For anyone considering an Indian manufactured Flintlock

[tenngun]

My point is in relation to the legal and liability-related elements of the previous posts not the validity of proofing or old guns. If you want to question the validity of proofing barrels in today's day and age that's your choice. No amount of proofing replaces or protects from stupidity or stupid mistakes, as noted

Personally, I choose to place more trust in a proofed barrel, a standard process employed for real arms today and for hundreds of years prior, and rely on myself to avoid stupid mistakes as opposed to pretending that barrel proofing is worthless because it doesn't cover stupidity.

If I am injured due to my stupidity or carelessness, so be it. But pretending that products of unknown origin are of a particular quality level or eliminating even a particle of risk to my life to save $900, are not worth it to me.

So you wouldn’t by a Rice or Green Mountian barrel?

 

[Surfinator58]

So basically some of us love India made guns, others hate them, while others don’t seem to mind them, and still others hold mildly negative views of them…sounds normal

Why didn't you post this at the beginning of the thread we could have saved a lot of typing

 

[Rock Home Isle]

Why didn't you post this at the beginning of the thread we could have saved a lot of typing

I know….I feel so foolish.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Time to play Wheel of Fortune..pipe bomb edition...with your Host...Jack Blownapart.

 

[manbat]

So you wouldn’t by a Rice or Green Mountian barrel?

I buy and shoot arms, I don't build, so I can't speak as to the options or quality of any particular manufacturer or product. However, in relation to the point of this post I can say that when life and limb are at risk and there are options, I would spend more on a quality and safety-verified product over one that is not just to save money.

Regulated products require such safety validation and manufacturers that want to show that their products are safe and high quality, spend the money and time to prove it. Just think of how every electronic product sold to consumers is Underwriters Laboratory Listed and tested

 

[French Colonial]

Not sure what you’re talking about, i had a chambers kit a year ago, and it all came in a single box. There was a single transaction for the kit. What ever point your trying to prove, I’d give it a rest and stop making your Friday feel like a Monday.

You obviously have not bought one recently as the barrel on his is seperate

"To save our customers the added expense of an 11% excise tax due on all complete kits that include the lock, stock and barrel, we ask that you purchase a barrel for your kit directly from Buckeye Barrels, LLC:"

This also keeps him from being a firearms manufacturer as he does not sell a complete rifle, same as Kibler.

 

[springfield art]

Save a few more pennies and buy a Pedersoli Indian Trade Musket. For clarification due to this thread, NOT made in India, but made in Italy! I own one and it's close enough to being HC/PC for me. Most importantly it's dead on reliable and accurate.

I've looked at the Peder Trades and the price is right around 1250. Anyway, I'm eyeing a one-off Trade coming up at a sale, appears to be custom made, not India or Pedi. Wish me luck! My interest is casual, just would like to have one, don't NEED one! At reasonable price.

 

[springfield art]

I buy and shoot arms, I don't build, so I can't speak as to the options or quality of any particular manufacturer or product. However, in relation to the point of this post I can say that when life and limb are at risk and there are options, I would spend more on a quality and safety-verified product over one that is not just to save money.

Regulated products require such safety validation and manufacturers that want to show that their products are safe and high quality, spend the money and time to prove it. Just think of how every electronic product sold to consumers is Underwriters Laboratory Listed and tested

True, but did you ever notice how cheaply made and fragile some lighting units are? Even with the sticker.

 

[FlinterNick]

You obviously have not bought one recently as the barrel on his is seperate

"To save our customers the added expense of an 11% excise tax due on all complete kits that include the lock, stock and barrel, we ask that you purchase a barrel for your kit directly from Buckeye Barrels, LLC:"

This also keeps him from being a firearms manufacturer as he does not sell a complete rifle, same as Kibler.

Well i don’t buy kits every week or month. I bought one a year ago and it came in a complete package. Furthermore I spoke to Jim’s daughter today and asked him about this.

He tries to send the kits in a complete package, but parts are often in delay, so if he charges you he has to send you a parted kit while other parts are being finished. The rifle shoppe parts out their orders to, but its not intended to circumvent some law. Its legal own and ship firearms in the United States and each state has their own laws as to who can purchase and what disclosures are required.

