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USPS is a good way to go because the post office will cash the checks that day if they have the cash on hand, if they are fake they won't cash, as long as you haven't shipped you item yet your not out anything. I have used PayPal a lot without any fraud, the key is to get paid first before shipping.
Good post, thanks. I guess I've been a bonehead depositing postal money orders in the bank & waiting for them to clear in the bank, instead of cashing them at the post office. Well, I'll be doin that a lil differently from now on lol
 
I was looking for caps and found a few sites that claimed to have them. Problem is the price doesn't make sense. ,,$5 a tin was just too good to be true. Then they wanted to be paid through PayPal friends and family, cash app or venom. Sent and email asking if I could pay over phone with credit/debit card. That was 3 weeks ago and no answer. On top of that while on their site I started getting a "your security needs updating. Don't get that on other sites. When you are trying to buy up to 250 tins (for my mz club) that's too much money to buy and there is no financial safety net.
 
There are ways of avoiding these buying and selling difficulties -- but they do involve a bit more expense. Often for high-ticket items (and more frequently for lower priced ones), it is possible to use an escrow approach where the funds are not released until the buyer and seller have come to a final resolution -- and a record of all transfers and deliveries are kept. Yeah, it's a bit more complicated and might cost a few extra bucks. But it just avoids these simplistic scams involving "trust" on the one side or the other (or both).
 
Good to know on info! Looks like I buy or sell with Postal MO only.... Thanks
I had a postal money order canceled on me about 10 years ago. Fortunately bad weather had prevented me from getting the 25 miles to sent item out before bank called
 
I had a postal money order canceled on me about 10 years ago. Fortunately bad weather had prevented me from getting the 25 miles to sent item out before bank called
I'm pretty sure USPS money orders cannot be canceled, they can be replaced if lost or stolen. Are you sure it wasn't from somewhere else?
 
I'm pretty sure USPS money orders cannot be canceled, they can be replaced if lost or stolen. Are you sure it wasn't from somewhere else?
It looks like this depends on what "cancel" means. It appears that there is a well-documented mechanism for "replacing" a money order if it's lost or destroyed -- at least if it hasn't yet been cashed. There's a form you fill out attesting that you "lost" the money order, and this is "investigated" (though apparently this only goes so far as to determine if it has already been cashed), and then you get the money order "replaced" to you. So if I pay you with a USPS money order, and then -- before you have a chance to cash it -- I file for a replacement ... Well, it looks like you'd be out of luck. At least that's how I read the process from USPS.

The lesson from this seems to be that if you get a postal money order, CASH IT IMMEDIATELY -- and before you send anyone anything they "bought" from you. Another way of putting this is that a money order isn't payment, the cash you get from it is (or at least a successful deposit of that in your bank account is).
 
Bogus checks are becoming common.

Picked this up from the CLR site and thought I would share it. Everyone has how they want to be paid when selling, some want personal check and some USPS Money Order.

"Also be aware the bank may credit your account after about 5 days, but can still come back at you up to 25 days on a bad check This bit of info from a member on the Colt Forum. BE CAREFUL!!!!!!!!!"

Shipping soon after a check clears may not be wise unfortunately. Seems now a USPS money order might be better.
My check only. I have a lot of patience and will wait as long as you wish for it to clear and for you to feel safe.
If a scammer gets my money order I am S.O.L. There are about 1200 US Postal Inspectors. Compare that to the number of IRS agents and see if you feel comfortable about the sanctity of your USPO money order. If a scammer cashes your money order and says he never got it? Good luck.
 
As a former telephone bill collector that use to deal with the lies & the cries.....
this thread is exactly why I only deal with well established businesses or a face to face
transaction in a well lit public location.
I'll drive a reasonable distance if its something I'm looking for.
No getting burnt doing that.

burning-finger-300x300.jpg
 
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As a former telephone bill collector that use to deal with the lies & the cries.....
this thread is exactly why I only deal with well established businesses or a face to face
transaction in a well lit public location.
I'll drive a reasonable distance if its something I'm looking for.
No getting burnt doing that.

View attachment 129192
so true!
 
As a former telephone bill collector that use to deal with the lies & the cries.....
this thread is exactly why I only deal with well established businesses or a face to face
transaction in a well lit public location.
I'll drive a reasonable distance if its something I'm looking for.
No getting burnt doing that.

Unless that face to face sells you something stolen, and it was a cash transaction.... heck even a check or debit card might not help you. OR..., Might be a while for you to get relief from the seller if at all. ;)

Dealt with a fellow who bought a car and had the title and all. He got tags for it..., and it was more than a year later that a mechanic told him that the VIN on the dash board was real, but didn't belong on the car as it didn't match the "hidden" VIN on the firewall. A cash face to face transaction at a dealership had happened though...,

The car was stolen and the title was to the junked car where the dash had been removed and placed into the stolen car, which was then sold as legit. Yes the dealership was legit, but that particular car had been sold by the employee as the employee's, so.... good luck finding the guy, and the car went to the insurance company.

