TC problem

[scott adair]

Hey Guys,

I bought that never fired .45 Seneca. Got me some jags and took it out to shoot. It shot ok for the 3 shots fired but I noticed when I was swabbing the bore that there was a spot that was tough to get past down near the breech. Got it home and started to clean it and got a ramrod stuck. had to put the barrel in a rubber jawed vise and pull with a rubber jawed vice grip woodwork clamp. Put the breech end in hot water, soaked it, and stuck rod half a dozen more times trying to dry and lube it. I was using flannel patches less than 2" square that I use on my .32.
Tried smaller ones and even the patches that I use on my round balls and even these resulted in a stuck rod. Ran the jag in with no patch and could feel it scrape on something about 3/4" from the breech and then it got smooth again. Tried pushing on the rod at diferent angles and determined that the obstruction goes all the way around the inside of the barrel.

Took it to the shop where I bought it and the lady and her husband ran the jag in and made the same determination. She called TC and the guy told her it was a carbon ring that had built up and to clean it with #13 bore cleaner. We stuck the rod again and when we got it out she said it did not look like there was any carbon in there based on the color of the patch. She did note that the patch looked cut or frayed.

Is there anything to this carbon ring thing? My other dealings with TC have been great and I expect they will get this figured out. I think it is an unmilled surface in the barrel or on the patent breech.

Scott

 

[jtmattison]

Is the area visible with a bore light?
Maybe you know someone with a bore scope.
I'd try to get a closer look.
Have you tried scrubbing the bore with a bore brush and solvent?
Try that and if it is clean but the obstruction is still there call T/C and I bet they'll replace the barrel.

HD

 

[scott adair]

HD,

Wish I'd thought of that. We did'nt try a brush, just a patch with solvent which showed no evicence of carbon buildup. I immagine she probably has it boxed up and in the mail by now.


If it clogs up after three shots then I'm not sure I want to own it though :hmm:

Scott


Is the area visible with a bore light?
Maybe you know someone with a bore scope.
I'd try to get a closer look.
Have you tried scrubbing the bore with a bore brush and solvent?
Try that and if it is clean but the obstruction is still there call T/C and I bet they'll replace the barrel.

HD

 

[d.thomson]

Hi I get a crud ring with my T/C .50 Hawkens and I fond that I have to swab with T/C BP solvent#13 between shots. I got a rod stuck when I didnt swab it out once. realy stuck finaly had to remove the nipple and put a bit of bp down it and shot the rod out down range about 50 yrds. so I keep swabing between shots. I hope when the tep rises and the humidity rises that the problem well sort it self out. I thike the rule of thumb is to swab between shots to keep the barel uniform and keep shot placement the same for each shot.it could also be what you are using for a patch lube Just my 2 cents :v

 

[carter]

Mine does the same thing! It's the patent breech in the breech plug. did have a barrel replaced years ago and now only use a brush with a patch on it to clean with. Mine is a .36 caliber but the same rifle.

 

[2172]

Bought a used .44mag Vaquero on Auction Arms...correctly described as "has ring in bbl from being fired with black powder and not cleaned" price was cheap...it took 10 minutes and a bronze brush and Butches Bore Shine to make it like new..there was a carbon ring, but it didn't last..Hank

 

[Keppy]

Try that and if it is clean but the obstruction is still there call T/C and I bet they'll replace the barrel.

HD

We hope they will replace it. Better hurry. Talking to a local shop today. Not written in stone but he feels that after the TC deal is final, "SW" will no longer warrenty products made before this merage. I hope he's wrong, but I guess we'll all fine out in a few months.

 

[roundball]

"...call T/C and I bet they'll replace the barrel..."

They might try to make it right by offering a cheap inline or something but they haven't had any of those small 13/16" Seneca/Cherokee barrels for years.

 

[Heidi 1672]

I called TC within the last month because I had a .32 cherokee barrel that needed replaced. I was told that they had no Seneca Barrels and only 3 Cherokee barrels,all in .36 caliber. These were held back to be replacements.

 

[renovato]

From how you're describing it, it sounds like you're getting stuck because of the patent breech. It narrows into a smaller powder chamber right at the end of the breech and if you try to ram your jag into the smaller chamber, it's a recipe for a stuck rod. Try using a smaller caliber brush for the patent breech itself. .30 caliber or so.

