smoothbore vs. fowler?

[matt denison]

I am so confused. I thought that I knew all this stuff.

Where in heck is Spence to straighten it all out?

One thing I do know: the term "smoothie" annoys me. To me a smoothie is rasberry or cherry flavored, get one at the corner convenience store.

 

[fahopity]

Yep! :thumbsup:

 

[robertdale]

that "smoothie" thing is like that "shottie" thing. W.T.H.
must have started in pennsylvania. :stir:

 

[pargent]

What hope do we all have if you are starting to get confused

 

[matt denison]

I always thought it went something like this:

a fowler or fowling piece is a fairly lightweight smoothbored gun meant for civilian use and in my mind I relate it to English arcitecture

muskets are military smoothbored guns

trade guns (not trade rifles) are made to a pattern and were manufactured and shipped for trade

a smoothrifle is a gun that has all of the characteristics of a traditional rifle (drop at comb, rear sights, oct. barrel etc.) but has a smooth bore

a smoothbore is any collection of parts built around a smoothbored barrel and is a catch-all term like saying "shotgun" this would include all of the above.

a smoothie is $2.99 down at the S&S, comes in several different flavors

JMHO

 

[Wes/Tex]

I always thought it went something like this:

a fowler or fowling piece is a fairly lightweight smoothbored gun meant for civilian use and in my mind I relate it to English arcitecture

muskets are military smoothbored guns

trade guns (not trade rifles) are made to a pattern and were manufactured and shipped for trade

a smoothrifle is a gun that has all of the characteristics of a traditional rifle (drop at comb, rear sights, oct. barrel etc.) but has a smooth bore

a smoothbore is any collection of parts built around a smoothbored barrel and is a catch-all term like saying "shotgun" this would include all of the above.

a smoothie is $2.99 down at the S&S, comes in several different flavors

JMHO

And all you left out are French made fowlers! :rotf:

 

[matt denison]

Oh, yeah, them too.

and Russian fowlers and German fowlers and Belgian fowlers and.........

:surrender:

 

[59sharps]

no! no! no! on the term rifle smooth bore. Don't care who made the tirm up! if it is smoothbore w/ sight it is not a smooth rifle there is no rifleing in it. hence it can not be a rifle. IT is a sighted smoother bore nothing more nothing less.

 

[jdkerstetter]

no! no! no! on the term rifle smooth bore......IT is a sighted smoother bore nothing more nothing less.

The term is "smooth rifle"...it's a term used to describe a gun stocked as a rifle would be, that may or may not have been orginally smooth but is now. Use it or don't use it, it's up to you but it does add some clarity to the conversation.

Are you also against calling a gun a "fowler" if it's used to shoot rabbits or other 4 legged critters??? Against the term "trade gun" if somebody purchased it??? How 'bout "punt gun" if used in a canoe instead of a small, square stern boat??? All of these terms have uses in conversations about guns.

How aoubt terms like "station wagon" and "pickup truck"??? I find "tractor-trailer" particularly confusing. But everybody accepts those. Sometimes titles don't make sence....they're just words that help add clarity to the conversation.

Just words. Enjoy, J.D.

 

[rich pierce]

no! no! no! on the term rifle smooth bore. Don't care who made the tirm up! if it is smoothbore w/ sight it is not a smooth rifle there is no rifleing in it. hence it can not be a rifle. IT is a sighted smoother bore nothing more nothing less.

It's an historically used term. "Smooth rifle" occurs in period documents.

 

[matt denison]

no! no! no! on the term rifle smooth bore. Don't care who made the tirm up! if it is smoothbore w/ sight it is not a smooth rifle there is no rifleing in it. hence it can not be a rifle. IT is a sighted smoother bore nothing more nothing less.

It's an historically used term. "Smooth rifle" occurs in period documents.

Um,,,, yeah, whatever. I'm still confused and I deal with this every day. Every day.

If we could only have, like a page in the back of Dixie Cataloge that explains it. If Kirkland said it then it is true.

Spence, HEEEEEELP! Where are you? :grin: :bow: :v

 

[Okwaho]

Hey Rich JD, I probably can come up with some extra pearls. It sounds like you all can use some here. I would join in but my opinion would be an exercise in futility not to mention being totally redundant. :bow: :v
Tom Patton

 

[George]

... it is not a smooth rifle there is no rifleing in it. hence it can not be a rifle.

The concept of what constituted a rifle was different in the Rev. War period.

"The Pennsylvania Gazette
February 17, 1773
Philadelphia
To be SOLD very cheap, for cash only, by CONRAD BATIS, Living in Market street, next door to the corner of Third street, opposite to the goal, in Philadelphia, A QUANTITY of this country and German made RIFLES, both cut and smooth bores, in the best manner;"

Spence

 

[Ike Godsey]

well gentleman,

i think you are "too much" native speaker, so let me bring in my 2 cents.

since i am from germany and my native tounge is german not english, i have always the problem by browsing US websites, that the term "Rifle" is used regardles of a rifled or smoothbored barrel.

so i thought about this, cause we in germany do not know that problem, i thought.
but that is wrong. we also know different words (names) for different guns, and we also know ONE word (name) to name them all.
here, we say "flinte" for a double smoothbored barreled hunting gun. we also know the word "repetierer" for a hunting gun that has one barrel but offers a magazin loading device to have more than on shot.
all in one, we also use the term "gewehr" to make the difference between a revolver or pistol to a "long gun".

so here is my question: could it be that "rifle" is nothing more that a "common used term" for a "long gun"?

ike

 

[pargent]

In a word no,.in English the word rifle referes to the cut rifling in the bore of the longarm,or in the 1850's to include cannon as well.Rifle also has other non related uses and meanings in English. Confusion comes about because some people who write for a living don't allways use the correct or correct wording.

 

[pargent]

your term buddy no one else has them . it was only included because this is a US site

 

[pargent]

Well there's proof in itself :rotf:

 

[Ike Godsey]

i am not shure if you got my point.
what i was trying to say is, could it be that some people using the term "rifle" to describe a "longarm" in general, just like "COLT" is (at least here) a synonym for "revolving pistol"?

ike

 

[pargent]

Again no

 

[matt denison]

Ah, but Ike has a point. He's talking about generic terms that people use.

I said that I deal with this every day. People ask me about my "fowlers" when in my mind I don't make fowlers, I make trade guns. At gun shows people ask me if they can handle my rifles. They are in fact smooth bored. Can't argue with or educate everyone all the time so I let it go. I let it go on this forum too. .. well most of the time, I still get a grating feeling when I see the term smoothie. Sort of like some others on here when they see the term canoe gun.