How Far Can You Make Successful Kill Shots ?.

[ADK Bigfoot]

I recently went to my local range and found an unmolested deer-sized steel target (full scale) at 100 yards. I had planned to shoot some paper at 50 and 75 yards, but thought I'd take my first shot at that fresh silhouette. Loaded, fired offhand, and hit dead square in the vitals. So I loaded and shot 6 more; offhand, flintlock .50 caliber, open sights. Orange silhouette, wide open field, measured 100 yards, setting sun behind me. All seven were good solid kill shots.

I shoot six matches per year at an open air range where we shoot steel out to 100 yards. I consistently win or place at 50, 75, and 100. Targets are as small as a chicken and as large as a fire extinguisher. Painted white or orange.

Every day I have two or three does walk through my property. Moderately to heavily wooded. Faces East from my house. Deer between twenty and 90 yards. Same rifle, same sights, aiming offhand, I am not confident of getting a clean vital shot off at over 50 yards. Long rifle open sights, dappled light in the woods, aiming from beneath my deck into the woods, especially early AM or late afternoon, I find it nearly impossible to get a clear consistent sight picture in the kill zone. Could I hit a deer there? Absolutely. Could I be sure of a one-shot kill? Not over 50 yards. Light really changes things.

ADK Bigfoot

 

[64Springer]

I hunt in the woods. That's it.

No deer ever killed was past 40 yards. Most well under 40. Killed one at 11 yards. I zero at 40 yards.

And forget all that hitting a paper plate stuff. That's child's play and not a true representation of deer vital organs. Fold a standard brown paper lunch bag in half and hit the center of that.

Now you have some wiggle room if you buckle under the pressure of pulling the trigger.

 

[Quicksilver]

And forget all that hitting a paper plate stuff. That's child's play and not a true representation of deer vital organs. Fold a standard brown paper lunch bag in half and hit the center of that.

Now you have some wiggle room if you buckle under the pressure of pulling the trigger.

I you must have smaller deer than I hunt or bigger lunch bags or both.

 

[Jedidiah]

co

Sorry man, but I have been fighting this attitude of, "minute of bad guy," or in these cases, "minute of deer vitals," since I started teaching practical pistol shooting 25 or so years ago. This attitude irritates the heck out of me. It can be dangerous in the practical shooting arena or unethical in the hunting arena.
If minute of bad guy is the best one cab do with their pistol or carbine under controlled range conditions (and controlled emotional conditions), that person is in for a very rude awakening if ever really put to the test. At best, they will lose, at worst, they will shoot and kill the wrong person (we had an actual case of that here some years back). With hunters, if the best they can do at the range is keep all their shots in an area (can't even call it a group) the full size of the vitals, at known distances, under controlled conditions and with no emotional stress, it leaves them wide open to a variety of factors causing them to at best miss completely, and at worse wound an animal leaving it to suffer. The animal suffers because some human settled for, "good enough."

Sorry.
Like I said, the subject gets me fired up, so off I went again.

Couldn't agree more. too many people also think there skill set is better than it really is. They are not honest with themselves. IMHO

 

[DCAN]

Sorry man, but I have been fighting this attitude of, "minute of bad guy," or in these cases, "minute of deer vitals," since I started teaching practical pistol shooting 25 or so years ago. This attitude irritates the heck out of me. It can be dangerous in the practical shooting arena or unethical in the hunting arena.
If minute of bad guy is the best one cab do with their pistol or carbine under controlled range conditions (and controlled emotional conditions), that person is in for a very rude awakening if ever really put to the test. At best, they will lose, at worst, they will shoot and kill the wrong person (we had an actual case of that here some years back). With hunters, if the best they can do at the range is keep all their shots in an area (can't even call it a group) the full size of the vitals, at known distances, under controlled conditions and with no emotional stress, it leaves them wide open to a variety of factors causing them to at best miss completely, and at worse wound an animal leaving it to suffer. The animal suffers because some human settled for, "good enough."

Sorry.
Like I said, the subject gets me fired up, so off I went again.

Well said and so true!

 

[Dale Lilly]

learned a hard lesson as a 14 year old in Colorado. I watched from a ridge as three guys hit a doe 5 times from about 50 yards. She ran on three legs, dragged herself on two and tried to get up after four shots. I sat and cried.

 

[64Springer]

I you must have smaller deer than I hunt or bigger lunch bags or both.

Standard lunch bags.

 

[64Springer]

co

Couldn't agree more. too many people also think there skill set is better than it really is. They are not honest with themselves. IMHO

Very...well...said...indeed.

The worst thing about deer hunting is that my store runs out of paper plates.

 

[Sun City]

The only time I ever 'walked' hunting was when I shot quail! I sit on my arse for deer hunting....and let the game find me! Surprising what one can see when using good binocs! Due to my 'style' of hunting deer/elk I am always able to use a rest when making a shot!

 

[64Springer]

Sorry man, but I have been fighting this attitude of, "minute of bad guy," or in these cases, "minute of deer vitals," since I started teaching practical pistol shooting 25 or so years ago. This attitude irritates the heck out of me. It can be dangerous in the practical shooting arena or unethical in the hunting arena.
If minute of bad guy is the best one cab do with their pistol or carbine under controlled range conditions (and controlled emotional conditions), that person is in for a very rude awakening if ever really put to the test. At best, they will lose, at worst, they will shoot and kill the wrong person (we had an actual case of that here some years back). With hunters, if the best they can do at the range is keep all their shots in an area (can't even call it a group) the full size of the vitals, at known distances, under controlled conditions and with no emotional stress, it leaves them wide open to a variety of factors causing them to at best miss completely, and at worse wound an animal leaving it to suffer. The animal suffers because some human settled for, "good enough."

