I'd like to get some opinions on a matter

[LonePine]

In late December I posted about trying to find a rifle. Well from then until now my search has yielded nothing to me. I have been so busy with work that I havent been able to travel out of state to the well known Muzzleloading shops or the different fairs. Ive been able to find at least 5 rifles though that are worth buying. One is a .45 Kibler SMR kit with a 46" Barrel that hasnt been started yet. The second is a Maryland Longrifle kit that hasnt been started yet from Track of the Wolf. The final two are a Traditions Mountain Rifle with a Brass tube scope and a Taylor Volunteer Whitworth .451. The first two are flintlock rifles and the last two are Percussion. I was deadset on Flintlock but to be honest any rifle will do now. Has anyone ever assembled a Track of the Wolf or Kibler kit ? This being said Ive never done a kit but am willing to give it a try. I dont have pictures of the kits or the Whitworth which is New in Box but I do have a picture of the Traditions that I will post. The Whitworth Rifle is priced about $2,000 the seller is firm. The Maryland LR kit is $1,350 and right now the TOTW website is Out of Stock of everything for that kit so I cant base the seller's price against the TOTW price. Lastly the Kibler SMR kit seller wants $1,450 for his kit since Kibler doesnt offer a 46" barrel anymore. The Traditions Mountain Rifle seller is still undecided on his sale price and asked what Id offer to which without any knowledge couldnt reply. If I could get some feedback on the matter that would be swell. Im trying to decide if I should get one of the kits or just go for the finished rifles. Thanks to all who reply I know this is one hell of a wierd thing to ask.

 

[david w]

I would go for the Kibler. Even though it's expensive, it's worth it in quality and also ease of build. By the price, it sounds like the Kibler has the extra fancy maple. My SMR has the extra fancy maple, and it is one very nice piece of wood!

 

[SmoothboreMurph]

In late December I posted about trying to find a rifle. Well from then until now my search has yielded nothing to me. I have been so busy with work that I havent been able to travel out of state to the well known Muzzleloading shops or the different fairs. Ive been able to find at least 5 rifles though that are worth buying. One is a .45 Kibler SMR kit with a 46" Barrel that hasnt been started yet. The second is a Maryland Longrifle kit that hasnt been started yet from Track of the Wolf. The final two are a Traditions Mountain Rifle with a Brass tube scope and a Taylor Volunteer Whitworth .451. The first two are flintlock rifles and the last two are Percussion. I was deadset on Flintlock but to be honest any rifle will do now. Has anyone ever assembled a Track of the Wolf or Kibler kit ? This being said Ive never done a kit but am willing to give it a try. I dont have pictures of the kits or the Whitworth which is New in Box but I do have a picture of the Traditions that I will post. The Whitworth Rifle is priced about $2,000 the seller is firm. The Maryland LR kit is $1,350 and right now the TOTW website is Out of Stock of everything for that kit so I cant base the seller's price against the TOTW price. Lastly the Kibler SMR kit seller wants $1,450 for his kit since Kibler doesnt offer a 46" barrel anymore. The Traditions Mountain Rifle seller is still undecided on his sale price and asked what Id offer to which without any knowledge couldnt reply. If I could get some feedback on the matter that would be swell. Im trying to decide if I should get one of the kits or just go for the finished rifles. Thanks to all who reply I know this is one hell of a wierd thing to ask. View attachment 134240

Well hello again LonePine its been a while since you've posted on here. Let us see if I could shed some light on the situation. Lets start with the kit rifles. First of all the seller of the Kibler SMR is correct. The 46" barrel has been replaced with a 44" barrel and a 43.25" on the Colonial. In the white puts that kit at around $1,700 to $1,900 whereas in pieces the kit is around $1,300 so the seller is just a hair above the money. The Maryland Long Rifle on the other hand requires a decent breakdown. First of all what caliber is it ? They are offered in .36, .40, .45 and .50. If you were to buy a .50 caliber 42"×7/8" barrel regular maple with all the brass it would be about $1,300. Secondly, I've never done a TOTW kit but apparently they require some decent time and effort unlike the Kibler which is mostly drop and fit ( I dont know about older Kibler Kits). Moving on to the Whitworth, either way a Taylor (Pedersoli) or a Parker-Hale Whitworth will set you back $1,800~$2,800. They have a notoriety that surrounds them. The reproductions bear the same rifling as the orginials and with a telescopic sight are real marvels. Which brings us to the last rifle. The Traditions Mountain Rifle is a rifle Ive heard little of. That being said it will probably handle close to the Thompson center flint .50 your friend let you hunt with. You also get the added bonus of a "period correct (looks only) telescopic sight of around the 1840's to 1870's. I would say that rifle is worth no more than $500 as it has definitely seen some use. Hope this helps.

