lead hardness of patched round balls

[hrt4me]

I have acquired 4 percussion rifles, but I have yet to fire one... hopefully that will change soon! If I plan to fire patched round balls, then my understanding is to select a round ball maybe 0.010 under bore size and then utilize an appropriately-thick patch which will grab the barrel's rifling and spin the ball.

If this is correct, then does the ball never contact the rifling? And if so, then does it matter (or not) whether that lead round ball is pure soft lead? Or can it be harder, i.e. cast from alloyed lead?

 

[Old Hawkeye]

Pure lead only in Traditional ML's. Harder alloy balls will be difficult to load & will not properly engage the rifling. Same with conicals. Hard bullets won't obturate into the rifling & your bullets will not stabilize. Lots of posts here on the subject. Just do a search.

 

[rafterob]

Properly matched patch and ball combinations will be a fairly tight fit and alloy balls will make it difficult to load. If you load a lead ball with a strip of patching just past the muzzle and then pull it out, you will see the rifling lands impressed through the patching on the ball.

 

[Grenadier1758]

While the lead round ball may never touch the rifling, as @rafterob states, the soft lead, as the ball compresses the patch, will impress into the patching and will take the spin induced by the rifling. So, while a harder ball can be loaded in a muzzle loading rifle, the best performance with respect to accuracy on target will be accomplished with a soft lead ball.

When I use buckshot in my 36 caliber rifle that is harder than a pure lead ball, I do get reasonable accuracy on target, but my groups are larger. Not too large to be unsuitable for squirrel hunting, but larger none the less.

 

[tenngun]

I have acquired 4 percussion rifles, but I have yet to fire one... hopefully that will change soon! If I plan to fire patched round balls, then my understanding is to select a round ball maybe 0.010 under bore size and then utilize an appropriately-thick patch which will grab the barrel's rifling and spin the ball.

If this is correct, then does the ball never contact the rifling? And if so, then does it matter (or not) whether that lead round ball is pure soft lead? Or can it be harder, i.e. cast from alloyed lead?

If you load a soft lead ball in a proper thickness patch and you pull the ball with out shooting and look close you will see impression of the thread left in the ball. This is the patch ‘gripping’ the ball.
Even the fastest ml shoots rather slow, and it doesn’t take a lot of spin to stabilize the ball. Ml of old often had one turn in 48 inches, and many guns today have 1/56,1/66, 1/72 twist rates.
Hard lead just won’t get as good a grip, so they can strip the rifeling and not pick up a predictable twist.
shot at lower velocities it can work, but to get a good fit it’s a bugger to load, and if it’s easy to load it won’t shoot as well as it can.
Shot in a smoothbore harderlead can work just fine. Copper was often used but that’s a bit expensive and not real easy to cast at home.

 

[hrt4me]

thank you, that makes sense

 

[Urban Coyote]

I once had about 300 lb of linotype bars, I'd probably still have most of it but my brother took it upon himself to dispose of it while I was working out of state. Anyway I gave some to a friend who cast some .490 roundballs. Against my advice he used these to hunt deer. He shot a mule deer doe we never recovered. Since we never found the critter I can't be sure of his shot placement but I'll bet that linotype ball never expanded.

I too have shot buckshot on my .36 caliber and as mentioned elsewhere here accuracy is not as good as pure lead.

 

[Stony Broke]

I had a good supply of linotype bars at one time and used them to cast modern bullets. I even used soft lead for that kind of bullets, but I would add tin and linotype to it to harden up things. For a round ball, a guy just wants the softest lead you can find, so it will follow the rifling in the bore with no problems and load easily. I have cast a lot of the old tape on wheel weights into round balls, and they worked great, but I understand they are using a tougher type of material nowdays that wouldn't be proper. The clip on wheel weights were a harder mix that would work okay for lower loads in modern weapons, but were just too hard for round balls.

 

[springfield art]

I just picked up a bit over 9 lbs. of nice soft lead at a swap meet. ($10.) It 'scored' nicely with just my fingernail scratching it. You guys posted some good comments about this subject. Thanks.

 

[mooman76]

Soft lead is more desirable that hard. I shot hard lead for years because I didn't have pure lead. It shot just fine. It cast a few thousandths larger than pure so you may have to use slightly thinner patches. Try it and see. If that's all you have then use it. I even won some events using harder lead so I can't be all that bad.

