Stock Care

[PowderMonkey]

What is a good oil or wax to care for a rifle stock?

 

[bpd303]

I use Renaissance Wax.

 

[PowderMonkey]

I use Renaissance Wax.

Will check it out, thx.

 

[Ken Cormier]

I use Johnson's paste wax that the wife bought for the hard wood floors. It has worked for me now years. Does a good job. :2

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Ive never waxed my stock, every other year I give it another coat on tung oil.

My bud just picked up the wax mentioned above for an M1a stock he has made for him.
If it does a good job, I may try it on my flinter.
Just hope it dont come out shiney.
I use matte tung oil

 

[Vaino]

Does a properly finished stock really need a "wax job" for addt'l protection? Besides, a shiny stock doesn't look good, to me anyways......Fred

 

[PowderMonkey]

Does a properly finished stock really need a "wax job" for addt'l protection? Besides, a shiny stock doesn't look good, to me anyways......Fred

Well, not sure but i would think if it is wood it would need care from time to time.

 

[Paul R]

As a long time builder of quality furniture, I can attest that more problems with wood finish are caused by 'care & feeding' of the wood then most other reasons. Some oil finishes like BLO & non polymerized tung oil do benefit from a light re-application that is well rubbed out with a soft cloth. But, those finishes, as well as hard finishes, such as lacquer or varnishes should be cleaned first by rubbing down with a cloth soaked with mineral spirits then wiped completely dry. That alone will, most times, return the finish to it's original luster just by removing accumulated hand oil & grime. YRMV, so always test a small area before you get carried away. Then, if you feel the need to wax, apply one coat of wax, let it dry, & then rub hell out of it with a soft cloth, polishing as you remove any unnecessary wax.
Of course worn areas & scratches require extra attention, but that was not the original question.
Paul

 

[hanshi]

I use Johnson's Paste Wax on my stocks about once a year. But after each cleaning I wipe them down with a rag dampened with TYPE "F" Transmission oil. It has a paraffin base and will not harm the wood; I've used it for over a decade. Other than that a simple silicon cloth will do a fine job.

 

[PowderMonkey]

I use Johnson's Paste Wax on my stocks about once a year. But after each cleaning I wipe them down with a rag dampened with TYPE "F" Transmission oil. It has a paraffin base and will not harm the wood; I've used it for over a decade. Other than that a simple silicon cloth will do a fine job.

Well, funny you should mention that. The reason i asked this question is because I just got my Lancaster 40 cal last night and it was suggested to use what you mentioned.

I though...transmission oil? Isn't that toxic to handle since you put it on the stock and will be handling it? So i decided to ask to see what other people use.

 

[Stophel]

Does a properly finished stock really need a "wax job" for addt'l protection?

:hatsoff:

Absolutely agreed. They do not.

Wax doesn't hurt (but it doesn't really do anything positive, either), but please, do NOT put oil on a stock!!! Oil that does not dry turns wood to mush.

Wood is perfectly happy being clean and dry, it does not need to be "fed", nor does it need "moisture" (oil is not moisture anyway) to keep from "drying out" (Don't hang your gun over the fireplace or the floor register if you want to keep it from drying out!). If the stock is finished with linseed oil, it SHOULD have been finished by applying THIN layer after layer and putting each application in the sun for a long period to thoroughly dry, with the last application or two put on, left to set on the surface to partially dry, cut off the surface with burlap (and LOTS of elbow grease... THIS is the real hand rubbing of a "hand rubbed oil finish") then put out into the sun again to fully dry. This leaves the stock with a smooth surface, grain completely filled (no grain pores showing) with fully dry/polymerized linseed oil. It's already full, more oil is not necessary. :wink:

Besides, if you shoot much, the stock is going to be handled with greasy, dirty hands plenty. :wink:

 

[coloradoclyde]

100% Tung oil.