 

[scott adair]

I went back by the shop and we tried a brush and some solvent. No dice! Ran several more saturated patches into it and stuck the rod every time. I think if it was a carbon ring it would have broke free. Removed the cleanout screw and aimed a bore light into the hole. Bore was clean as a whistle. Could not see anything though.

I am still betting it is some type of burr or lip either in the barrel or on the end of the patent breech. We plan to send it to TC with the ramrod stuck in the barrel for emphasis.

Scott

 

[hobbles]

Mornin scott adair
What kind of powder are you usin??

 

[roundball]

I called TC within the last month because I had a .32 cherokee barrel that needed replaced. I was told that they had no Seneca Barrels and only 3 Cherokee barrels,all in .36 caliber. These were held back to be replacements.

That's amazing but at the same time doesn't surprise me...sometimes depending on who you get on the phone at TC dictates the answer...I've personally had that conversation about parts for the Seneca & Cherokee when I was toying with the idesa of getting one off an auction a few years ago and was told "all parts were lost in the big plant fire" (back in the 90's).

 

[scott adair]

Hobbles,

I was using some pyrodex. I'm thinking this was'nt the best choice???


To all,

I get mixed messages from TC. The first guy I talked to after I bought it was great. Wish I could remember his name??? He said they still have a limited amount of replacement parts for Seneca's. Not for sale for spares, just replacements if you return something that is broken.

I talked to a guy yesterday and he was really hung up on this carbon ring theory. Then he went in on the possibility I had short started a load and might have a bulged barrel.

We scrubbed the barrel with patches and the lady who owns the shop used 1/4 of a bottle of #13 in the process. No carbon or residue showed up on the patches. I went back by and scrubbed it with a .20 gauge bore brush with some birchwood casey muzzle magic. Lubed a patch with bore butter and promptly got the rod jammed. TC was closed for the day and won't open til after MLK day I bet.

I am starting to question whether I should have purchased this rifle to begin with; what with the parts situation and the possibility of having to swab after every shot. Heck, I've got a Traditions deerhunter in .32 that I can shoot two to three times before I have to swab and after one spit patch it is good for another three shots.

To be quite honest I think I may see about getting my money back and putting it in on another tvm kit or finished rifle.

Scott

 

[Rebel]

If it is hanging up that close to the breech it isn't going to affect the way it shoots, why not just take a long brass range rod with a slotted tip on it, Put some sandpaper in the tip like a brake hone, and smooth that spot out real good? Your powder and ball will cover that area when you load, so it won't have any affect on accuracy.

 

[scott adair]

Rebel,

It may come to that.

I'm just incredibly disappointed at this point. I had always heard such great things about TC. I bought this rifle to use in an upcomming shoot and now I won't have it. It's just not a good start IMO.

Scott

 

[scott adair]

Well, I'm done with it! I called the shop and politely asked if they would just give me my money back. They hesitated and said that their posted policy is "all sales final" but that this was a special case so they would do it. I could tell they were'nt wild about it though.

They made a customer for life. $475 was a heck of a lot to spend on a rifle that gave me trouble right off the bat.


Scott

 

[roundball]

Well, I'm done with it! I called the shop and politely asked if they would just give me my money back. They hesitated and said that their posted policy is "all sales final" but that this was a special case so they would do it. I could tell they were'nt wild about it though.

They made a customer for life. $475 was a heck of a lot to spend on a rifle that gave me trouble right off the bat.

Scott

Good deal for you...and for what it's worth, I've seen a couple posts commenting that the recoil from full strength hunting loads can be pretty noticable in the lightweight Seneca compared to the heavy full size Hawken

 

[scott adair]

Thanks Roundball,

I felt a little bad about even asking for a refund but it seemed like a bad start.

Scott

 

[Heidi 1672]

I totally agree with this as I own both the cherokee and seneca in .45 caliber. The TC load book say's 90 grains for a maximum load but, the truth is that after 50 grains they become unpleasant to shoot because of the very light weight. They are however very nice small game rifles in .36 and .32 when shooting 30 grains or less