 

[Jaeger]

Kits vs finished rifle comes down to your skill level with woodworking and mechanical aptitude. I am working on my second TOTW "kit" right now. The first was a Jacob Dickert Pennsylvania Longrifle with a flintlock, and the one now is a Jaeger rifle, also flintlock. I have "kit" in parentheses because although they are pre-inlet (the barrel channel and lock mortice are started, as well as other parts) you will have to do a LOT of chiseling, carving and inletting to finish the gun. I am not knocking the TOTW kits, however. Their quality is good and they will give you help and advice if you have a problem and call them up! I learned a great deal doing the first TOTW kit and I'm still learning on the second one. Also, these are not things to rush, believe me. You need to be patient and careful and plan your work and do a lot of measuring twice or thrice and cutting once. You will appreciate how a gun is put together when you are done. At times the work is frustrating. I am still not satisfied with the quality of my inletting....lol I hope this helps you make a decision. I have said to myself many times: "No more gun kits! My next gun will be ready to go and I will spend the extra money!"

 

[LonePine]

I would go for the Kibler. Even though it's expensive, it's worth it in quality and also ease of build. By the price, it sounds like the Kibler has the extra fancy maple. My SMR has the extra fancy maple, and it is one very nice piece of wood!

Sadly no, it the stock is Walnut and its plain looking at best not fancy at all looking compared to whats on Kibler's website.

 

[LonePine]

Well hello again LonePine its been a while since you've posted on here. Let us see if I could shed some light on the situation. Lets start with the kit rifles. First of all the seller of the Kibler SMR is correct. The 46" barrel has been replaced with a 44" barrel and a 43.25" on the Colonial. In the white puts that kit at around $1,700 to $1,900 whereas in pieces the kit is around $1,300 so the seller is just a hair above the money. The Maryland Long Rifle on the other hand requires a decent breakdown. First of all what caliber is it ? They are offered in .36, .40, .45 and .50. If you were to buy a .50 caliber 42"×7/8" barrel regular maple with all the brass it would be about $1,300. Secondly, I've never done a TOTW kit but apparently they require some decent time and effort unlike the Kibler which is mostly drop and fit ( I dont know about older Kibler Kits). Moving on to the Whitworth, either way a Taylor (Pedersoli) or a Parker-Hale Whitworth will set you back $1,800~$2,800. They have a notoriety that surrounds them. The reproductions bear the same rifling as the orginials and with a telescopic sight are real marvels. Which brings us to the last rifle. The Traditions Mountain Rifle is a rifle Ive heard little of. That being said it will probably handle close to the Thompson center flint .50 your friend let you hunt with. You also get the added bonus of a "period correct (looks only) telescopic sight of around the 1840's to 1870's. I would say that rifle is worth no more than $500 as it has definitely seen some use. Hope this helps.

The Maryland Rifle is .50 caliber. Thanks for all the input as usual. Secondly thanks for giving advice on the Traditions Mountain Rifle.

 

[LonePine]

Kits vs finished rifle comes down to your skill level with woodworking and mechanical aptitude. I am working on my second TOTW "kit" right now. The first was a Jacob Dickert Pennsylvania Longrifle with a flintlock, and the one now is a Jaeger rifle, also flintlock. I have "kit" in parentheses because although they are pre-inlet (the barrel channel and lock mortice are started, as well as other parts) you will have to do a LOT of chiseling, carving and inletting to finish the gun. I am not knocking the TOTW kits, however. Their quality is good and they will give you help and advice if you have a problem and call them up! I learned a great deal doing the first TOTW kit and I'm still learning on the second one. Also, these are not things to rush, believe me. You need to be patient and careful and plan your work and do a lot of measuring twice or thrice and cutting once. You will appreciate how a gun is put together when you are done. At times the work is frustrating. I am still not satisfied with the quality of my inletting....lol I hope this helps you make a decision. I have said to myself many times: "No more gun kits! My next gun will be ready to go and I will spend the extra money!"

