Would you buy it?

[1shot]

Hi Guys,

A reputable gunshop up here in Ontario has an Investarms Hawken in .54 for sale priced at $149 canadian.
Advertised as "Good" condition I called and asked "why the low price, whats wrong with it?" after a long pause while he had a look, the response was that the rifle is great- but the previous owner failed to clean the bore so it has a "matte finish with a very slight pitting".

I believe it would be a steal at that price, but the bore issue troubles me.. So realisticly speaking, shooting PRB am I going to notice a decrease in accuracy? Now if we were talking centerfire there's no way I'd even consider a rifle with an imperfect bore- but I'm on the fence here with this potential bargain, or a potential boat anchor. :hmm:

The shop is 2 hours from where I live, so am I wasting my time on this, what would you do?

Cheers!

1Shot

 

[ss1]

IMHO you can do alot better. For that kind of money, you should be able to find one in great to excellent condition. The next 3 months the best time to buy.

 

[Desert Rat]

I'm not sure of the exchange rate but if you think it might be a steal.... :grin: pack a sandwhich and go for a drive. Nobody is going to make as accurate judgement on the condition of the barrel as you will. Get one of those bore lights if you don't already have one and check it out good.

To more answer your question I have a rifle that I got in a "steal" that has some slight pitting. Is it a competition tack driver? No. I could take game and plan on trying to with it if I can get drawn. I'm not a competion kind of tack driver shoother but am quite happy with the performace of the rifle and it is usually the rifle I grab when heading out.

 

[paulvallandigham]

If you can get that breechplug off that barrel, you could lap it and clean up the bore fairly easily. I don't know if you want to mess with it, tho'. Check the bore with a bore light of some kind. I bet he will take $100 for the gun, just to get rid of it. He probably paid only $20.00 for it.

 

[shmrck1]

Paul,
I may be showing my ignorance here but is removing
the breechplug the only way to lap the barrel?
I've never had to do it but I know those that have and I don't believe they removed the breechplug. Just wondering...
snake-eyes:hmm:

 

[Johnny Tremain]

Buy a bottle of browning solultion and lightly pit the rest of the outside of the barrel

 

[paulvallandigham]

No, but if you want to do a very good job, that is the way to do it. You can polish the lands by using a tight cleaning patch with touthpaste, or lapping compound on it, and work it back and forth in the barrel. It will take off any surface rust, and will polish the lands. That will make pushing a ball down easier. But, this kind of lapping rarely does anything to the grooves in the barrel, which are proably also rough from the neglect. A lead lap properly cast, on a steel rod, with a screw on the end so that you can tighten the lap as it wears down is the way to go.The lead lap cast in the barrel will reach down into the grooves and remove metal from them to smooth out the pits and corrosion there.

Now, some target shooters use brass laps, every night during a shoot, to work off the top finish of the lands to get a new sharp edge for the next day's shooting. This is made out of a section of brass pipe, with slits cut into it, so that it looks like some of the anchors used to hold bolts in concrete. A screw is turned making the strips on the pipe between the slits expand outword, and increase the contact with the lands. The lapping compound is put on the outside of this slit brass tube. The brass does a fine job of holding the lapping compound against the lands, cutting away some of the land( measured in 10 thousandths of an inch ) and form that new edge the shooters want.

I hope this helps you understand what is possible. If you use toothpaste, it will wash out with hot water and soap. The lapping compound may require you flush the barrel with alcohol if it has a petroleum base to it.

 

[shmrck1]

Paul,
Thanks, I more or less figured it was a matter if
you want to do it right, remove the breechplug.
snake-eyes :hatsoff:

 

[boar]

If you got to look at it, take a good rod and jag and some PB Rust Blaster or WD40 to run down bore before the bore light. I just bought a CVA 70's Kentucky kit that was never finished. I had a hard time getting a lubed patch(WD) to start down the barrel, most of the rust was at the muzzle as gun had never been fired. After I could run patch up and down, I used lapping compound on wet patch, then used a 20 ga. brush with PB blaster. I killed a groundhog the third shot out of the gun. You can see some real light pitting at the muzzle, the barrel is smooth and don't cut the patches. Now the gun that was shot might have pitting the length of it. But if not real deep shouldn't hurt. My buddy bought a TC Renagade for 75.00. The guy had shot plastic sabots in it and it had rusted under the plastic. My buddy had a gunsmith friend de breach it and polish it. Came out like a new one. Dilly