For our purposes, had a case where a black powder firearm was bought from a reputable gun store. There was a unique identification mark placed on the gun barrel below the stock line (this is why you don't "defarb" the serial number on a factory gun folks) and the gunshop had not seen it, or if they did they didn't understand what it was. The owner didn't know what the number was, but more than a year after the purchase, asked the right person who knew how to check... yep stolen.

You've known the guy for years at the LGS. You buy something expensive, only to find out it was stolen, and when you go back to the guy, you find out he's bankrupt, wasn't really the upstanding guy you thought, and you are out the money and the gun since it went back to the proper owner or the insurance company..., OR the guy passes before you figure out the gun was stolen, and his estate isn't going to mitigate your loss, OR..., he's a gunsmith and is working on restoring something for you, passes and the executor auctions off the contents of the shop, including any remaining customer guns (yours included) before you get "the word" that the fellow has passed... good luck suing the executor...

You can mitigate your risk, but there is always a risk.

LD
 
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You can mitigate your risk, but there is always a risk.
So true. And you get in trouble when your "want" meter overrides your risk meter and you can't apply a reasonable thought process. When I mentioned some of the events and complaints in this thread to my wife, her response was "Why in the world are people trying to buy expensive things like this from people they don't know and in ways they can't recover from a mistake?" My only answer to that was "Because they want them -- and think they're getting a good deal. -- or because they think they need them. And because they don't want to spend any extra money in providing some kind of insurance against the bad deal." So they decide to ignore the risk or to diminish it. After all, while there are perfectly sound objective and mathematical representations of risk, there's always a subjective element to it. And you can just do with that part of risk as you want -- and then either get lucky or whine about it later. :rolleyes:
 
Unless that face to face sells you something stolen, and it was a cash transaction.... heck even a check or debit card might not help you. OR..., Might be a while for you to get relief from the seller if at all. ;)
LD

When it is framed like that, there is no assurance of any item being legit.
It would be even be easier to sell stolen guns over the internet, especially dealing with someone across the country you'll never meet.
Thanks for posting this.
I'm definitely going to be even MORE cautious dealing with buying things on the internet now.
I'm still sticking with face to face transactions in public well lit places.
 
I'm definitely going to be even MORE cautious dealing with buying things on the internet now.
I'm still sticking with face to face transactions in public well lit places.
Well, it depends a lot on whom you're buying from. It's not just an internet issue. Buying from an established company with a credit card always leaves you an out in terms of disputing the charge in one form or another; but more importantly, it reduces your risk of bad or at least fraudulent transactions to as close to zero as you can get. I don't think Midway USA is going to cheat me. And if somehow they do, I think they'll make good on a challenge to it. And if they don't do that, then I can at least dispute the charge. Same for TOW, etc., etc.

It's these PRIVATE sales with virtually no reliable information about the seller (or if you're selling, buyer) that are the problem. But little one-man/craftsman-type companies can be problematic. However, even then, if it's a REAL company, the same approach will work. Hatta Services is a good example of that. So is TOW and other such companies in the shooting area. Otherwise, someone with no public "footprint" or verifiable reputation -- and of course especially private individuals -- substantially raise the OBJECTIVE risk, and you need to not let your SUBJECTIVE desire for something overwhelm that (which we're all subject to at times :rolleyes:).

It's interesting to me that I see so many problems of such sales complained about on this forum. I participate in two forums oriented to brass musical instruments in which there are frequent sales and purchases among individuals and on Ebay. Those transactions look a LOT like the ones I see here -- except that in those cases there are virtually NO complaints of broken deals or scams. And these purchases typically involve relatively fragile instruments being sold for thousands of dollars, and often involve critical packing and shipping methods, and intercontinental sales including import duties, etc. I don't know why there's such a difference regarding these kinds of sales in the two domains. My only speculation is that in the case of things like BP firearms, buyers and sellers are just not thinking about the risk, are unreasonably trusting in people they don't know, and just don't want to take certain types of precautions. Again, one approach to guard against losing a big chunk of money would be to set up some sort of escrow arrangement -- either with an online escrow company (these are out there) or even with a local gunshop that for some small fee might agree to act as an agent. I haven't tried this, but I'm pretty sure I know at least one shop within about 45 minutes of me here that would do this.

Otherwise, I don't understand the extent of the problem as it's been described here -- except it seems to involve people sending money to other people they really shouldn't trust, and then complaining when those people weren't trustworthy. I also wonder (though I haven't made an effort to investigate this) if it isn't age-related.

In terms of face to face transactions in public places, at this point in time I would even be very careful of that since all three of the cities around here are having continuing incidents of robberies and shootings on a daily basis -- and this includes locations such a large and well-lit shopping mall that used to be perfectly safe, parking lots of food markets, gas stations, and Walmarts, etc. If I were to do such an exchange, I'd do it in a local Police, Sheriff department, or State Police parking lot.
 
I do buy quite a few items on this forum and one other. But there, it is relatively easy to check a sellers track record. Has he sold things to other members? Were they satisfied purchasers? Any problems?
And many times, you already have some sort of relationship with the seller, previous correspondence, etc. Never been burnt (yet), thank Heaven!
With companies? Many have reviews of their product or services - read them. If a company is generally tardy in shipping, or packaging is insufficient, you are forewarned.
Always be mindful of the old saying, "Buyer beware!"
 
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