What do you see as the future for Traditional Muzzleloading

[MikeChapin]

...
And, in my opinion (again, one of those truths that nobody wants to hear) one of the things we do that hurts our traditional sport is attack the inline users, intentionally building a wall that deters interest in our side of the sport. We are thus seen as a bunch of grumpy old men who will complain and make fun of newcomers. Who would want to join that fraternity?
...

I have nothing against someone using an inline though I do think they should hunt in the regualar season rather than traditional seasons.

There is not a special BP season in Wyoming, just a couple of areas so there is no real reason for people to go the inline route around here. There are some around mostly the try anything new crowd.

To enhance membership I tried to get our local club to allow inlines at our monthly shoots as long as they used a patched roundball and open iron sights like the rest of us. My reasoning is that once the see that they can't hit anything with them they will switch over to a traditional piece that can actually hit something at 25 yards.

It ain't gonna happen. You would have thought I pooped in the punchbowl from the way they reacted. I had thought it would be a good way to raise membership but it looks like I am a distict minority.

 

[mr.fudd]

i agree 100% Drop a green Mountain barrel in a TC Hawken and it will shoot the same as an inline. There is a movement however back to traditional bows that is gaining momentem much the same as traditional muzzleloading has.The old ways will never die out. I will not however take up spear hunting,but there are some out there that want to.

A traditional bow has it's own real advantages. They are faster, lighter and simpler than compound bows and also allow the user to vary the power of his shot. One of the big drawbacks of a compound bow is that you pretty much have to pull it to full draw and I think that anyone who's tried to take a rabbit with a 70# compound realizes that that's not always a good thing. In that situation, even if you hit the critter you're likely to lose or damage an expensive arrow.

Still, a good compound bow with sights, release and a modern rest will allow a novice shooter to shoot with accuracy that would have required years of practice in the past and velocity that the old bows don't even come close to.

The modern muzzleloader by way of comparison has very minor advantages over it's traditional counterpart.

 

[Mulebrain]

I think the future is bright, but could be much brighter!

I see that History is being construed and dumbed down in our public schools. I think history should be the most important subject, and it is not!

I think if we all do our part, others in the future will do the same. We just have to stick with it, and keep spawning more interest in what we love so much!

 

[XXX]

I actually think that traditional muzzleloading has a brighter future than modern muzzleloading.......
I don't see the same thing happening with compound bows though. Unlike the inline rifle, a modern compound bow really is a significant improvement over a traditional bow. They also fill a real niche that modern muzzleloaders don't. A bow is both an effective and a quiet way to hunt. That means it can be used in areas where no gun could be.

I think it depends what your idea of improvement is. Most compounds weigh 4-5 pounds and many people buy slings for them now. One of my stickbows weighs less than 1 pound. Heavy "bows" like that discourage ground hunting and encourage perching in treestands, which is something else to buy and carry around. The compound bow is more effcient, mechanically precise, near fool-proof, and it does these things at extreme range, which others have pointed out. The cost of these "improvements" is a soul-less, machined, mass produced product of the industrial age that anyone can learn to shoot well within a matter of minutes. This "anyone can do it" phenomenon cheapens the accomplishment of hitting a target (on the range anyway, Game must still be hunted), and reduced the concept of archer to mere shooter. I have seen compound advertisements that bragged about "Taking the arch out of archery". That sounds about as enticing to me as taking the water out of boating. Compound bows are designed to overcome the human element as much as possible while still meeting the letter of most game laws. While this seemed harmless in 1977, the technilogical progress has now reached the point now where at least 80% letoff at full draw and a trigger device are standard. This has led to crossbow advocates claiming(rightly) that there is little difference between the compound and the crossbow and that the later should be allowed in archery seasons. The crossbow has more in common with guns than it does with real bows and even many compound users and compound dominated organizations recognize that and understand the threat to archery seasons. Unrestrained and potentially unsporting technilogical advancements in archery such as this are exactly the same threat to archery season as the smokeless powder,sabot shooting, scoped inline is to primitive firearms seasons.

 

[HMSLion]

Actually, I think things are on the mend.

First, the overall image of the shooting sports has improved significantly over the last few years. Yes, there are some pockets of hysteria, but the general image is pretty good. And traditional muzzleloading is in an excellent position to be an "ambassador" for the shooting sports in general. Most people see a flint rifle as a work of art.

