US wolves taken off endangered list, clearing way for hunting

Paul, this isn't a slam, merely an observation. I wonder what the boar 'coon that killed 27 of our baby chicks, in the spring, and only ate bits of two or three, was teaching to what? I hope the lesson was well received because the teacher is no longer among the living.

Predators, all predators, will kill for the sheer joy of killing when they have the opportunity. I've examined too much evidence to be convinced otherwise.

For myself, I much prefer the name "outdoorsman" or "woodsman" over sportsman. Perhaps it's my generation but to me a "sportsman" is something of a "dude", (a name I detest being called, no matter how endearing it is intended). Sportsman has completely different connotations than outdoorsman or woodsman in my mind.

I am a hunter and trapper so that shoe fits very comfortably.

Vic

 

[RC]

hornbuilder, I may have to reevalute my thoughts on being a sportsman.you said """a SPORTSMEN is a person who knows and respects the animals hunted, follows the laws, and behaves in a way that will satisfy what society expects of him or her as a hunter """ which I totally agree with and do.. then you said "What critics of hunting find objectionable are, #2 killing only for trophy" so based on this, if I follow the sportsman definition,but I legally shoot a coyote or a wolf as a trophy, I'm not a sportsman anymore? sorry but that confuses me..and I would say (oh god!) that most participants hunt for fun,there fore kill for fun..realistically we don't have to hunt/kill. we hunt for food,but not a necessity..we kill to hunt,it ends the hunt, I'm trying to understand an pretty sure we think somewhat alike but to define sportsman in those terms and then define what 80% don't like..one goes against the other..I do consider myself a sportsman and a hunter..although it might not be as you defined it...it can't be as you defined it.jest my opinion,,,confused as it may be..RC

 

[hornbuilder]

roundball:

just so you know , we don't have diamond backs here in pennsylvania, instead we have timber rattlers, up here we learn how to live with these critters and try not to kill an animal or reptile just because it could do us harm.do ya shoot poisonous spiders too? come now we all know that this isn't the right thing to do, killing something because it may or may not do us harm.
if we all did this would we have anything left ?
the next rabbit could have rabies and bite someone , lets make them extinct...yes i'm teasin ya but you have to understand that a mind set of that nature could prove to be fatal for more than you my think ...........
you'll be happy to know with this post ..I quit this disscussion , more than nuff said

 

[hornbuilder]

ok once more ,,, RC ~ i said that 80% of the population is on the fence ..which means that at this time they don't have an opinion ...yet ..
lets not give them one ..

do you kill anything for fun , shoot a grouse just to watch it fall ? i don't think so ! but believe me there are many folks that would do something like that and think nothing of it. have witnessed thhese violations many times over ..

sportsmen kill in the process of there hunt, yes you can buy all the food you want at the supermarket but thats not what i said or implied...

 

[roundball]

roundball:
"...do ya shoot poisonous spiders too?..."

Good gracious no...afraid I'd hit the TV or something :grin:

But, yes, if I see a Brown Recluse which we have her...(one bit my Son as a teenager)...or a Black Widow, rest assured they're dead spiders if I can get to them...we don't see a fraction of one percent of the spiders in the world...the 8-9 I might kill in my entire lifetime would hardly put them on an endangered species[url] list...certain[/url] that I accidently step on more than that while walking through the woods every year.
:thumbsup:

 

[RC]

okay hornbuilder I got ya now! and I understand, Sorry for the misunderstanding of "killing for fun".. it's makin sense now..and yer right..but (ain't there always a but?) I feel you jumped to a conclusion without explaining what you actually ment.which sorta left some on the defensive..myself as one.. one of my fears is that some of that 80% are inclined to do the same,without understanding,,,we must have patience,and explain ourselves..and educate..so we can tip a portion of that 80% our way.while understanding or trying to understand their beliefs/situations ! I thank you for taking the time to clear this up..! :thumbsup: RC

 

[PitchyPine]

PitchyPine,
My apologies. I did just click on the last entry. My response was a general one, noting that silence or lack of follow up on an issue(in this case hornbuilder) may simply mean that the honorable member had not had the chance to respond because his time on line is limited by the real world.
:surrender:
bramble

Thanks for clarifying bro. :v

 

[sparsons]

I'm with you RC. When he explained "sportman" and used the word "hunter" to explain he made them both the same. It's all in how we like to describe ourselves and the way others see us. I may think I am a sportman but you may see me as a hunter. To go after the wolf for the sake of protecting my ranch would mean hunting to me. Not a sport but an activity that needs to be done to protect my property and livelihood. For some one else to join me in my quest just for the sake of killing the wolf, that person could be considered hunting for the sport. Means nothing to him expect for the excitement of the "hunt" with the end result being the "kill". Still he has to have some degree of ability to stalk (hunt) in order to achieve sucess in his sporting endeavor. So to me its all in how we percieve ourselves. I can hunt for the sport (fun and competition) or I hunt for the kill to feed my stomach. But if I enjoy and have fun in my kill does that make me a "happy hunter" or a vicious killer? It all depends on which side of the mirror you are looking through and which side the wolf is on.

