home defense

[allanbrooks]

ok this should be fun keep in mind non child home that is not a issue how about a flintlock that hangs on your wall being loaded and primed incase of a emergency, before evereyone goes nuts i do own other firearms that i have in the home for protection but i was wandering is a last ditch my bess musket on the wall could be utilized . lets see what comes of this post. and by the way thank you all for all the great info i have recieved from this site a big help to newcomers to the black powder world.

 

[rabjr]

I dunno, I just don't see it in this day and age. Unless the gun is hung up loaded and primed, it's basically a club in a last ditch situation. Myself I'll put my faith in a more modern approach to the situation and keep my Flintlocks for hunting. :v

 

[Josh Smith]

I live in the country.

That said, all my firearms are kept loaded and the one nearest to me is the one I will grab first. This is usually my carry pistol.

However, the MLing rifles are in there, and you'd be surprised at how fast a leather capper can be utilized when I have to make a longer shot, or feel I need more power or accuracy than what the carry weapon can deliver.

Having had extensive H2H training, I find MLers are awesome polearms as well. The only guns that seem a bit better in this regard are main battle rifles with bayonets affixed.

So, would I use 'em? I will and have against questionable woodland critters.

First choice? Not if there is a repeating longarm in reach.

Josh

 

[alex efremenko]

Does it have a bayonet? :grin:

 

[Josh Smith]

You know, you joke, but I just looked up "Brown Bess bayonet" on Google.

It kicked up pictures of a triangular spike -- not a blade.

Those wounds are very hard to heal compared to the blade type. In fact, I do believe they've been outlawed by the modern Rules of War (either Hague or Geneva).

Russia stopped using them after the Mosin-Nagant, as did most other countries I'm aware of, save for China. They kept their spikes on their SKS carbines.

Again, if I remember correctly, they fall under that "needless suffering" clause.

Josh

 

[bangfxr]

There were two types of bayonets for the Bess. one was a plug bayonet that is a blade and the handle would slide onto the barrel making it more or less a pike and user can't fire it until the bayonet was removed. The other far more practical bayonet was the dull tri-edged socket bayonet which allowed the weapon to be fired while retaining the bayonet. Countries that still use the spike bayonet are as follows, China, Vietnam, N, Korea, The entire middle east. to name a few.
As for undue suffering for a criminal breaking into my house its tuff on him. I'll use whats at hand as its my house and family he threatened. Mr. Winters could you please be quick with your Hefty XL bags Thank you.

 

[Josh Smith]

There were two types of bayonets for the Bess. one was a plug bayonet that is a blade and the handle would slide onto the barrel making it more or less a pike and user can't fire it until the bayonet was removed. The other far more practical bayonet was the dull tri-edged socket bayonet which allowed the weapon to be fired while retaining the bayonet. Countries that still use the spike bayonet are as follows, China, Vietnam, N, Korea, The entire middle east. to name a few.
As for undue suffering for a criminal breaking into my house its tuff on him. I'll use whats at hand as its my house and family he threatened. Mr. Winters could you please be quick with your Hefty XL bags Thank you.

Oh, I don't disagree at all, Sir. I think the entire concept of "needless suffering" in war is a strange thing, anyway.

Even if I were to afford the "courtesy" of shooting an enemy soldier with a full metal jacket in a war, I would not do so with any criminal bent on doing me harm.

In an optimum scenario, I'd have an expanding round which became a tortilla upon impact, and continued through-and-though.

Same with the bayonet.

I prefer the old style bayonets, the ones on which one could cook sausages over a campfire. Modern bayonets make nice steak knives :thumbsup:

I would think that a Brown Bess could be turned into a relatively effective claymore mine, albeit trigger fired from the shoulder.

Perhaps make a tool to split the wad vertically after packing, then dump in a handful of 000 buck? They should spread horizontally with the split wad.

It would be an awesome area weapon with maybe a 30 to 45 degree kill zone...

Just thinking here.

Josh

 

[Ray-Vigo]

The smoothbore Bess actually would be a strong defensive weapon, provided you had it loaded or could load very quickly. It could be loaded with ball or shot, making it somewhat like a home defense shotgun. The main issues I see are the slow loading and the sheer size being quite long for use in a confined space. But it's absolutely viable if it's ready to go.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

If I had to go that route I'd prefer a short blunderbuss. Even modern shotguns are handicapped by their length for close quarters use and a musket is way too long even without a bayonet.