Second, there are several events coming up that will increase the profile of traditional muzzleloading. The 150th anniversiary of the Civil War is coming up in the next few years. This will garner a lot of interest - and some of those people will get the bug. That ends in 2015...and leads directly to the 250th of the American Revolution. Another excellent recruiting opportunity.

Now, I'll admit that the market will change significantly. When I was young, I remember my father building his own rifles. That was in the late 1960s and through the 1970s, BTW. Today, there are fewer potential shooters who have the manual skills to build a rifle...although I will concede that this is itself an opportunity for kit sellers and for teaching. But I think that the overall market will shift to favor pre-built arms.

In-lines? I have no idea how that will play out. But I think that XXX has a good point - the inlines may meet the letter of the law for hunting season, but they have no soul. And in the end, that matters to a lot of people.

 

[mykeal]

Just thought you might like to know the statistics:

58 posts -
30 (52%) were, in general, positive about the future of traditional muzzleloading
10 (17%) were, in general, negative about the future of traditional muzzleloading
18 (31%) expressed no opinion about the subject of the thread.

Some license was necessary in making the positive/negative/no opinion decision, and others would surely have a different result, but I doubt if it would be greatly different. The positive viewpoints have it.

 

[Wink]

Going back to the original Topic... I believe that Traditional Muzzleloading will go the same route much as Traditional Archery. When I started Bowhunting back in the 1970s, recurves were the norm.Compounds then took over and no one Including myself could be convinced otherwise to shoot anything else. Compounds were fast, accurate, easier to master, and lethal. In the late 1990s I needed to puchase another bow,my compound I was using had aged in a physical sense and by way of technology. I started looking at the new bows and became disenchanted with the sport I once loved so much. Overdraws, peep sights, front sights, stabilizers, releases, you name it, complicated the sport so much it was a mere reflection of what it used to be. I just happened to notice a copy of the then fledgling Traditonal Bowhunter Magazine in my grocery store. I was again inspired, and after much deliberation I decided to get back into Traditional Archery. In 1997 and had a Custom Recurve Bow built. I haven't looked back since. Now Traditonal archery is a growing movement. Clubs are springing up everywhere and traditional shoots are being held all over the country. Now you can look in Cabelas Magazine and even see a growing market for traditional equipment. I believe that muzzleloading will follow the same route given time. This forum, which I happened upon by accident has been my source of knowledge and inspiration. Just 3 years ago I had no idea what I was doing when it came to muzzleloading. The TC 50 cal WMC I had purchased several years prior sat unused do to frustrating experieces derived from ignition failures and inaccuracy. With the help and encouragement from members of this forum I learned of the mistakes I was making and my confidence and enjoyment in using Traditional BP equipment soared. This forum and the input from its users has put me on a learning curve fast track. So much so, that in the last two of three seasons I have harvested deer. I've even purchased another gun, a 54 cal Renegade which should be delivered anytime this week. In closing, I believe Technology helped grow the sport of Archery and because of the now massive numbers bowhunters afield it may have been saved from its ultimate extinction or political demise. I believe that as time passes and with the patient input from users on forums such as this, our sport of Traditional Muzzzleloading will grow as well.

 

[Mike 56]

I try help keep shooting sports alive by introducing as many people as i can to shooting. I might lure people in with M1 Grand or M4 carbine. After a while i break out my cap and ball revolvers and my 50 cal BP rifle. Most the people i take end up liking black powder better than center fire guns.

A few trips to the range with a antiguner can change their mind in a hurry.

Mike

 

[nodakhorseman]

From my perspective, ML guns will be around as long as we retain our right to bear arms. I do have strong concerns, however, about the future of methods deemed "traditional".

Humans are just like animals in that we are all drawn to the path of least resistance. By trade, I am a waterfowl biologist and the organization I work for is funded almost exclusively by hunter dollars. Traditional methods are practiced
by the minority of waterfowlers. The trend is towards spinning winged decoys, high priced leases and high-tech clothing. Only a select few make their own decoys/calls and really focus on the simple things of duck hunting. The focus has shifted to "getting a limit" and "getting it fast"--not simply being out there. Duck hunting has been tough for the past 5 or 6 years and correspondingly, many hunters have quit duck hunting. Why? Because they were drawn to the limit, not duck hunting.