Sorry.
Like I said, the subject gets me fired up, so off I went again.

And the best post in this thread goes toooo.....

 

[Brokennock]

I believe Elmer Keith is credited with saying ‘I like one-shot kills where possible and prefer to do all my hunting before I shoot’.

Edit: Corrected spelling

Thank you. I suspected that was the case. It has been a while since I read, "He'll I was there." But it was among my favorites for a while. I paid a lot for my original copy

 

[Brokennock]

It's all good, I just couldn't resist that quote, "Stripes" is full of good zingers.

Yup, one of my favorite and most quoted movies.
If you look back through my posts you'll see that much to other's chagrin I've used these,

a time or three. Lol

 

[Dale Allen Raby]

I use gallon jugs and can hit them at 100 yards, but realistically, I consider my maximum range with open sights to be about fifty yards... which is where I sight in.

 

[Brokennock]

learned a hard lesson as a 14 year old in Colorado. I watched from a ridge as three guys hit a doe 5 times from about 50 yards. She ran on three legs, dragged herself on two and tried to get up after four shots. I sat and cried.

Thanks,,,
That just broke my heart.

A ridge in Colorado might just be far enough from town that those three guys may have had to suffer the same fate as that doe.

 

[64Springer]

Thanks,,,
That just broke my heart.

A ridge in Colorado might just be far enough from town that those three guys may have had to suffer the same fate as that doe.

We need a thread called: Cry In Your Beer Hunting Moments.

I had one deer hunt like that. Took a lot of getting back in the saddle to get over it. I still can't hunt squirrels over what I did to one of them. Hate just thinking about it. I need to go out and shoot one in the face so I can get my man card back.

 

[S.Kenton]

I try and get the deer as close as possible, must be the archery hunter in me…. BUT, I have killed deer at 115 yards with my 54 custom hawken. I’ve also shot deer at 90 with my Lyman GPR in the same caliber. These are offhand shots that I done. I anticipated these longer shots when I put my stand up, so I was able to practice over and over and over. Sometimes 4 days a week. I started by working up a load off a sturdy rest, after I had a good group at that longer range, I shot at 1 gallon water jugs at 125 yards off hand. I wasn’t satisfied until I was hitting 10 out of 10 shots. So a quick story, after I was confident enough to hunt at a longer range than I’m used to, my hunting buddy’s wanted to come to my range and sight in thier unmentionables…. Wanna see some stunned faces? They couldn’t hit a paper plate at 50 yards offhand and here I am hitting minute of deer at 125 yards off hand with my “ antique” as they called it. Lol a couple of them got thier own Lyman GPRs shortly after that…

 

[Ben Meyer]

That's some good shooting, Mr. Kenton! Offhand, I definitely shoot my percussion Hawken better, but this past weekend I had the flintlock TN Mth rifle at the range.offhand at 50yds, all 5 shots I took were on the target(@ a 5" group, a little to the right). Then I shot a few at 100yds. Someone had a steel target, I'd guess to be 9"×18" out there. No way would I take an offhand shot at an animal at that distance with that gun. Leaning against a post, I missed the 1st shot, hit it the 2nd.

Like most anything, it boils down to gear and time. An inaccurate gun is just that and it's hard to overcome. But with a good gun with a well worked up load, hours of range time it what it takes to get good. I got good gear, maybe someday I'll have the time!

 

[cynthialee]

anything inside of 50 yards I am dead sure it is dead bambi

now if I have a good clean shot and time to take the shot with perfect body mechanics, I am willing to go out to 75 yards
at the range I am doing 100 yards just fine, but I have never made that shot count at that distance in the field, so I quit trying and mainly stay inside of 50

 

[Jedidiah]

anything inside of 50 yards I am dead sure it is dead bambi

now if I have a good clean shot and time to take the shot with perfect body mechanics, I am willing to go out to 75 yards
at the range I am doing 100 yards just fine, but I have never made that shot count at that distance in the field, so I quit trying and mainly stay inside of 50

I'm right there with you!!

 

[SOLANCO]

I try and get the deer as close as possible, must be the archery hunter in me…. BUT, I have killed deer at 115 yards with my 54 custom hawken. I’ve also shot deer at 90 with my Lyman GPR in the same caliber. These are offhand shots that I done. I anticipated these longer shots when I put my stand up, so I was able to practice over and over and over. Sometimes 4 days a week. I started by working up a load off a sturdy rest, after I had a good group at that longer range, I shot at 1 gallon water jugs at 125 yards off hand. I wasn’t satisfied until I was hitting 10 out of 10 shots. So a quick story, after I was confident enough to hunt at a longer range than I’m used to, my hunting buddy’s wanted to come to my range and sight in thier unmentionables…. Wanna see some stunned faces? They couldn’t hit a paper plate at 50 yards offhand and here I am hitting minute of deer at 125 yards off hiTand with my “ antique” as they called it. Lol a couple of them got thier own Lyman GPRs shortly after that…

It ain't the gun. It is the operator.
I do not care if your zero is off by an order of magnitude. If you know POI relative to POA you can put a hurting down range.
Should you bring POI and POA into agreement? Well DUH yeah.
I do believe this is a lot more difficult with BP and muzzleloaders. A given batch of unmentionable cartridges is going to have virtually identical characteristics. One front stuffed load to the next? Doubtful.