You REALLY want to ship to California??

[smoothshooter]

Might miss the chance on "both ends". Muzzleloaders are NOT classed as firearms in California. If you should run into a dealer that thinks different, that's THEIR problem and yours if you pass up the chance to make a sale.

There are plenty of other states.

 

[smoothshooter]

I don't mind the question. In my case, it was a few things. I guess you could say I grew up always wanting to be a cop, but once I got there, I was pretty different than what I thought. I had a pretty romanticized, idealized notion about rule of law and the Constitution and all that... but saw way too many instances of people abusing the trust the public puts in them. Got DWB'd enough times to realize that the system that protects that kind of thing is rotten to start with. So I realized it really wasn't for me. I never liked seeing humans at their very worst or becoming paranoid or adopting this attitude of 'us against them.' So now, I serve the Constitution by making the government (and yes, the cops are the government) cross all the t's and dot all the i's. I challenge all their evidence and make sure they understand that if their case isn't strong enough to withstand my scrutiny and challenge, then they don't deserve a conviction. As for the political environment, you and I probably don't see eye-to-eye on that. It's only bad for cops if you believe they should be able to do whatever to whomever, and it happened however they said it did. I know better, and I believe sunlight is the best disinfectant and good cops have nothing to fear from intense scrutiny.

So you’re a lawyer now?

 

[Sam squanch]

A guy in Texas used a cap and ball to hold up a store. The thread is in here, I believe.

 

[vintovka]

May add we were progressively (pun intended) forced out of CA. I saw it begin as early as 1964 in East LA. We tried distancing ourselves by moving north to no avail. We kept moving to more and more rural areas. as far as we could affordably commute. All the time we knew full well we would be eventually be "overrun" by both population and politics. Sadly I predicted that when we broke ground on our "dream' home in the Gold country foothills we would forced out in 15 years. That happened to the day. We left CA knowing we don't have another 15.

 

[skyhigh315]

People are concerned that if they ship even a muzzleloading firearm to a individual in California, and said muzzleloading firearm is later used in a crime, the state may try to come after them, with help from the atf. No thanks.

They ought to have that same concern about shipping a tub of cottage cheese, then. If said cottage cheese is later used in a crime, the seller is no less likely to be legally jeopardized than the guy who shipped a BP 'curio.' People ought to at least TRY to base their concerns on facts.

 

[skyhigh315]

A guy in Texas used a cap and ball to hold up a store. The thread is in here, I believe.

I saw a video of a guy using an Airsoft pistol to rob diners in a restaurant. It ended very badly for him when a CCW holder turned out to have an actual gun on him.

 

[Sam squanch]

A tub of cottage cheese is not the same as a firearm. The California state government has shown time and time again that they are very anti second amendment and will go after the little guy. Nothing personal to anyone in Cali, but I won’t ship anything that goes boom there. Matchlock musket or modern weapon.

 

[vintovka]

In defense of the poor folks still trapped there i know that actual enforcement may be non-existent. My remaining CA LEO contacts say they are having severe staffing problems and crime is off scale. Many are taking early retirements and leaving the state ASAP joining the mass exodus of wealth and stability.

 

[Sam squanch]

It’s just a matter of time before the gangs and ninja wannabes realize a black powder pistol may be the perfect assassination weapon, no casings, get one easier than a modern weapon. Then the bore rusts up in police custody, rendering a rifling match useless. Then the state will restrict them.

 

[skyhigh315]

A tub of cottage cheese is not the same as a firearm. The California state government has shown time and time again that they are very anti second amendment and will go after the little guy. Nothing personal to anyone in Cali, but I won’t ship anything that goes boom there. Matchlock musket or modern weapon.

Legally speaking, a tub of cottage cheese is precisely the same as a black-powder gun in regards to criminal liability of a seller or shipper to a recipient in CA who later uses it un a crime. 'Anti-2A' is a subjective opinion, but LAWS are a bit more 'black-and-white.' You generally can't be prosecuted under an opinion, especially if the opinion is based primarily in anecdote or even just good ol' fashioned, uninformed 'liberal-hating' misunderstanding of existing law. If I had a dollar for every time someone told me about all the anti-gun 'laws' in CA that don't exist, I'd be rich. Don't get me wrong, there are some head-scratchingly stupid laws here that give you a migraine to try to understand (like the ammo regs), but when it comes to BP guns, there's not much there there.