 

[tom_in_vt]

Pure lead only, for the reasons stated above.

 

[Frontier's]

I once had about 300 lb of linotype bars, I'd probably still have most of it but my brother took it upon himself to dispose of it while I was working out of state. Anyway I gave some to a friend who cast some .490 roundballs. Against my advice he used these to hunt deer. He shot a mule deer doe we never recovered. Since we never found the critter I can't be sure of his shot placement but I'll bet that linotype ball never expanded.

I too have shot buckshot on my .36 caliber and as mentioned elsewhere here accuracy is not as good as pure lead.

A 1/2" projectile is already larger that most centerfire bullets expand to. Most likely a lousy shot, complete miss, a non fatal wound or lousy tracking.

 

[FPDoc]

I have acquired 4 percussion rifles, but I have yet to fire one... hopefully that will change soon! If I plan to fire patched round balls, then my understanding is to select a round ball maybe 0.010 under bore size and then utilize an appropriately-thick patch which will grab the barrel's rifling and spin the ball.

If this is correct, then does the ball never contact the rifling? And if so, then does it matter (or not) whether that lead round ball is pure soft lead? Or can it be harder, i.e. cast from alloyed lead?

I would agree .490 ball in .50 cal or .530 ball in .54 cal. etc. Most have prob tried .435 and .535 balls to obtain smaller groups (I just move closer) but it can be a lot harder to load, which makes it less fun and my front sight wandering about is my biggest barrier to smaller groups.

Pillow ticking is a good start for patches (cotton NOT polyester, cotton doesn't melt).

Not sure if red or blue stripes on the ticking are more accurate.. grin

Pure lead is just what people usually use because of things already mentioned like engagement of rifling, ability to mushroom effectively and it is historically correct. Also since they are usually patched balls there isn't a leading problem which is one of the biggest reasons for use of lead alloy for projectiles.

 

[M. De Land]

I have acquired 4 percussion rifles, but I have yet to fire one... hopefully that will change soon! If I plan to fire patched round balls, then my understanding is to select a round ball maybe 0.010 under bore size and then utilize an appropriately-thick patch which will grab the barrel's rifling and spin the ball.

If this is correct, then does the ball never contact the rifling? And if so, then does it matter (or not) whether that lead round ball is pure soft lead? Or can it be harder, i.e. cast from alloyed lead?

I've used wheel weights to good effect. If they don't cut or blow the patch and have a good snug fit then the lead hardness is not to critical in my experience.

 

[stikshooter]

I've used wheel weights to good effect. If they don't cut or blow the patch and have a good snug fit then the lead hardness is not to critical in my experience.

Depends on ones definition of accuracy (varies) with the shooter./Ed

 

[Bigpete]

Soft lead is more desirable that hard. I shot hard lead for years because I didn't have pure lead. It shot just fine. It cast a few thousandths larger than pure so you may have to use slightly thinner patches. Try it and see. If that's all you have then use it. I even won some events using harder lead so I can't be all that bad.

Exactly my findings too

 

[josie wales]

When I first started hunting with a muzzle loader I had no idea about lead hardness. I had access to pig lead ingots and cast a bunch of .56 round balls. Talk about hard starting, I would load my TC the night before and use a hammer to seat the bullet with the recommended patch. The round balls measured out @ .552. I had to use a thin patch for a second shot. Later, I checked the lead hardness and it was 7.7. Using roofing lead all the problems ended. The pig lead is excellent for casting .38 and .45 handgun loads.

 

[FishDFly]

Depends on ones definition of accuracy (varies) with the shooter./Ed

Accuracy, 10X's and minute of garbage can

 

[sportster73hp]

The only issue i have had with alloy is that it casts a larger ball. Not a problem with a 45 or larger bore but there isn’t as much room for error in my 36. I do leave wheel weights for modern guns.
If you are casting a .490 ball for a .500 hole the lead should not touch the rifling anyway if a cloth patch is used.

 

[DuncNZ]

Pure lead is best , in fact it is the only lead to use in any projectiles used in muzzle loaders . One problem those of you who used hardened lead is the weight and size of your projectiles will probably vary from batch to batch , Pressure will rise from batch to batch , especially with Minnie balls or slugs .