I see the same thing with muzzleloaders, archery, etc. There will always be a minority that are drawn to the traditional methods--the harder methods (everyone on this site). But most will take the path of least resistance--inlines ,compound bows, etc. I'm not against inlines or compounds, but this is how I see it.

For kicks, I stopped by our main sporting goods store here in Bismarck, North Dakota. They carry only ONE traditional ML rifle--the T/C Hawkin. They carry roughly 2 dozen different inlines, however. I was told that people prefer the
simpler (easier to clean, ingite, fiber optics, 1x scopes, etc) and longer shooting inlines. Traditional ML rifles don't sell they said. It's no coincidence that the only traditional ML rifle they carry has fully adjustable sites--again, easy.

I would also bet that the average age of a traditional ML shooter/hunter is quite old compared to the inline crowd. I think
we traditional shooters will always have a place, but we will always be the minority, unless hunting seasons create an incentive to be a traditional shooter.

We should be careful not to alienate ourselves and come across as an elitist bunch. Where I work, we have a national hunter recruitment campaign where we target children and nonhunting men and women. We host training and hunting weekends with those folks in mind. Hopefully we'll keep the flame alive and grow it in the process. We can all do this ourselves in our own little ways with ML firearms.

--Joel

 

[tg]

"We should be careful not to alienate ourselves and come across as an elitist bunch."

But it's so hard to be humble when you're perfect in every way...

Seriously though I don't think anyone hates in-lines, but the long time ML shooters don't feel they fit into the world of ML's as far as hunting seasons go.

 

[WV MZL HUNTER]

If you ever get a chance look for Black powder whitetails video. It is a hunting movie and a good one to watch. By Dave Ehrig Quest Productions. All sidelocks. :thumbsup: I found one on Ebay

 

[Chasam2345]

More states need to pattern after pennsylvania. Regular MZ season anything goes,but they also have a flintlock only season. Most states do not do this.I heard that one southern state has a "primitave" season that allows BP cartrige guns.

 

[feyx0006]

Future of traditional MLing? I have never been good at predicting the future, but I do know that you guys got me to bite. Now I just have to work on getting the next guy along...

 

[Frank/Pa]

We have mostly flintlock shooters at the club I belong to. There is an occasional inline shooter
on the firing line and they drive the rest of us off the line. Those things sound like a 30.06
going off. I take a break and go throw my hawk for awhile until they are done. I don't know what the attraction is. They are shooting slugs and using a scope and can't keep their shots on a paper plate at 50 yards. We try to get them interested in our traditional guns, but they blow us off.

 

[Claude Mathis]

There will always be those who participate in the niche hobby of traditional muzzleloading.

 

[akapennypincher]

There will always be those who participate in the niche hobby of traditional muzzleloading.

Claude I noticed this, "Total approved members: 13050" that the number of those approved to read the Forum. Sadly this Forum does not allow LURKERS to Read the Post son the Forum.

 

[Claude Mathis]

There will always be those who participate in the niche hobby of traditional muzzleloading.

Claude I noticed this, "Total approved members: 13050" that the number of those approved to read the Forum. Sadly this Forum does not allow LURKERS to Read the Post son the Forum.

You posted this already and I moved it to "Using the Forum". You acknowledged my answer, so I don't know why you're posting this again.

Please stay stay on topic.

 

[akapennypincher]

Because I thought the post disappeared. Maybe it should be left here for discussion. But it your Forum, and i know it did not disappear now.

 

[Claude Mathis]

Because I thought the post disappeared. Maybe it should be left here for discussion. But it your Forum, and i know it did not disappear now.

The subject of "lurkers" not being able to view the discussions is a "Using the Forum" issue and a matter of policy, not the "future of muzzleloading".

Please post any further discussion of this topic here: http://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/fusionbb/showtopic.php?tid/225699/

 

[FV Rago]

Ref. the original question, for me, I see myself as always carrying my traditonal muzzleloaders in the field. I've gotten rid of all but an old FR-8 and two shotguns, one which is just plain old and shot out.

But then, I just like some of the old ways. I don't need a special season, I don't care if you shoot inlines, if you are in the field legally, then I support ya.