 

[gordy]

It seems the subject of home defense with Black Powder weapons comes up on many sites over the years .
don"t get me wrong , but unless you live in an area of high incidents of home invasions . We need to weigh the dangers to the rest of the family members in using a firearm in the home .Most homes are no more then drywall panels over stud framed walls and a larger cal. weapon will punch its way through several of these walls before it comes to rest . This is one reason smaller cal. weapons are suggested for home defense . There is nothing wrong with using a BP hand gun properly loaded and stored where small children who have not been trained in firearms safety can"t have access to it.
In my opinion a properly loaded and maintained BP revolver is as good a modern handgun . The idea of using a long BP gun inside the home presents many problems . If your counting on a fixed bayonet as a back-up for the one shot you have I think you"ll find that in confined spaces it is hard to control . On another BP site a fellow says he walks about his home with two BP revolvers strapped on. I feel this is a bit excessive , if in fact you use up 5or 6 rounds and don"t hit the intruder what makes him think 5 or 6 more will be better ? The truth is in most homes the distance of your target will be from 0 to 10 feet . One other point i"d like to bring to your attention is all the weapons in the world will do you no good if tou don"t pull the trigger with the intent to take the attacker out. This is why it"s important to train all in your family the propper use of whatever defense gun(s) you decide on. :thumbsup:

 

[Claude Mathis]

If you're using a firearm because you fear for your life, wouldn't you want the most modern, efficient weapon possible? I can't think of a reason to use a muzzleloader in a situation like that.

 

[Snow on the Roof]

I tend to agree with Claude. If my family's or my life where to be threatened I would want a more contemporary arm for protection. A 1911 or Glock in .45 ACP come to mind, perhaps a short barreled shotgun with a long tube. As the range in most home defense situations is measure in feet not yards I would think a Bess would a rather poor choice.

Snow

 

[Twice boom]

Winchester Model 12 Cylinder bore loaded with OO would fit that bill nicely. And you wouldn't need to worry about killing your neighbor..

Twice.

 

[rafterob]

You've got to accept the extra added wow factor of using the Bess for home defense. Poor fellows would probably think they had been shot at with a cannon and go running. Plus you'd have a good smoke screen to hide behind.

 

[Dphar]

ok this should be fun keep in mind non child home that is not a issue how about a flintlock that hangs on your wall being loaded and primed incase of a emergency, before evereyone goes nuts i do own other firearms that i have in the home for protection but i was wandering is a last ditch my bess musket on the wall could be utilized . lets see what comes of this post. and by the way thank you all for all the great info i have recieved from this site a big help to newcomers to the black powder world.

You got a bayonet for the Bess :grin:
Any firearm is better than no firearm and usually shooting one perp will discourage the rest unless they are doped up then?

Criminals often run in packs like wolves, especially in home invasion scenarios. The Bess is really too long for use indoors, its hard to sneak the muzzle around a corner unobtrusively.

AR with 52-77 gr HP (depending on rifling twist) its better than a shotgun especially for people who are recoil sensitive and the mag and rifle can be kept separate if that is a factor and loading is quick.
It is less likely to over penetrate, go out of the building than a handgun with decent stopping power and it will defeat most soft body armor too.
In house the short barrel type with a collapsible stock is preferred.
Then go to the range with some cheap ammo and do some shooting in realistic scenarios.
I just bought some 52 gr HP factory loads for the wife but the weather has been too crappy to go shoot. They only need function test.

Dan

 

[BrownBear]

I've got plenty of modern arms. I also have a baseball bat behind each door.

I'd replace the bats with short Bess's. I bet they'd swing pretty good, and that big old butt would sure make a good thunk on someone's head. :hatsoff:

 

[Josh Smith]

If you're using a firearm because you fear for your life, wouldn't you want the most modern, efficient weapon possible? I can't think of a reason to use a muzzleloader in a situation like that.

Speaking for myself only, I often have to defend my home from rampaging raccoons.

Muzzleloaders work well in this role! :thumbsup:

Know what you could do... dump in the powder, then add aluminum or magnesium. Mount, below the barrel, a recoil-operated camera, and you'd have yourself a good defense in court! :rotf:

 

[Dave Rosenthal]

This pretense is just silly :rotf: .

A 12 ga. with high brass #4's is good for inside. It won't over-penetrate, and an ounce of lead is still an ounce of lead hitting the perp!

Sometimes just the sound of a 12 ga. pump going into battery is enough of a "detergent" against crime to scare-away the bad guys! I call it the "Star-Trek Universal Translator" cause it breaks ALL language barriers! :rotf: :haha: :shocked2:

Dave

 

[larry wv]

Not many home invasions in the rural areas. Most people have at least one gun. That said they almost always have 3 or more when it does happen. They won't hear the slide on a pump gun here as I want to get all of them I can. Their is no reason to scare an intruder off. They will just find an old lady for the next target. I think the plan should be for more than one intruder. This post is just my opinion and not against any other posters ideas. Larry Wv

 

[rabjr]

I live in the country.

That said, all my firearms are kept loaded and the one nearest to me is the one I will grab first. This is usually my carry pistol.

However, the MLing rifles are in there, and you'd be surprised at how fast a leather capper can be utilized when I have to make a longer shot, or feel I need more power or accuracy than what the carry weapon can deliver.

Having had extensive H2H training, I find MLers are awesome polearms as well. The only guns that seem a bit better in this regard are main battle rifles with bayonets affixed.

So, would I use 'em? I will and have against questionable woodland critters.

First choice? Not if there is a repeating longarm in reach.

Josh

Good luck putting a cap on a Bess...