India Barrel Failure

[DixieTexian]

No one knows exactly what they are made of simply due to the fact they are sold as non firing props. It's like buying medicine in the 1800s, you have no clue what you're getting.

They are sold domestically as fully functional muzzleloaders, if I recall correctly. It's only when they are sold for export that they leave the touch hole undrilled.

 

[SDSmlf]

if you want to shoot that junk, go ahead, literally no one is stopping you.

Kind of like this CVA @ChuckJonesWagon posted about in post #234 in this thread.

CVA percussion barrel that has been in my shop for about ten years. So, I cut the barrel down …… take a look at the barrel occlusion that I found .

 

[Coinneach]

Not to change directions or muddy up the waters here, but last year I was working to build a flintlock that a young person or small frame person could shoot. I had a CVA percussion barrel that has been in my shop for about ten years. So, I cut the barrel down and then, since I wanted a hook breech, I cut the barrel to make one.

This was all pure luck as I could have rotated the barrel one more flat and never seen this. But take a look at the barrel occlusion that I found in the barrel. I did not use the barrel. This was a 50 cal 15\16" barrel.

WOW !

 

[Rudyard]

WOW !

Well good in a way perhaps it will quieten the India knockers.! I've never owned a CVA or any such offering barring a Parker Hale Enfield .Incidentally they sent so many guns to the Birmingham Proof house all 577 & 450 barrels cost less so I put my 58s & 450s round ball rifles in at that reduced rate .it is a private gun trade concern not a Govt affair. I shot the P Hale once ere I sold it on. (I've my old one dated 1859) . As for that barrel with the void it might have stood using , might not be a good look but might have stood well enough .We will never know. Do I roundly condemn such guns ? No.
Incorrigible Rudyard

 

[Brokennock]

Well good in a way perhaps it will quieten the India knockers.!

Wishful thinking.
They aren't going to quiet down, and they aren't going to try and look at the supposed issue with any sense of objectivity or scale.

Once "Henny Penny" starts crying that the sky is falling, she is about as likely to stop as a pine squirrel is likely to stop barking at you because you don't really pose a threat and are sitting still deer hunting. Same with the, "all India made guns are bad," "Never glue a powder horn base plug," "take precautions to avoid static electricity with your powder," "NEVER use fine powder in larger bores," crowd.

 

[Coinneach]

"Military Heritage Indian muskets: 2 years later...."
By 11 Bang Bang

​

 

[Frontier's]

When you experts can post where the barrels are made, who makes them, what steel they are made of, what they are proofed at, what kind of load data comes in the booklet with the gun, how long the breech plug is, etc, then you'll have something.

Till then, it's a 'mater stake to anyone with some sense.

There's a reason why a lot of places ban them.

Better yet, take one apart, completely, and make a post showing everything. The breech plug would be extremely interesting to see.

 

[French Colonial]

I have no skin in this game at all, I have never even seen an "India gun" that I know of however.....

Name any manufacturer that provides the following
"When you experts can post where the barrels are made, who makes them, what steel they are made of, what they are proofed at, what kind of load data comes in the booklet with the gun, how long the breech plug is, etc, then you'll have something."

Not trying to provoke, there is enough animosity on this thread, but it seems you are asking for what does not exist from any.

 

[Frontier's]

Most companies state what materials are used for barrels. Especially load data that comes with the gun.

 

[Coinneach]

When you experts can post where the barrels are made, who makes them, what steel they are made of, what they are proofed at, what kind of load data comes in the booklet with the gun, how long the breech plug is, etc, then you'll have something.

Till then, it's a 'mater stake to anyone with some sense.

There's a reason why a lot of places ban them.

Better yet, take one apart, completely, and make a post showing everything. The breech plug would be extremely interesting to see.

Well as a critic what can you offer to support your POV ?

 

[FlinterNick]

I have no skin in this game at all, I have never even seen an "India gun" that I know of however.....

Name any manufacturer that provides the following
"When you experts can post where the barrels are made, who makes them, what steel they are made of, what they are proofed at, what kind of load data comes in the booklet with the gun, how long the breech plug is, etc, then you'll have something."

Not trying to provoke, there is enough animosity on this thread, but it seems you are asking for what does not exist from any.

If you were contact Pedersoli, traditions, Armi sport, any barrel maker in the USA they can tell you what steel the barrels are made of. They fully disclose it. Pedersoli even has a video demo of how their barrels are made, drilled etc. Not sure how you can say this information does not exist, it certainly does exist.

 

[FlinterNick]

When you experts can post where the barrels are made, who makes them, what steel they are made of, what they are proofed at, what kind of load data comes in the booklet with the gun, how long the breech plug is, etc, then you'll have something.

Till then, it's a 'mater stake to anyone with some sense.

There's a reason why a lot of places ban them.

Better yet, take one apart, completely, and make a post showing everything. The breech plug would be extremely interesting to see.

Here is a breech plug from a veteran arms brown Bess, shared with by a member on the forum. I’ve seen a few like this from other dealers. the threads are shallow cut, and the plug length varies, the center hole is there for machining purposes, the plugs also flange to the back of the barrels, they do not seat like a typically shouldered plug.

While i think in most instances, there are no safety issues, I don’t like the design at all and don’t trust it.

 

[Frontier's]

Looks like the inside of black pipe. Very porous looking inside those threads.

 

[FlinterNick]

Looks like the inside of black pipe. Very porous looking inside those threads.

It’s like a hybrid of a bolstered breech for a flintlock, with a lot less meet in the breech and threads. The barrels are also very very straight and skinny, the concept of a triple tapered barrel is generally not met with most Indian made barrels.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

I have no skin in this game at all, I have never even seen an "India gun" that I know of however.....

Name any manufacturer that provides the following
"When you experts can post where the barrels are made, who makes them, what steel they are made of, what they are proofed at, what kind of load data comes in the booklet with the gun, how long the breech plug is, etc, then you'll have something."

Not trying to provoke, there is enough animosity on this thread, but it seems you are asking for what does not exist from any.

A great summation on this subject.

 

[sussexmuzllodr]

Sounds like this Indian Gun thing is like a scratch off Lottery Ticket....except you lose and not win....

 

[Frontier's]

 

[French Colonial]

View attachment 332568

And this is from where?

 

[Frontier's]

And this is from where?

Directly off Middlesex.

 

[Frontier's]

This is also off Middlesex website.

They also state that India muzzleloaders are safe to shoot.

Sounds like a squib load or when you dry ball and pull the nipple and charge it to pop the ball out.

You're musket is no louder than a loud cough... India muskets are safe.. yeah sounds like real accurate info to me.

Also found some load info.