 

[RC]

.....sparsos.. :thumbsup: exactly! well said..there's alot of "definitions" of both sportsman and hunter..some not so good,,but I think yer right, it's actually how we perceive ourselves..gees we'd never make everybody happy..course most will never understand hunting.(oh gees did i open a door?) :shocked2: RC

 

[Rat Trapper]

I think you know the wolf for what he is. Which is also something may liberals will not admit. In Wisconsin you often hear of the rule of 3 S's (1) shoot (2) shovel (3) shut up. I lived for 5 years in Alaska and in that time got to know what the wolf was and was not. They are a problem here in Wisconsin now that the bunny huggers have brought them back to this state. They kill hunting dogs, kill deer, and kill live stock. Those who live in the northern part to the state no claim they no longer see any deer just wolf tracks. There are now recent documented attacks by wolves on people. The rule of the 3 S's works where the liberals and bunny huggers will not listen to reason.

 

[Slamfire]

I think a lot of folks total knowledge of wolves comes from the programs on Animal Planet. Kinda accurate, but slanted to make us believe they are harmless to humans.
There are a couple that chose to live here at my house, their mother was a Red wolf and their daddy was a grey/shepard mix. The male weighs near 250 lbs, and the female is about half his size. My wife and I are considered part of the pack, and there are no more lovin' critters than these. One of their neices lives here too, but she's a lot more dog than wolf. When the pair go huntin' they leave her to baby sit us. :rotf:
She's about over bein' the Omega though and gives the Alpha female plenty of backtalk. The male is a typical beta, he didn't even join in the struggle for dominance when they were learnin' to walk.

 

[CoyoteJoe]

The BLM has closed roads in the Mtns. due to the mass of rotting Moose calves not eaten just killed by wolves. The Elk herds are going fast.
[/quote]

where exactly is this happening :hmm:

 

[Turtle2]

'bout time they were taken off the list.

-Turtle2-

 

[rabbit03]

Hello Roundball,

I think you need to rethink the PRIVELAGE thing. I have always considered if I am an American, pay taxes, buy a license, hunt legally, then I am within my rights to do it. I have a RIGHT to hunt and it is not a privelage.

Just as when they say Your Driving PRIVELAGES, BULL_it, I have a right to be on the road in the United States and it is definitely not a privelage, not when I pay taxes, forced to pay insurence, gas taxes, uninsured motorist whatever it is, I have the RIGHT to be there and it is in no way a Privelage at all.

You know how it goes, one of these days our kids will assume because the government says something is a privelage, they will just assume that is the way it is. Like most of the things we are lead to believe that 'Just aint so'!

My thoughts on this subject of PRIVELAGE vs. MY RIGHTS.

Hornbuilder, hunting may be something our ancient ancestors did but it is an AMERICAN way of life.

rabbit03 (the other white meat) :hmm:

 

[jeepwj992002]

"I think you need to rethink the PRIVELAGE thing. I have always considered if I am an American, pay taxes, buy a license, hunt legally, then I am within my rights to do it. I have a RIGHT to hunt and it is not a privelage."
rabbit03 You hit the nail right on the head. Hunting is a God given right not a privelage. :thumbsup:

 

[paulvallandigham]

Sharps 4590: Where did you read me say that only mother wolves and their pups kill indiscriminately for practice? I said no such thing. Yes, all wild animals will kill just for the joy of killing. My uncle owned a a half wolf hound that got into a neighbor's chicken coop one night, and killed over 300 layers. It cost my uncle a lot of money( and it should have) and the dog was sold to a rancher who wanted the dog/wolf for some reason I have now forgotten. I have heard of fox killing as many chickens as you report, and eating only part ofone before leaving the coop. Its as if the dog was angry that the chickens were so protected, and just wanted to leave proof to the humans of just how powerful it is!

All I said was at that time of year, this is the usual activity that the Alpha female is doing with the pups. By March each year, when she is obviously pregnant, she drive out of the den all the pups from the prior year, save perhaps one female to act as nurse, and to help her hunt to feed the next litter. The alpha male is driven off, and all the males compete for territory as the Spring thaws. Some of the older dogs will have died from exposure, or starvation, or injury during the winter, so that their territory is now available to the younger dogs. The largest males will mate with the young females, and pair off to start their own families. The rest will wait for the second year to have their families, if they every pair off.

 

[roundball]

Thanks, but I don't need you to wordsmith my posts :shake:
If you want to start a new thread on whether or not something is a privledge or a right, have at it

 

[RC]

if I am an American, pay taxes, buy a license, hunt legally, then I am within my rights to do it. I have a RIGHT to hunt and it is not a privelage.

they say Your Driving PRIVELAGES, BULL_it, I have a right to be on the road in the United States and it is definitely not a privelage, I have the RIGHT to be there and it is in no way a Privelage at all.

PRIVELAGE vs. MY RIGHTS.



rabbit03

:hmm: rabbit....the difference is..if you do something wrong while enjoying your privileges,whether hunting or driving, they will then inform you of your rights,and if found guilty take away your privileges and your rights...luckily you still have the right to free speech and the right to bear arms..most else it's they're ballgame... jes a thought... RC

 

[rabbit03]

Amen
rabbit03

 

[rabbit03]

Hello Roundball, I do appoligize for what would have appeared to be 'Wordsmithing' as you put it. Indeed it is a topic for another post for sure one day.

I was just trying to make what I thought should be a correction for other members as to what is and is not a right or privelege. Hunting is interpreted by me as being a right and not a privelege :thumbsup: .

If you think of it as a privelege than that is your right! I just saw something that is a subject of debate with me and jumped on it like a duck on a june bug,

rabbit03