GOEX PLANT

[Wolfman0125]

Yep, I was in a howitzer unit. HQ btry 1/13 FA and C btry 1/14 FA in the 1980’s and I didn’t even think about the military contracts they must have had. Seriously I doubt that the military would allow them to fail despite cutbacks in defense spending. Hense I think that there are other things at play here.

 

[user 48702]

A million pounds is believable, but i don't know how much DOD uses per year.
Why is it believable?
Every artillery round uses black powder:
If it's separate loading,( that is 155mm and up), then sewn at the back of the stack of bags of nitrocellulose powder is a red bag of black powder. That is the igniter. At least a couple of ounces by eye, I never weighed one.
If it's semifixed (105mm) then in the middle of that big metal cartridge case there is a pierced tube full of black powder. That is the igniter.
In both cases the primer sets the black powder off and the black powder is what lights the nitrocellulose powder off.

I don't know how tank main gun ammo is constructed. But i suspect there is an igniter in there too.

Not sure about current rocket propellant increments, whether TOW or MLRS or aerial weapons, but I know Honest John (that has been out of the inventory since 1974) had a big black powder igniter.

Black powder is also used for other purposes; For instance illumination shells and ICM have an ejecting charge, and pyrotechnics like smoke rounds have to be lit somehow.

You beat me to it.

I was not artillery, but as a criminal investigator, at times, I had to investigate incidents where a short round or a range overshoot round landed outside of the safety zone, especially if there was a death, injury, or property damage. If I remember correctly, the BP igniter charge on the 155mm bags is or was 1/2 lb (8 oz) BP. The powder load was tied in sections, like a string of pearls and the BP igniter bag was sewn at the rear. Bags are cut starting at the front of the load in order to adjust for range, i.e. a 1 bag, 2 bag, 3 bag load, ect., as directed by the FDC (Field Direction Center) USMC. On the big 16" Battleship guns, BP was only used as an igniter to boost and ignite the nitro charge. BP is also used as a propellant for the M203 and MK19 rounds, as well as any pop-up flares, ship to shore as well as ship to ship signaling pyros. Wouldn't doubt it if BP was also used for aviation ordnance pyros as well. So unless things have changed in the last 25 years, there is still a defense need.

One has to remember, the military would not just buy for a year-out need, but plan on 5 to 10 years out projected need guarding against supply chain interruptions. Failing to plan ahead will always catch you with your britches down. You never know when or if a crisis would or will occur, but according to Murphy's Law of Combat, poor planning will always sneak up and bite you on the fanny if your not prepared.

 

[nightwolf1974]

You can not find 2f anywhere online......

 

[Wolfman0125]

You can not find 2f or 3F anywhere online......

My local cabelas had 15 jars of 2F triple 7 today. Lagniappe way Tallahassee FL.

 

[nightwolf1974]

"As long as someone" is selling REAL BP, I'll stick with it.

 

[Onojutta]

The DOD ain't buying its powder from Goex.

 

[Woody Morgan]

The DOD ain't buying its powder from Goex.

Not now anyway.

wm

 

[springfield art]

Goex had no competition really to speak of. One plant supplied the continent. I think other factors came into play besides risk assessment and bottom line. I think that it could have been feared to be a potential target or a source of supply for terrorist activities and Goex may have received a friendly suggestion by big bro to close it’s doors. Kind of like how farmers are being paid their subsidies to destroy their crops. Also by the fact in the current anti gun climate BP firearms ( not considered firearms) are the most attainable (though not the most tactical ) are easily obtained without a paper trail. Government can’t legally control who has firearms without violating the constitution. But it says nothing about the control of Ammo does it? Kind of makes them wall hangers and paperweights. However, true woodsmen know how to get around that too.

Biden just forbade imports of modern ammo from Russia. What's next?

 

[Wolfman0125]

Tallahassee FL. Cabelas has Pyrodex and Triple 7 on the shelf. If anyone wants to buy online and ship to store or home. I bought 3 lbs of it a few minutes ago.

 

[HiDesertHunter]

Biden just forbade imports of modern ammo from Russia. What's next?

This will work itself out as well when other ammo producing countries that are NOT banned will ramp up production and start exporting it.

 

[1971fx]

Bought today at local flea market in livingstonville ny 3 pounds pyrodex rs 1 pound elephant brand 4f from Brazil and 1 tin number 11caps the 4f was made by penambuco powder factory does anyone know more about this manufacturer

 

[HiDesertHunter]

does anyone know more about this manufacturer

https://trademark.trademarkia.com/elephant-black-powder-since-1866-trade-mark-78443097.html

 

[1971fx]

The date code is 256/93 which is 1993? Are they still in business

 

[johnfrommd]

I’d just buy up the flintlocks people sell cheap and sit back. Black powder will make a comeback. I know more folks shooting cap and ball revolvers now than in the last 30 years. The demand is there, when the cartridge demand is caught up, muzzleloading stuff will catch up too.

They are still making Pyrodex so the revolver shooters won't be affected.

 

[johnfrommd]

https://trademark.trademarkia.com/elephant-black-powder-since-1866-trade-mark-78443097.html

I believe Elephant is made in Brazil. I have used it before and found it to be less powerful than Goex.

 

[johnfrommd]

Remember that we are all still out here burning powder. Where there is demand there will be supply. It will undoubtedly be supplied at a greater price. The days of below $20 a pound are gone. Other manufacturers will ramp up production. Someone might buy the Goex plant and raise the price to meet the expenses. If not, we'll be buying from elsewhere.

Most of the new muzzleloader shooters are shooting in line rifles. They usually use pellets, either Pyrodex or T7. B P shooting has been in decline for some years. Cowboy shooting is also declining as younger people didn't grow up with John Wayne and Roy Rogers. They want to shoot IDPA and USPSA.

I plan to start making duplex loads for my flinters to see if they are consistant enough for me. If so, I think I have enough BP to last till I hit 80. (Which isn't all that far off)

 

[Brokennock]

Tallahassee FL. Cabelas has Pyrodex and Triple 7 on the shelf. If anyone wants to buy online and ship to store or home. I bought 3 lbs of it a few minutes ago.

No one is saying you can't get Triple7.
Triple7 is NOT black powder.

 

[Wolfman0125]

No one is saying you can't get Triple7.
Triple7 is NOT black powder.

I know this, but it is scarce as well and it is an alternative. Just putting it out there for anyone trying to get something. Hogdon makes Triple 7, Pyrodex and Goex brands. That means Black Powder and it’s substitutes are going bye bye. Only choice will be getting it from overseas or make your own. And today’s political climate ain’t too friendly about importing anything gun related as many are finding out.

 

[Wolfman0125]

I predict that ball mills and sulfur sales will be on the rise soon.

 

[CaptainKirk]

I know this, but it is scarce as well and it is an alternative. Just putting it out there for anyone trying to get something. Hogdon makes Triple 7, Pyrodex and Goex brands. That means Black Powder and it’s substitutes are going bye bye. Only choice will be getting it from overseas or make your own. And today’s political climate ain’t too friendly about importing anything gun related as many are finding out.

Hodgdon has no plans to cut back on Pyrodex or 777.