 

[tenngun]

I have been told that our linseed oil today is different then used in the past.My own is a can my grandfather owned and is older then I am...(im two years older then God). Your advice sounds on the mark for what I do, however after cleaning I clean my stock with a very lightly dampeded cloth, did I mention it was VERY lihtly damped, then a dry soft cloth then ever so lightly I rub in some extra oil, just a couple of drops on my fingers and rubed with my hands till warm. Come fall I do buff with light wax coat. It is easy to over coat and a bugger to get off.
Does it help? The old story about 3 vents on a pie crust comes to mind. It was the way I was taught and it dont seem to hurt. It makes me feel like I'm doing something other then just playing with my guns. Chiken soup for the soul :wink:

 

[Artificer]

First, I highly applaud both Moose in Canoe and Stophel because they gave some EXCELLENT advice. WELL Done, Gentlemen!!

I have seen gunstocks that cracked because they were long term stored by leaving them hung over a fireplace or cast iron radiators or floor registers. Our Ancestors often did hang their guns over the fireplace, BUT there were good reasons for doing so and they knew it was not the best thing for the stocks. A banked fire gives a little light to find your gun at night in a DARK cabin, when opposing Europeans or Native Americans came to attack your cabin. Even when there was no banked fire or embers, it was easy to QUICKLY find your gun/s when hung over a fireplace in an emergency when under attack at night. Also, hanging them horizontally kept pressure off the stock wrist to help keep the stock intact longer. But when guns are hung over a fireplace that was used daily to cook food, it did artificially dry out the stocks and cause cracks that would not have otherwise been seen.

Perhaps it would be good to explain why finishes are put on gunstocks. The wood in gunstocks will swell and shrink due to humidity in the air and even during different seasons in the year. Our modern BP gunsmiths and gun stockers deal with this in inletting and carving as a tight inlet in summer is going to be a little looser in winter and raised carving or raised areas will swell/shrink the same way as well. However, the biggest reason we have finishes on gun stocks is so they do not become soggy or waterlogged in outdoor use. When a gun is fired with a soggy or waterlogged stock, the tight fitting bedding areas of the wood fiber are going to be CRUSHED down by the recoil and the result will be loose fitting parts and loss of accuracy and tight fit. The finish is supposed to keep the stock from getting soggy or waterlogged to prevent that. This is ALSO why you don’t want a stock finish that doesn’t come close to completely drying, though it has to remain a tiny bit “wet” so it can expand and contract with the wood and not craze or crack. An Oil or finish that remains “wet” will cause the wood to become “punky” and also allow recoil to crush the tight fit of the wood fibers to the bedding areas of the stock.

Renaissance Wax has become almost a “Museum Standard” to apply to gun stocks in Museums to preserve the original finish underneath them. They say they use wax because it can be taken off without harming the original finish underneath. I have no clue on how they do that, though. However, I fully agree with others there is no reason to use wax on a gunstock with some of our modern and even historic finishes.

Two of the most common HC/PC gun stock finishes in the 18th century was Beeswax and Linseed Oil according to Gary Brumfield, who was the Head of the Gun Shop at Williamsburg for so many years before his untimely recent passing. The Beeswax was heated in a double boiler to melt it and a little poured onto a small area of the stock and rubbed in like the Devil. Then one went to another area of the stock and another until the whole stock had a well rubbed in wax finish. Then the whole stock was rubbed down HARD so it wouldn’t be slippery.

Another gun stock finish that COULD have gone back to the 18th century was popular amoung National Match shooters in at least the 1950’s and 60’s if not as far back as the 1930’s. This was a mixture of 1/3 Beeswax, 1/3 Linseed Oil and 1/3 Turpentine (By Volume Measure) and was heated in a double boiler to mix it up. (The beeswax can much more easily be melted in a Microwave today and then mixed.) This comes out as a sloppy goop that is best left for about a week to thicken a little before using. It does not have to be re-melted to apply it, but it is applied like the heated beeswax finish mentioned above. In about four to six months, it will thicken so much it has to be re-melted to use it.

