History of the patch

[Rató:rats]

Brer Toot might not be much of a speller but the hickory remark seemed unkind. .Fileing threads into a brass tip that probably has a threaded hole seems curious but what ever grabs you .
Rudyard

No filed threads on my brass tip. Unnecessary.
I had to look in Wikipedia to see if it was only spelled Hickory here in Canada after he spelled that way in all caps quite deliberately I thought. The question was in earnest.
But good for you for taking up for your boy

 

[Sun City]

Below is a quote by a reputable writer who may be considered to be a gun historian.
He's written enough articles to be considered by many to be an expert.
Historians can obtain info. from a variety of sources, whether from personal writings, or artifacts or from other historians who they trust the references of.
Each person can choose whether to trust the writings of such an expert or not.

George C. Neuman for American Rifleman in Colonial Guns of America wrote:

"Hunting Ammunition: It is evident from the variety of buck and ball sizes combined in the same bullet molds that the 18th-Century hunter relied on mixed loads according to his prey and the prevailing conditions. Unlike the trained soldier who shot a round ball .04 to .06 caliber smaller than the bore to allow for blackpowder fouling (he would normally fire in excess of 60 rounds in battle), the hunter, limited to one or two shots against most game, would load his smoothbore with a round bullet wrapped in greased cloth or thin leather for large animals. This tightly fitted “patched” ball could easily make a 10” group within the normal range of 30 to 60 yds."

Expert....any guy over 100 miles from home with a briefcase!!

 

[tenngun]

They are made from soft wire and sharpen easily. Dull they work with tow or similar loose fiber well but need a sharp point if you try a cloth for cleaning

 

[Zonie]

In the book, "Pictorial History of the RIFLE", by G.W.P. Swenson, © 1972, on page 11 the author, writing of the happenings in the early 1600's, says:

"The problem of loading the ball was considerably simplified at this time by the introduction of the patch. This was simply a thin piece of greased leather or fustian (double woven cloth), wrapped round the ball, to ease its passage down the barrel. This obviated the use of the iron ramrod and mallet, formerly necessary for forcing the ball down. The exact date of introduction is unknown, but it is discussed in The Art of Shooting and Riding, by Alonso de Espinar in 1644." (Also described as, " Treatise on Guns and Shooting ").

 

[megasupermagnum]

Just FYI...I used a triangle file (thin edge) to make a spiral groove on the end of one of my ramrods to better grip and hold the wire worm. I turned the end of the rod into the worm, which left a spiral mark, then removed it and applied the file to the mark, and kept this up until about 2/3rds was "threading" onto the end of the rod. Only takes a few minutes

LD

I like that idea. The thought of nothing but a spring and friction holding to a wood rod doesn't inspire confidence.

 

[tenngun]

I like that idea. The thought of nothing but a spring and friction holding to a wood rod doesn't inspire confidence.

Honest, you put one on and try to pull it off. It’s takes a good grip just to unscrew it.

 

[troy2000]

I like that idea. The thought of nothing but a spring and friction holding to a wood rod doesn't inspire confidence.

Last week I removed the nozzle end from a plasma cutter torch, to replace the electrode. It was just jammed on, over a spring. Pulling it straight out didn't begin to work, and twisting it the wrong direction was even worse. But when I twisted it in the direction of the coiled spring instead of against it, the spring let go and it pulled right off.

Of course the nozzle was against the outside of the spring, instead of the inside, so I wanted to shrink the diameter of the spring instead of expanding it - just the opposite of what you want to do to make a spring grip or let go of a ramrod, But I'm sure the same principles apply. So I don't think I'd lack faith in the grip of a spring coiled around a ramrod end, as long as it was being turned in the right direction... the harder you turn it, the harder it should grip.

Glad I tuned into this thread; it reminded me that I need to sharpen the ends of my patch worm.

 

[toot]

It mine. Too thin. The worm screws down too far to hold much tow.
Is that how they spell Hickory where you’re from?

I am the IGNENT, ILLIGETMENT, IDIOT of a close relation, in the family. very close! so yes to you want to no.

 

[toot]

it is nice to let people know just how smart one is. having a wooden rod that is too thin on one end, get a larger rod that will still fit the barrel. it is not rocket science. I am getting better at spelling.

 

[tenngun]

I have dyslexia that effects my spelling. Names are also real tough for me and recognizing people I see on occasions is also tough.
So I sympathize
So is a word tire or tyre, center or centre. Beats me.
Who told Webster his spelling was correct?
Cognitive test have we can read a passage with every word being misspelled as well as all spelled correctly

 

[Howard Pippin]

Forum Member Elnathan provided the following quote.
James Audubon, c1810, describing his host preparing to go raccoon hunting:

"… He blows through his rifle to ascertain that it is clear, examines his flint, and thrusts a feather into the touch-hole. To a leathern bag swung at his side is attached a powder-horn; his sheath-knife is there also; below hangs a narrow strip of homespun linen. He takes from his bag a bullet, pulls with his teeth the wooden stopper from his powder-horn, lays the ball in one hand, and with the other pours the powder upon it until it is just overtopped. Raising the horn to his mouth, he again closes it with the stopper, and restores it to its place. He introduces the powder into the tube; springs the box of his gun, greases the "patch" over with some melted tallow, or damps it; then places it on the honey-combed muzzle of his piece. The bullet is placed on the patch over the bore, and pressed with the handle of the knife, which now trims the edge of the linen. The elastic hickory rod, held with both hands, smoothly pushes the ball to its bed; once, twice, thrice has it rebounded. The rifle leaps as it were into the hunters arms, the feather is drawn from the touch-hole, the powder fills the pan, which is closed. “Now I’m ready,” cries the woodsman….

