge. I consulted my gunsmith friend because I first thought that I was doing something wrong or my rifle was defective, but I was not and it was not. I have been shooting BP since about 1962. Started with the great late lamented DuPont powder. Elephant was the worst stuff I ever used, but I have always admitted that it was probably just the bad batch I had.... :results:

 

[Rebel]

I had the same problems with it. I had always used Pyrodex in my caplocks, but when i got my first flinter i needed REAL BP. So i went in with a friend and we bought a case of Elephant. Thought it was REAL BP. Boy was i wrong. I had all kinds of hangfires and miss-fires, and flashes in the pan. I tried everything i had ever heard to try to improve ignition. Drilled out the vent hole, kept the prime to the outside of the pan, coned the liner, nothing helped. Finally sold the flinter and almost gave up on them thinking it was just flintlocks. But i had the BUG already, so i bought another rifle, Lyman Tradegun. Same problem. Sold that one too. Then i bought another gun and also a case of Goex powder. No more problems. Also, i was lucky to get 3 shots with the Elephant before the bore was so fouled i couldn't ram another ball down. With the Goex i could shoot 15-20 shots and still be able to seat another ball. And clean up with Goex was SO much easier. The Elephant left a hard, crusty fouling that was a real pain to clean. If Elephant was all i had to shoot, i would go back to caplocks and Pyrodex. And i also remember how the fella we are talking about would beliitle people and try to get them fired up so they would say something that would give him an excuse to boot them off. It was like he had a power trip and enjoyed Lording over his Peasants.

 

[Claude Mathis]

:nono: ff: :nono:


:crackup: :crackup: :crackup: :crackup:
:crackup: :crackup: :crackup:
:crackup: :crackup:
:crackup:

Jus' funnin!

Couldn't resist. :: Not often I get to do that where Claude is involved.

Powder? What powder? ::

I'm as guilty as the next guy and I try to remember that. :redface:

 

[Riley/MN]

There were (are) some nice folks on that site, but I don't know how they put up with his bullying.

I don't know if I qualify as one of them, but personally I just find some things not worth arguing about (and some people not worth arguing with). I actually tried to meet up with C... oops that guy once. I think I can pretty much get along with anybody-you guys have heard of "Minnesota Nice", right.

I still check in there and post once in awhile. I think it is the other "friendships" I've built there that keep me going back.

 

[Zonie]

For the number crunchers, for a given amount of powder in the same test barrel, with the same roundball, the Elephant averages 5% lower velocity when compared with Goex.
This is using Lyman test data.

 

[scott k]

No I never joined Rebel, after seeing what would go on I couldn't see joining in on all of the bickering.
I did find this place thru there though. Lots of nice people that get along about most things. Not only that but this place is fun. I love all the joking around. :blue:
Lehigh..
p.s. :thanks: Claude

 

[Rebel]

Yep, i gotta agree with you about this place. Some really great people here. This place helps keep me sane.

 

[Birddog6]

:imo:

Ya'all may not like this but here goes anyway........ :shake:

I think we need the talk about the other site & the problems incurred there, left over there "AT" that site.
Regardless of how I feel about that site or how You feel about that site & people there, or the owner the owner for that matter, (and I am definately NOT taking up for him) I don't think this is not an appropriate subject to speak of on this site.

This is a good site & I like it here & I think it is has some wonderful information to be learned from here by some very helpful people. Let's keep it like it is & let's not bring past problems over to this one & let others problems stay where they were........

What ya say we just let it go & talk about the actual subject....... Powder ?

:m2c: