Shooting brassers loose.....

[Stantheman86]

Has anyone actually "shot loose" a recently manufactured brass frame revolver?

I'm just curious, I had "heard" that Pietta changed the alloy of the brass to make them about as durable as a steel frame.

The price difference is negligible at this point, for an extra 30 or 40 bucks I'd say just get a steel frame....I have both brass and steel frame guns, I just like how the brass frame Colt clones look.

I run 20 grains of 3f through all of these and have probably put a couple 100 through each so far, obviously not a lot .

 

[tenngun]

I’ve heard it, I have one and it’s still tight. However I’m not a big pistol shooter.

 

[hawkeye2]

I expect the tale about Pietta changing the frame alloy began with an overly aggressive sales clerk in a gun store.

With mild loads, plenty of lubrication and good cleaning you'll probably more than get your money's worth out of it long before you ever "shoot it loose".

My biggest issue with brass framed revolvers is the lack of historical accuracy in most cases. Though I withhold my comments I am tired of folks coming up to me and telling me how the South manufactured their revolvers from brass because they didn't have any iron. It's been going on 50 years but they still want to believe that story.

 

[Stantheman86]

I expect the tale about Pietta changing the frame alloy began with an overly aggressive sales clerk in a gun store.

With mild loads, plenty of lubrication and good cleaning you'll probably more than get your money's worth out of it long before you ever "shoot it loose".

My biggest issue with brass framed revolvers is the lack of historical accuracy in most cases. Though I withhold my comments I am tired of folks coming up to me and telling me how the South manufactured their revolvers from brass because they didn't have any iron. It's been going on 50 years but they still want to believe that story.

The Griswold revolvers and Schneider & Glassicks had Bronze frames, and basically, in the 1950s the Italian gun makers just cranked out brass frame Colt clones because they were cheap and the average guy would probably pop off 12 rounds and let it rust in a shoebox in the basement .....they were loosely based on the rare original Confederate revolvers and the Italians just ran with the CSA revolver thing.

Gander Mt used to sell the $99 .44 "Reb Navies" in the 90s and 2000s like hotcakes , I had one in about 2001 or so . I shot it with .45 Pyrodex pellets and round balls at some trees, kinda cleaned it and I think gave it to someone for a case of beer and a pizza or something, and bought something else which is now long gone

I always think, when I see those lists in Guns & Ammo of "iconic firearms of America " that the brass frame .44 "Reb Navy" repop should be on there, because it seems like over the past 50 years everyone has had one and popped cans at a gravel pit with it or used one as a truck gun, it's like one of "those guns" that were cheap since forever, and everyone either has or had one, or knew someone that did

 

[Bunk]

I cannot peak for Confederate guns, but the "brass" frames of that time were made of "Gun Metal" a copper based bronze that is harder and more durable that brass. The 1860 Henry rifle and the 1866 tellowboy receivers were gun Metal. Ii am not sure what is used today ut I suspect it is not Gun Metal.
Respectfully
Bunk

 

[B P Arn]

Brass and bronze are both alloys that contain copper. Brass is an alloy of copper and zinc, and bronze is an alloy of copper, tin, and who knows what else.

Which one makes a better gun? I don't think it makes any difference.

 

[hawkeye2]

Good points Stan and I agree. Historical accuracy aside the .44 brass "Navy" might vie for the top selling "repro" of all times and they can be a lot of fun.

 

[Ray-Vigo]

I shot with a guy who had one loosen up somewhat. It was a .44cal Navy style and he was consistently shooting full chamber loads (powder, ball, grease - no filler or space). It did not just fall apart or anything ridiculous, but it developed play is all. I've known several shooters who had brass Navies that were not loose (they generally shot lesser loads with some Cream of Wheat filler). They found that lesser loads could be more accurate than full loads as well.

 

[Stantheman86]

Good points Stan and I agree. Historical accuracy aside the .44 brass "Navy" might vie for the top selling "repro" of all times and they can be a lot of fun.

I'd bet the various Italian gunmakers have probably cranked out a half million of them since the 1950s, if not more

I have yet to ever attend any gun show and not see at least 1 .44 Brass frame Navy , usually an older one , in a display case surrounded by random old junk and a Jukar Kentucky pistol

I really do believe they are the top selling repro of all time, with probably Zoli Zouaves being a close second

 

[hawkeye2]

Dunno, with all the Zolis I see for sale every week I believe the .44s don't even come close.

 

[Stantheman86]

Dunno, with all the Zolis I see for sale every week I believe the .44s don't even come close.

The Zoli Zouave is one that I walk around any given gun show and try to play "spot the overpriced beat up Zoli Zouave with aftermarket sights on it" and I always find one, somewhere, lurking on some vendor's table.

 

[gustrolland]

Has anyone actually "shot loose" a recently manufactured brass frame revolver?

I'm just curious, I had "heard" that Pietta changed the alloy of the brass to make them about as durable as a steel frame.

The price difference is negligible at this point, for an extra 30 or 40 bucks I'd say just get a steel frame....I have both brass and steel frame guns, I just like how the brass frame Colt clones look.

View attachment 137086

I run 20 grains of 3f through all of these and have probably put a couple 100 through each so far, obviously not a lot .

As a gunsmith, I have repaired a few brass Famed guns. Not sure as to how they were loaded. But they were LOOSE.

 

[nkbj]

I have a loose Pietta.
It has an iron color case hardened frame.
The guy who sold it to me over the internet is loose too.

 

[smoothshooter]

I cannot peak for Confederate guns, but the "brass" frames of that time were made of "Gun Metal" a copper based bronze that is harder and more durable that brass. The 1860 Henry rifle and the 1866 tellowboy receivers were gun Metal. Ii am not sure what is used today ut I suspect it is not Gun Metal.
Respectfully
Bunk

The Italians are very closed-mouth about what their “ brass framed “ guns are made of, which leads me to think they are just plain brass.
I wish someone would do an electron spectrometer test on a few of them and let us know the results.

 

[Stantheman86]

As a gunsmith, I have repaired a few brass Famed guns. Not sure as to how they were loaded. But they were LOOSE.

People top off the chambers with Pyrodex or use the .45 rifle pellets in them and blast away with little care because they probably picked them up for $50 a piece at a Cabela's 25 years ago

 

[Stantheman86]

The Italians are very closed-mouth about what their “ brass framed “ guns are made of, which leads me to think they are just plain brass.
I wish someone would do an electron spectrometer test on a few of them and let us know the results.

I feel there's some gray area, years ago I emailed Pietta when I peened the wedge slot from shooting Pyrodex and conicals, and was told by the support person that they don't heat treat their barrels and the peening should stop after a certain point.

So, since people are probably prone to shooting the brassers more now than they probably did years ago, you would think, they'd make an effort to make them stronger, but probably not if they can get away with just using soft brass.....plus I doubt the steel frames are much more than pot metal with the fake case hardening applied. So we have soft steel frames that are probably still stronger than the original iron frames, and brass of an unknown alloy that may be just a little less durable than the soft steel frame.

Like was said, if you brazed on a steel recoil plate to protect the brass frame from the cylinder, they'd probably last forever. But at that point you might as well just buy a steel frame.

 

[Bunk]

I cannot peak for Confederate guns, but the "brass" frames of that time were made of "Gun Metal" a copper based bronze that is harder and more durable that brass. The 1860 Henry rifle and the 1866 tellowboy receivers were gun Metal. Ii am not sure what is used today ut I suspect it is not Gun Metal.
Respectfully
Bunk

My guns have steel frames but in the .36 I shoot 15 grains (volume) of FFFg with a wad and ball. The .44 uses 20 grains FFFg wad and ball. very easy on both shooter and gun. Neither the 1851 Navy and 1860 Army may be NMLRA target guns but are accurate enough for fun shooting up to 25 yards.That is about as far as my ancient eyes can see anyway.
Respectfully
Bunk

 

[smoothshooter]

I feel there's some gray area, years ago I emailed Pietta when I peened the wedge slot from shooting Pyrodex and conicals, and was told by the support person that they don't heat treat their barrels and the peening should stop after a certain point.

So, since people are probably prone to shooting the brassers more now than they probably did years ago, you would think, they'd make an effort to make them stronger, but probably not if they can get away with just using soft brass.....plus I doubt the steel frames are much more than pot metal with the fake case hardening applied. So we have soft steel frames that are probably still stronger than the original iron frames, and brass of an unknown alloy that may be just a little less durable than the soft steel frame.

Like was said, if you brazed on a steel recoil plate to protect the brass frame from the cylinder, they'd probably last forever. But at that point you might as well just buy a steel frame.

There is a good chance the loading process is just as hard on brass frames as firing them is.

 

[B P Arn]

^^^Yep, that right there!

 

[bud in pa]

Many years ago I remember reading that the original Yellow Boy 1866 Winchester was a type of bronze not brass.