Where we “Moderns” can get into so much trouble is we often do not understand what they meant by a “Linseed Oil” finish in the 18th and 19th centuries and even worse, what Boiled Linseed Oil (BLO) was then compared to much more recent decades.

“Raw” Linseed oil takes not only decades, but centuries to fully dry, if it fully dries then. Restoration Specialists and Chemists have found the paint in 18th century houses still had “wet” linseed oil in the paint even though White Lead was commonly added to paint then to help promote drying. Of course “Lead Paint” was used well into the 20th century until the danger of it was exposed. The lead also allowed the Linseed Oil to stay somewhat “wet” or elastic, which helped keep it on wood houses exposed to the weather. However, lead paint did eventually bubble and blister and flake off and had to be repainted once or sometimes twice a decade. Raw Linseed Oil on gun stock wood causes it to become punky and crush down under recoil and that was proven many decades ago.

The Real Springfield Armory used Raw Linseed Oil on M1903 Gun stocks right up to a few years before WWII. They heated the Oil and then dipped the stocks in them. Then they pulled them out and wiped down the surface of the stocks and put them on racks to dry. They did this procedure between 6 and 8 times before the stock was finish assembled to the rifle. However, with the advances in chemistry, they changed that just a couple years before WWII. That’s when they switched to using “China Oil” or Tung Oil (as we know it today) as the Raw Linseed Oil finished hand guards allowed them to smoke, char and even BURN the wood close to the barrel when M1 Garands were fired in extensive sustained fire. China/Tung Oil kept that from happening and was a much better finish overall for extended use outdoors. Now, that only lasted into WWII for a couple of years or so when they could no longer get the Tung Oil in quantity. Then they went back to buying Raw Linseed Oil, BUT they heated it and added driers and chemicals to keep the wood from smoking/charring/burning. So they actually turned the Raw Linseed Oil into Boiled Linseed Oil using heat and chemicals to polymerize it.

We do know from the 18th and 19th century gun stock finish formula’s that they turned Raw Linseed Oil into Boiled Linseed Oil. However, the term “Boiled’ is a misnomer. The oil was not actually heated to a boil, but it was heated. Then they added different compounds that acted as “driers” to polymerize the oil so it would dry better. However, that was a VERY different BLO than what one often finds today!!

Sometime during or shortly after WWII, manufacturers began using Petroleum Distillates in BLO to manufacture it faster and cheaper. While that may or may not have been a good thing when added to paint, it is REALLY BAD for gun stock wood. Petroleum Distillates break down the wood fibers and will cause the stocks to “go punky.” Don’t think we need to restate why that is bad. I have seen MANY M1 Garand and M14 stocks that were RUINED by the use of BLO with petroleum distillates in the oil, going back to the 1970’s when it had only been used for at most about 25 years and in many cases less than 15 years. The problem was that Ordnance Officers and Supply Officers did not understand the difference between BLO with or without Petroleum Distillates in it and the word had not come down from the Arsenals that did not use Petroleum Distillates in their BLO. BLO was often or usually purchased locally by Supply Officers and that meant we got it with Petroleum Distillates in it. So any of you old enough (like me) to remember sitting on an upside down bucket and rubbing Boiled Linseed Oil on our service rifle stocks in the Post WWII era, we were doing more harm than good, though we did not know that at the time.

There are still one or two manufacturers/suppliers of BLO that does not have Petroleum Distillates in it. Since I don’t use it, I can’t tell you for sure which brands are like that and good. However, if there is one thing I would really like to get across to people is to closely examine the contents description and IF there is any type of Petroleum Distillate in it, Please, PLEASE do not use it on your gun stocks!!!!!

OK, this post has gone on long enough, so will add more in the next post.