Journals, Vol. 2, (1972 reprint), page 492.

I've already replied to this thread once, and now I would like to do it again. Being I mainly shoot 777 3f in my percussion, I wondered how measuring careful my powder charge stacks up by pouring powder over the ball. First I weighed a 50 grain equivalent of 777 With my powder measure set on 50 grains equivalent, and it weighed on my scale 40.2 grains. Then placing the 50 caliber ball in the palm of my hand, slightly cupped, covering the ball with powder by holding my powder container fairly close to the ball, weighted the results and they ran from 39 grains of 777 to 45 grains. I think that's highly shootable to see how accurate the load is, so when spring comes in about four months I will find out. I weighed out Seven different charges, and they all were in that range. When I do get it done, I will show the target on this site.
Squint

 

[Crow-Feather]

.

So can anyone direct me to a writing pre 1850ish, that accurately describes in detail how they loaded a greased cloth patched roundball? Along with that same thinking, can anyone point to a description on how rifles of the era were cleaned and or maintained?

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433082492038&view=1up&seq=261[/QUOTE]
I have read that cleaning of a barrel wasn't always feasible pre 1840 and that often the barrels had to be freshened out when the trapper returned to a settlement. Thus a new ball mold was also necessary. (Depending on the amount of freshening) Also, when material was not available, I have read that leather, thinned out with a knife, and properly lubed would suffice for a patch., I imagine that the trappers did not treat their rifles as kindly as we do ours. One does not need a Ferrari as a hard working tool when a banged up Chevy will accomplish the same.

 

[tenngun]

Some of it has to do with accuracy.
What difference does a charge make? You shoot at fifty yards and your best is 60 grains in a .50, turning out a tight clover leaf. Then you up to eighty and your group opens up to an inch or inch and a half.
Let us say you double charge and you have two or two and a half.
Or you load forty five grains. Now your an inch or inch and a half low. Oh my
Deer won’t care, nor would an Indian looking for a scalp.
Maybe a squirrel won’t get a head shot, and you get neck or shoulders, most of the meats in the back and rear legs, you will have lost little.
I THINK that what counted as accuracy to Boone et al wasn’t the same as what counts to someone at the Nationals

 

[tenngun]

.

So can anyone direct me to a writing pre 1850ish, that accurately describes in detail how they loaded a greased cloth patched roundball? Along with that same thinking, can anyone point to a description on how rifles of the era were cleaned and or maintained?

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433082492038&view=1up&seq=261

I have read that cleaning of a barrel wasn't always feasible pre 1840 and that often the barrels had to be freshened out when the trapper returned to a settlement. Thus a new ball mold was also necessary. (Depending on the amount of freshening) Also, when material was not available, I have read that leather, thinned out with a knife, and properly lubed would suffice for a patch., I imagine that the trappers did not treat their rifles as kindly as we do ours. One does not need a Ferrari as a hard working tool when a banged up Chevy will accomplish the same.
[/QUOTE]
Joe Meek gave an oral history to a lady on his adventures west. He recorded how in his first year on traveling in brigade to the Rockies the brigade leader, I think Sublett, made a round inspecting rifles. One man’s gun was dirty and he was told to clean it. Later he was back and the gun wasn’t cleaned. Again he was ordered to clean it. A third time the gun was still dirty and the leader asked Joe if he could clean the gun for ten dollars.
Joe jumped at the opportunity. The owner of the gun chuckled that both came out ahead.
He didn’t have to clean the gun and Joe made ten dollars. The owner was less then happy when he found that the ten dollars came out of his pay.
As most of us have learned dirty guns don’t work. Locks get gummed up, you can’t get a ball down bore, ect.
Worms were sold with guns, I doubt many men who survived a year on the frontier carried a dirty gun.

 

[jtuck004]

There is tremendous discussion of various patches for a roundball on the internet. Plenty of modern sources of patches, and information on them. The thing that is bothering me, is that I am finding next to no reference to patches in period writings. I'm looking through old books, and at best I'm seeing a passing mention of a patch, but no real detail. In a book posted in another thread, a book mostly about fowlers, there is reference to two methods of loading a rifle. One is to use a larger than bore ball, and beat it down with an iron rod and a mallet. The other is to use a thin leather patch with grease on the outside. No mention of a cloth patch. Again this book is mostly on fowlers, and seems to be written with a British point of view in 1789. It was mentioned that the bare ball was the common method, and the leather patch was a method used by the Germans. It is again interesting that no mention of a short starter or any other tool besides the ramrod was used.

So can anyone direct me to a writing pre 1850ish, that accurately describes in detail how they loaded a greased cloth patched roundball? Along with that same thinking, can anyone point to a description on how rifles of the era were cleaned and or maintained?

https://babel.hathitrust.org/cgi/pt?id=nyp.33433082492038&view=1up&seq=261

In the story "The Long Rifle" by Stewart Edward White he tells the story of a shooting contest won by a smart gunsmith and a new technology, patching a ball.