 

[spitpatch]

If it was not cleaned after bp I would not take the drive. I would bet it is going to be worse than the dealer told you over the phone when you look at it. If you go to look at it take a rod and several patches of different sizes. Run a tight patch down the bore. It should be smooth down and back. If not back off. Also the tang is best left alone. If you mess with the breach there is a good chance you will end up with junk. Just my two cents worth. Jim

 

[cowpoke1955]

You could always get a drop in barrel. But after the cost of the rifle and a barrel, you might as well get a new Lyman Trade Rifle. They are made by Investarms and a Hawkens style. At least you'll have a completely new rifle. Just a thought.

 

[2172]

The best bargain I ever got was an online purchase of a Ruger Vaquero that the seller stated, "NRA good conditionexcept Gun was fired with black powder cartridge and not cleaned. Has a ring at base of bbl' Since I wanted it only for company while hiking in a few tough places, with a good snake load in one chamber, I bought it for $200...they were going for about $274-300 at the time. Ten minutes with a bronze brush removed the caked ring....gun shoots great...me, I'd buy that gun, as a gamble, having first got him to bring it down about $C10...Hank

 

[redwing]

Fire lapping will work wonders on a rough bore. You can get a wheeler kit from Midway, it works. :thumbsup:

 

[playfarmers]

I would pass on it. A rough bore is a brute to clean, I know all about that, I have one. Wholesale Sports in Calgary has new Lyman Trade rifles for $339. I just got a new .54 from them. To me that is a far better deal.

 

[1shot]

Thank you, to all who replied. :winking:

It seems that the majority of you feel I can do better than this particular example, so I'll pass. The salesman is likely playing down the corrosion issue, and speaking honestly- I'm not good/experienced enough to hone/polish a bore to perfection.

I'll keep on looking!
Cheers guys,

1Shot

 

[renovato]

I've rescued a few frosty bores in the past and they've all turned out to be good shooters. If the pitting is really bad, I'd pass on it, but if not, it might be worth a little labor to get it shooting again.

A little 0000 steel wool wrapped around a nylon brush and some oil will remove most of the surface rust. Once you're down to bare metal, you can polish it up pretty well with a patch wrapped around the brush and some compound. A lead lap is really the best way to go, but not always necessary.

 

[CrackStock]

First check to see that this gun is not loaded now. :shocked2:

Use a rod to wipe whatever oily goo this guy will have down there to mask the damage. :hmm:

Then use a fishing bobber light to look down it.

If you feel pitting, pass.

CS

 

[MikeFromON]

If it is a flintlock and you don't want to buy it, please send me a private message with the shop phone number and address. I will buy it. A lot of these guys in the USA don't realize that guns in general cost 2 or 3 times as much up here as they do down there, so $149 for almost ANY rifle in Canada is a steal. If the bore is so bad that you can't get it to shoot straight yourself, then why not have it reamed out to a .58 smoothbore? That should be a relatively inexpensive operation for any good machine shop to handle.

 

[nj1639]

If it is a flintlock and you don't want to buy it, please send me a private message with the shop phone number and address. I will buy it. A lot of these guys in the USA don't realize that guns in general cost 2 or 3 times as much up here as they do down there, so $149 for almost ANY rifle in Canada is a steal. If the bore is so bad that you can't get it to shoot straight yourself, then why not have it reamed out to a .58 smoothbore? That should be a relatively inexpensive operation for any good machine shop to handle.

So..that would equal out to 50 U.S. dollars. Lock, stock and hardware would be worth it alone.

 

[Keppy]

I bought a Investment arms .54 Cal,28 inch barrel at a gunshop a while back. The rifle was loaded with pellets of some kind. The shop didn't even know it was loaded until I pointed it out and showed them why I knew it was loaded. It seemed to be pitted at first look because it hadn't been cleaned. I was taking a chance on buying it. But for $100. I thought it was worth the chance. It cleaned up good and is a good shooter. I believe Investment arms has a chrome lined barrel. So maybe that help it. It does have a couple of light pits but has no efect on it. I have seen nice clean ones for $200. but new are not cheap. Oh and the one I bought was not a Hawkens. Sometimes a little TLC makes a big diffrence. Good luck.