Gus

 

[Stophel]

A few exceptions I will take from your post, Artificer. First; so far, I have yet to see where anyone has been able to provide any period documentation, examples, or proof of any kind that beeswax was ever used as a stock finish. If there is, I would like to see it, myself (my own experiments with beeswax as a finish have resulted in abysmal failures).

And yes, 18th century boiled linseed oil really is boiled. I heat mine to a slow roll. Hotter than that and it gets out of control, and it's not necessary. When it is boiled, it turns dark, and the familiar pleasant aroma goes away, replaced by a dark unpleasant smell. The longer it is boiled, the thicker the resultant oil will be, and the faster it will dry. Basically, as I understand it, you're "pre-drying" it by boiling. It's pure trial and error to figure the right length of time in boiling to get the consistency desired. I have used white lead (lead carbonate) and burnt Umber (manganese) as added drying agents. The oil that I use as the last coat or two is T H I C K. So thick that I have to cut it heavily with turpentine to be able to do anything with it at all. It dries quite quickly in the sun, within a day, even with the heavy coat required for the final to-be-cut-off coats. By the way, I definitely do NOT recommend adding turpentine to the oil and boiling it (turpentine is fine afterwards) like some do. The reason? Linseed oil that catches on fire (and it can) produces 1 foot high flames that are easily extinguished with the lid of the pot. Linseed oil with turpentine that catches on fire produces 6 foot raging flames of burning death (not an exaggeration)... so no boiling turpentine for me!

Linseed oil is fascinating stuff, and I certainly don't fully understand it all. But I have learned some things from experience and study, and through the work of others who have done much more work in this field than me! Raw linseed oil WILL dry, IF it is applied in exceedingly thin coats, and each coat put into the sun... for a long time. If it is slopped on (the old "flood and soak" fallacy) it will never dry. The purer the oil is, the faster it will dry too. I have some artist grade purified linseed oil, with all the undesirable substances (whatever those are) removed, no boiling, no driers added, and it will dry surprisingly quickly. One way to turn raw oil into something that dries faster is to make "Stand Oil", which, as I understand it, is made by heating the oil to about 300 degrees in a totally sealed, oxygen-free container over a period of days. This makes it thicker and pre-polymerizes it. I have read of a method of pouring the oil into glass covered copper trays and putting it in the sun, but I don't know what this is called, or if it is even a legitimate method. I cannot find any other source for this.

Stand oil remains relatively light in color primarily for use in paints, where you don't want the oil to darken the pigment any more than necessary. Boiled oils, however turn a very dark amber color, and were called "black oil" or "red oil" 200+ years ago. Boiled oil would be used by itself for wood finish, or modified with the addition of resins to make a varnish for the surface of the wood.

Linseed oil, raw, boiled or otherwise, never dries hard. It will dry to a rubbery, gummy consistency, maybe a bit softer than a gum eraser... but MUCH tougher. It is quite tenacious. To make it harder, it is "alloyed" with hard resins of various kinds. Two of the easiest ones are rosin and mastic, which both dissolve quite readily in the hot oil. Most of the other resins require a lot more work than I really want to get into! :haha:

A common finish (and perhaps the most common) found on American rifles appears to be a spirit varnish/oil varnish finish, where the grain is filled with a spirit varnish (generally shellac or other lac variant) and an oil varnish is applied on the surface of the wood. All authorities claim that shellac is superior to almost anything else at stopping/slowing the transpiration of water vapor, whereas the oil varnish is good against liquid water, with the two in combination providing a good finish. Personally, I am not convinced that shellac is all that good at stopping water vapor or anything else, but, that is what they say...

Some old guns exhibit finishes that, to my eye, are clearly linseed oil finishes, whereas others I find have obviously never been finished with linseed oil. (linseed oil darkens the wood in general, but especially the end grain, whereas shellac leaves all the wood, even the end grain, clear and bright and undarkened).