How many hours do you think with zero experience I would pour into a Maryland Long Rifle kit. The barrel dovetails have been cut as well as underlugs soldered on and breech plug installed. I would like to get a hunting rifle ready for this year's deer season with some time in between finish and deer season to get some practice shooting in.

 

[david w]

Sadly no, it the stock is Walnut and its plain looking at best not fancy at all looking compared to whats on Kibler's website.

I just visited the Kibler site. You can get a SMR fancy maple kit fir $1,250 or a plain maple for $1,130. But you better hurry!

For builders of contemporary flintlock long rifles

 

[hanshi]

The only thing I can say about your predicament is that I'm glad it's you and not me. I hate making decisions but sometimes you just can't escape them. Since time is one of the factors in your case which is the quickest to get/build and have time to shoot before deer season.

 

[PathfinderNC]

There will be a newly built .50 cal. Cherry stocked Kibler rifle for sale in a day or so

 

[Jaeger]

How many hours do you think with zero experience I would pour into a Maryland Long Rifle kit. The barrel dovetails have been cut as well as underlugs soldered on and breech plug installed. I would like to get a hunting rifle ready for this year's deer season with some time in between finish and deer season to get some practice shooting in.

Hard to say about the hours, but unless you have a lot of time to spend working on the gun during the months between now and the fall, you are not going to have enough time. You really don't want to rush it! The barrel lugs are an important step to have finished, but that doesn't take as much time as some of the inletting, drilling holes on centers so that you can install the bolts, etc. I always have the breech plug installed on my kits, so that's not even a consideration for me. Just guessing, maybe 30-50 hours?

 

[LonePine]

Hard to say about the hours, but unless you have a lot of time to spend working on the gun during the months between now and the fall, you are not going to have enough time. You really don't want to rush it! The barrel lugs are an important step to have finished, but that doesn't take as much time as some of the inletting, drilling holes on centers so that you can install the bolts, etc. I always have the breech plug installed on my kits, so that's not even a consideration for me. Just guessing, maybe 30-50 hours?

So it seems that both kits are out of the question to me. I work 12hrs a day 6 days a week so I would only maybe be able to avg at a max 4 hrs a day if even that maybe 6-8 on a Sunday. Thanks for that info I didnt think itd be that long of a job. I guess I might look into my other two options.

 

[Murphinator]

In late December I posted about trying to find a rifle. Well from then until now my search has yielded nothing to me. I have been so busy with work that I havent been able to travel out of state to the well known Muzzleloading shops or the different fairs. Ive been able to find at least 5 rifles though that are worth buying. One is a .45 Kibler SMR kit with a 46" Barrel that hasnt been started yet. The second is a Maryland Longrifle kit that hasnt been started yet from Track of the Wolf. The final two are a Traditions Mountain Rifle with a Brass tube scope and a Taylor Volunteer Whitworth .451. The first two are flintlock rifles and the last two are Percussion. I was deadset on Flintlock but to be honest any rifle will do now. Has anyone ever assembled a Track of the Wolf or Kibler kit ? This being said Ive never done a kit but am willing to give it a try. I dont have pictures of the kits or the Whitworth which is New in Box but I do have a picture of the Traditions that I will post. The Whitworth Rifle is priced about $2,000 the seller is firm. The Maryland LR kit is $1,350 and right now the TOTW website is Out of Stock of everything for that kit so I cant base the seller's price against the TOTW price. Lastly the Kibler SMR kit seller wants $1,450 for his kit since Kibler doesnt offer a 46" barrel anymore. The Traditions Mountain Rifle seller is still undecided on his sale price and asked what Id offer to which without any knowledge couldnt reply. If I could get some feedback on the matter that would be swell. Im trying to decide if I should get one of the kits or just go for the finished rifles. Thanks to all who reply I know this is one hell of a wierd thing to ask. View attachment 134240

That rifle looks pretty cool with the scope on it kinda like something youd see an Independent Company of Sharpshooters carry. My Great Great Grandfather when he mustered out of the 2nd Maryland Infantry due to wounds in 1864 was enrolled into the State Militia and there are photographs of men in the Maryland Militia with Rifles topped with brass scopes.

