to the chin

[mattybock]

I recall reading once that a gunsmith would make rifles with barrels ideally ending at their customer's chin (pointing upward to the sky, buttstock on the ground).
I've read often enough that a Kentucky might have a barrel with a 48 inch barrel, this seems fishy to me.
The bulk of the antiques I've eyeballed have been in the area of 42. People were shorter in the colonial area, so having a 48 inch barrel seemed hard to believe.
So is 'to the chin' a myth, have you ever seen a 48 inch barrel or is it more true that a barrel was as long as a buy wanted, regardless of their height?

 

[cynthialee]

I been told the same thing. Don't know if it is true or not. I got to shoot a rifle that was almost to my chin and it was way to long for me. I doubt I would have been comfortable if it had been longer.

 

[pargent]

Yes early 1700s had long barrels (48 to 42 ) some longer ,some shorter.The average height was shorter then to, there is heaps on this forum about barrel lengths ,where and when . A long barrel on a well made gun wont make it harder to shoot.

 

[jdkerstetter]

Interesting. Can you sight one example of an early 1700's Kentucky Rifle?

I will concede that the fowling pieces and trade guns of the time had longer barrels, but there are no known Kentucky rifles that date earlier the 1750's....and that's speculative. Most contend that even that is too early.

I believe the chin thing a myth and without period documentation until I see otherwise.

Enjoy, J.D.

 

[Stumpkiller]

Hmmmmm. Allowing a 14" LOP that is a 52" barrel for me.


Naaaaaaaaa.

44" or 42" barrels seem plenty.

 

[Zonie]

I think the "to the chin" idea is some authors dream that has little to do with reality.

It sounds good in a story but why would a barrel maker go to the trouble of measuring the height of someones chin and then determine what the right pull length is just to build a barrel?

Although many of the people back in the 1700's were short, not all of them were.
Using this chin idea, Ol' George Washington would have needed a barrel about 50 inches long.

 

[pargent]

Sake dude it was a generalised answer for a generalised question.

 

[pargent]

For myself thats just about right with my 1756pattern longland bess (46 inch barrel ) :haha:

 

[mattybock]

did you happen to be loading the gun with the barrel pointed right up to the sky? I think that maybe holding the barrel at a diagonal angle might be a good idea or even more historically accurate.
a 40 inch barrel with a 16 inch length of pull would come up to my chin so anything more and I'd have to hold it all at an angle.
I think longer barrels make the whole gun look prettier, thinner and more elegant.

 

[buford87]

This sounds like the myth that trade guns were traded to the Indians for a stack of beaver pelts as tall as the gun. I think that is some twentieth century writer either making up something or falling for a tall tale.............watch yer top knot............

 

[jdkerstetter]

.....16" length of pull.....SIXTEEN INCH LENGTH OF PULL?????? Just how tall a fella are ya? Don't know that I've ever seen a length o' pull that long.....and I've seen a lot of guns!!!

J.D.

 

[LRB]

JD,I know one guy that requires a 16" pull, but he 6'8" tall with long arms.

 

[Lonegun1894]

Now, not trying to start a fight here, but... I'm 5'10, and prefer my rifles in the 14-14.5" LOP range, and just about everything I have is in that range, with one exception, and that is a break action shotgun (sorry, i know, WAY TOO MODERN), that I couldn't get comfortable with as it always seemed too short, so I started adding 1/4" strips of wood under the buttplate, then got longer screws to make sure the buttplate would stay on, and finally got a comfortable LOP at 15.25". Yeah, it surprized me too when I finally measured it as based on everything I have always been taught. But I know this much, my hit percentages on dove and clays went from 35-40% depending on the day, and NEVER go to the 50% mark, to 90% on a bad day, and usually better. Before I switched to MLs, I used to go dove hunting with however many shells the limit was and either limit out or come home with however many shells that I was short of my dove limit. It's all in the fit, and while I believe that the "rules" for gun fit are there for a reason, they don't always hold true, and we need to try different things to make sure we find exactly what we shoot best with instead of just blindly following the rules. Just my experience, and definitely not gospel by any means, but hope it helps someone here.

 

[DUSTY 14]

my lop is 15 1/2 and my trade gun has a 46" barrel
for me it feels great and fits wonderfully. one of the guys at Fort Langley where i volunteer cannot look into the bore, much less load with ease. lop is not all that matters as you have the drop,cast off or on and lots of other things. one gun may need a different lop than another if it has a greater drop.
one problem is after you get one gun that fits, you are never happy with a poor fitting gun. good fit is addictive

 

[cynthialee]

my lop is 15 1/2 and my trade gun has a 46" barrel
for me it feels great and fits wonderfully. one of the guys at Fort Langley where i volunteer cannot look into the bore, much less load with ease. lop is not all that matters as you have the drop,cast off or on and lots of other things. one gun may need a different lop than another if it has a greater drop.
one problem is after you get one gun that fits, you are never happy with a poor fitting gun. good fit is addictive

probably why I gravitate to my .410, I swear they had me in mind when they designed the Pardner model. Now I just need a smoke pole made with the same basic measurements. :hmm:

 

[mattybock]

woops, should have been 15, not 16. I'm 5'8", not especially tall but I do have a big head (needs more stock space or else I'd have my nose on the breech)

 

[jdkerstetter]

woops, should have been 15, not 16. I'm 5'8", not especially tall but I do have a big head (needs more stock space or else I'd have my nose on the breech)

Um, I don't know exactly how to reply to that. :shake:

There has to be more to it though as somebody 5'8" shouldn't need a 15" LOP if proper stock architecture is used.

Almost speachless, J.D.

 

[hanshi]

Height, only, is not what determines lop; it has to do with arm length, mass of the shoulders/chest and general body architecture; height does affects these to a greater or lesser degree.

In my case a gun with an lop of 12.5" to 13" with a 38" barrel comes to my chin.

 

[ohio ramrod]

Actualy my target rifle has a seventeen inch length of pull and I am under six foot tall. I learned to shoot when I was young and naturally hold my rifle further out than most people do. :idunno:

 

[jdkerstetter]

Height, only, is not what determines lop.....

I'm very aware of the various factors that determine length of pull....including personal preference (Don).....I had just never heard of it being determined by someones hat size. :hmm:

That's a new one and it kinda threw me. :v Enjoy, J.D.