India has to ship its assembled muskets with the vent hole undrilled because they have strict firearms laws, even the their knives and swords are required to be dull.

If your goal is to prove that Indian made muskets are of equally quality to that of American Made Kits, i think you’re fooling yourself by trying to fit a set of facts into an innuendo.

 

[French Colonial]

Ad nauseum, why is he asking you to purchase the barrel from Buckeye Barrels?????

There is a difference from being a distributor as some are who sell parts from different sources and someone who manufactures.

We are getting in the weeds here and the people who buy from India could probably care less, To try and return to the topic of the OP I have never even held an India made gun to my knowledge so I can offer no opinion on them.

If the people who own them like them, more power to them, I have always been wanting certain firearms and so I had them made to my specifications, others are happy with production guns from production companies, good for them.

Have a good day!!!!

 

[Surfinator58]

Time to play Wheel of Fortune..pipe bomb edition...with your Host...Jack Blownapart.

You must own an Italian gun

 

[Surfinator58]

I buy and shoot arms, I don't build, so I can't speak as to the options or quality of any particular manufacturer or product. However, in relation to the point of this post I can say that when life and limb are at risk and there are options, I would spend more on a quality and safety-verified product over one that is not just to save money.

Regulated products require such safety validation and manufacturers that want to show that their products are safe and high quality, spend the money and time to prove it. Just think of how every electronic product sold to consumers is Underwriters Laboratory Listed and tested

 

[NorthFork]

So you wouldn’t by a Rice or Green Mountian barrel?

I know this was not directed at me. That said, YES I would buy a Coerain, Rice (non chromoly steel), Oregon, and Green Mountain barrel!!! I own at least one of each. More Colerain than the other two but so be it. Why you ask? Because of a little thing called trust. Let's pick on Colerain for a bit. If their 12L14 barrels start bursting/blowing all over the place, guess what? THEY ARE DONE FOR! Same for Rice. Or GM's barrels. I know GM does not use 12L14, bear with me here. Word gets out that 'kabooms' are a happenin' they are done. Period. End. Of. Story. Indian barrels, well so be it. Blame it on the re-enactors, blame it on cleaning, blame it on.....

 

[Flint62Smoothie]

This post is now 14-pages long … and NOTHING of value has been posted since I commented when it became 7-pages long, LOL!

 

[tenngun]

This post is now 14-pages long … and NOTHING of value has been posted since I commented when it became 7-pages long, LOL!

I hope this doesn’t surprise you.
Take 1 part grumpy old alpha dogs
Add one part muzzle loaders that are them selves ten parts art to one part science
Add one debatable question
Sit back and enjoy the fireworks

 

[TDM]

This post is now 14-pages long … and NOTHING of value has been posted since I commented when it became 7-pages long, LOL!

But its entertaining.

 

[manbat]

NOTHING of value

Isn't that one of the definitions of an opinion? Not sure an online forum would be very interesting without them. Just a bunch of folks spouting facts - boring.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

When you forge...when you produce Steel. and or iron...you are making a metal with crystalline structure. That structure depends on ingredients and how you can machine it or render it into a usable product. I am almost certain there is no QA standards involving Indian muskets...one granule of foul debris...can result in a burst of cheaply produced goods. Like your face? Stay away from this stuff.

 

[Birddog1911]

Snip
Loyalist arms sends the lock separate because Canadian Laws say you can’t ship a working (vented in all) firearm through USA customs,

Are you saying that Muzzleloadershop.com did not receive the lock with the LA pistol that I bought from them?

 

[Birddog1911]

When you forge...when you produce Steel. and or iron...you are making a metal with crystalline structure. That structure depends on ingredients and how you can machine it or render it into a usable product. I am almost certain there is no QA standards involving Indian muskets...one granule of foul debris...can result in a burst of cheaply produced goods. Like your face? Stay away from this stuff.

Show me all of the evidence of owners of Indian made arms blowing up in their faces.

I suspect you've never seen the cave made AK-47s that wreaked havoc for the last 40 years in Afghanistan and Pakistan, without blowing up. And that is at a much higher pressure.