 

[Murphy_Roberts]

In late December I posted about trying to find a rifle. Well from then until now my search has yielded nothing to me. I have been so busy with work that I havent been able to travel out of state to the well known Muzzleloading shops or the different fairs. Ive been able to find at least 5 rifles though that are worth buying. One is a .45 Kibler SMR kit with a 46" Barrel that hasnt been started yet. The second is a Maryland Longrifle kit that hasnt been started yet from Track of the Wolf. The final two are a Traditions Mountain Rifle with a Brass tube scope and a Taylor Volunteer Whitworth .451. The first two are flintlock rifles and the last two are Percussion. I was deadset on Flintlock but to be honest any rifle will do now. Has anyone ever assembled a Track of the Wolf or Kibler kit ? This being said Ive never done a kit but am willing to give it a try. I dont have pictures of the kits or the Whitworth which is New in Box but I do have a picture of the Traditions that I will post. The Whitworth Rifle is priced about $2,000 the seller is firm. The Maryland LR kit is $1,350 and right now the TOTW website is Out of Stock of everything for that kit so I cant base the seller's price against the TOTW price. Lastly the Kibler SMR kit seller wants $1,450 for his kit since Kibler doesnt offer a 46" barrel anymore. The Traditions Mountain Rifle seller is still undecided on his sale price and asked what Id offer to which without any knowledge couldnt reply. If I could get some feedback on the matter that would be swell. Im trying to decide if I should get one of the kits or just go for the finished rifles. Thanks to all who reply I know this is one hell of a wierd thing to ask. View attachment 134240

If you have the time message the forum member @AZMuzzleloaders. He usually has some rifles on hand for sale he even has a .50 cal Lanacster style for sale right now. I think on another website (G*nBr*ker) he had about 15-20 rifles for sale. You could always give him a ring. Also thay Traditions Mountain Rifle does look neat with that scope on top im suprised no one is reccommending her.

 

[Daryl Crawford]

I'd message @PathfinderNC
His work has looked pretty good.

 

[Stykbow]

Well, let me be the first to say I’d go for the Traditions rifle. The others are fine rifles, but they just don’t appeal to me.

 

[Murphinator]

Well, let me be the first to say I’d go for the Traditions rifle. The others are fine rifles, but they just don’t appeal to me.

I think that scope on there looks cool, it reminds me of the old civil war documentaries depicting sharpshooters at Devil's Den or the sharpshooter who shoots General Reynolds in the Gettysburg Movie.

 

[brushblind]

In late December I posted about trying to find a rifle. Well from then until now my search has yielded nothing to me. I have been so busy with work that I havent been able to travel out of state to the well known Muzzleloading shops or the different fairs. Ive been able to find at least 5 rifles though that are worth buying. One is a .45 Kibler SMR kit with a 46" Barrel that hasnt been started yet. The second is a Maryland Longrifle kit that hasnt been started yet from Track of the Wolf. The final two are a Traditions Mountain Rifle with a Brass tube scope and a Taylor Volunteer Whitworth .451. The first two are flintlock rifles and the last two are Percussion. I was deadset on Flintlock but to be honest any rifle will do now. Has anyone ever assembled a Track of the Wolf or Kibler kit ? This being said Ive never done a kit but am willing to give it a try. I dont have pictures of the kits or the Whitworth which is New in Box but I do have a picture of the Traditions that I will post. The Whitworth Rifle is priced about $2,000 the seller is firm. The Maryland LR kit is $1,350 and right now the TOTW website is Out of Stock of everything for that kit so I cant base the seller's price against the TOTW price. Lastly the Kibler SMR kit seller wants $1,450 for his kit since Kibler doesnt offer a 46" barrel anymore. The Traditions Mountain Rifle seller is still undecided on his sale price and asked what Id offer to which without any knowledge couldnt reply. If I could get some feedback on the matter that would be swell. Im trying to decide if I should get one of the kits or just go for the finished rifles. Thanks to all who reply I know this is one hell of a wierd thing to ask. View attachment 134240

This looks like the rifle that's on G Broker auction sight , scope and all. The Kibler kits just went up but not 1450.00 and I just got an email from them for a couple of models that only have a two week wait. The worst thing you can do is get in too big of a hurry, take your time.

 

[SmoothboreMurph]

After taking a second look I'd say the seller of that "Traditions" has it wrong. That is actually a CVA Mountain Rifle and judging by only one ramrod pipe it was made before 1989. Still a good rifle none the less.

 

[slspletskp]

I'd message @PathfinderNC
His work has looked pretty good.

X2 for Pathfinder. Very talented