In my opinion, the purpose of a stock finish is to slow the transpiration of water/vapor to a level that the wood can easily handle. I no longer think that wood should be sealed up completely "waterproof"... it never will be anyway. When water does get underneath a waterproof finish (and it will sooner or later), it then cannot dry out and ugliness commences. Just keep it from getting too dry too fast (like putting it over a heating register. My grandfather's roll top desk he made sat over a register on one side and developed a HUGE crack in the wood that no finish would have stopped) and the wood will be fine. Even getting wet won't really hurt it as long as it can dry out. :wink:

That post was longer than normal even for me!

 

[Artificer]

As far as beeswax used (alone) in the 18th century, I am reporting what Gary Brumsfield reported before he passed and he wrote he had it documented. I, personally, have also never seen it documented. I agree it does not make a good stock finish at all.

What temperature are you heating your linseed oil to? We may be describing the same thing a little differently, is why I asked.

When I noted that Linseed Oil never dries, I am referring to what chemists have said about the oil. Yes, extremely thin coats left out in the hot sun for days “dries” to the touch.

I left out “stand oil” primarily because I have never seen any documentation on it during the BP era.

Though it was used much earlier elsewhere, shellac was not used very much as a wood finish in America until the 1820’s, from the research I’ve seen. Prior to that, it was primarily used as a dye.

I agree that water vapor will pass in and out of stocks to at least some degree on all natural finishes. I also agree the speed natural finishes allow moisture vapor in and out does not mean much on BP guns, but it certainly makes a difference in National Match and Benchrest Rifles. The speed at which liquid water gets through the finish to soak the wood absolutely does matter on all guns, though, as I’m sure you would agree. I’m looking for the U.S. Forestry document that speaks to a comparison of different finishes on that. (I lost it when my old computer crashed.)

Much of my experience with finishes comes from cutting into hundreds, if not thousands of M1 Garand, M14 and other military and civilian stocks to glass bed them. It also comes from applying wood finishes to stocks during the winter months at Quantico, VA and then seeing how much they swelled on/in Okinawa, Hawaii, California, North Carolina and Camp Perry, Ohio in the spring and summer months. It also comes from studying the best finishes to use. Of course during my career, we switched to fiberglass and laminate stocks that don’t apply here.
Gus

 

[necchi]

We all appreciate your guys info above,,
But the Biggest thing I deal with is wood stocks drying out.
Our Minn winters are dry! We're talking humidity of 16-20%. All my ML and CF guns suffer from noticeable shrinkage, I mean few .001 can be felt in the barrel fit or stock fit with the likes of NEF or Rem 870's.

I never thought of using a "wax", but wiping down with a liquid furnisher polish does change the situation and keeps my stocks clean and in good shape. This includes factory finished guns and ones I've used Tru-Oil on.
I usually break down my ML's at least once during the winter season and wipe down the whole thing,, inside mortises an all.
I've used Scott's Liquid Gold Wood Cleaner and Preservative for decades. Wood moves and my Upper Midwest experience is that loosing moisture is much more prevalent then absorption.

 

[Col. Batguano]

If you put some Japan Dryer in the RLO will that help it dry faster?

I put some Linseed Oil True Varnish I got from woodcraft on some test strips (getting ready for doing it on a stock) last night thinking it was a varnish and they were still pretty wet this morning.

 

[Artificer]

John,

With the extremely low humidity environment in Minnesota during the winter, I have no doubt you see a good deal of wood expansion during the summer. Just to be sure I understand, I assume your guns are tight or at least tighter in the summer?

Gus

 

[Col. Batguano]

wood expands in the summer, so inlays will be looser then than they are in the winter. A seasonal rule of thumb is about 1/4" of movement for every 12" of lateral grained wood. Tangentially (through the grain like in quarter-sawn lumber) it's about 1/2 that. Longitudinal (lengthwise) movement is negligible, so the idea of slotting barrel lugs to allow for seasonal wood movement is silly. Slotting lugs to allow for barrel movement on recoil does make sense.