 

[skyhigh315]

It’s just a matter of time before the gangs and ninja wannabes realize a black powder pistol may be the perfect assassination weapon, no casings, get one easier than a modern weapon. Then the bore rusts up in police custody, rendering a rifling match useless. Then the state will restrict them.

D'oh! Now THAT is one of the more intelligent comments/concerns I've read on the matter. Maybe keep that under wraps because you're right. I once penned a short-story where a prohibited person used a BP gun to take out a guy who wronged him. He uses Pyrodex deliberately to rust out the whole gun so after a week, the cops wouldn't even be able to take it apart!

 

[Sam squanch]

The Irish rebels in the 1700’s -1800’s would give a fleet footed youth a pistol, have him take out the intended person, then drop the pistol and RUN. With a network of safe houses, they were rarely caught. Not so far fetched today in an urban crowded area. And as far as I know, a firearm in evidence is not touched or cleaned in any way. Years ago, a murder weapon was fished out of a flooded clay pit after 2 years. No ballistic evidence could be determined due to rust.

 

[BillyC]

I’m pretty sure every single thing I have ever bought off the internet has a warning stating that in the state of CA this item could cause cancer. That state is as goofy as a soup sandwich.

 

[skyhigh315]

I’m pretty sure every single thing I have ever bought off the internet has a warning stating that in the state of CA this item could cause cancer. That state is as goofy as a soup sandwich.

Haha!

Soup sandwich! That's a first for me. That's hilarious. I guess the flip-side to that would be when known carcinogens don't rate a consumer warning at all. Sometimes, people don't know and would maybe take a precaution if they did. I saw a discussion on bullet molding where people were posting pics of their setups and someone started a 'I started my kids in bullet molding young' thread. Cue all the pictures of grandpas teaching their toddler grandkids to melt, pour, handle and sort lead balls and bullets. Finally a member who happened to be a pediatrician made a comment about how incredibly toxic lead is to developing brains. Well, he turned out to be from California, so you can imagine the hate and vitriol he got dipped in before they finally booted him from the group. For warning these guys that they were poisoning their grandchildren. :/

 

[earlwb]

I needed to send the Trijicon sights on my revolver in to be repaired or replaced. But I would have to send it to their California facility though. So I haven’t done it. With all of the stealing of mail and packages going on there I am not sure they would be lost or not there.

But I have to agree in that we can’t send gun related things there anymore. The crazy California laws just confuse everyone. It is best to simply not take the chance. But I think that people should be more civil about it and not so insulting though.

 

[skyhigh315]

I needed to send the Trijicon sights on my revolver in to be repaired or replaced. But I would have to send it to their California facility though. So I haven’t done it. With all of the stealing of mail and packages going on there I am not sure they would be lost or not there.

But I have to agree in that we can’t send gun related things there anymore. The crazy California laws just confuse everyone. It is best to simply not take the chance. But I think that people should be more civil about it and not so insulting though.

Which laws in particular? I can't think of a single one that would have anything to do with what you're trying to get done. Also, there's certainly crime here, but statistics don't bear out the perception that it's higher here than in other states. That's just hype. Definitely agree on the civility part.

 

[beardedhorse]

There was a chat on here recently about someone who did rob a store or bank with a brass frame, long barrel cap and ball revolver. Not sure if they caught him but cameras did show a long barreled six gun like Pietta's. Hoping it doesn't change classification of black powder firearms.

 

[Sam squanch]

It will in California, Washington , and Oregon.

 

[brushblind]

Hehe,

Well, I wasn't so much looking for business advice about who to buy from as I was pointing out that this notion of buying/selling BP guns in this state is mostly BS. To your point, you 'heard' something about 'Liberal Counties' that thousands of people probably heard from the same water cooler. Near as I can tell, it's a good example of my point, though, because I've had no issues in SF County, SLO, Stanislaus, Berkeley or LA. It doesn't get more liberal than some of those. I'm in San Diego now, but like everywhere else here, they just go by the state law... which is very lax on BP guns.

What good is a BP gun when you can be in for difficult times if caught with lead, which is what I shoot in all my BP guns? Lead really isn't that harmful in solid form, just the fumes and dust! I recently watched one of those CA Game Dept. shows and couldn't believe how the LEO's were practically salivating over catching a hunter with lead bullets, disgusting!

 

[BillyC]

Haha!

Soup sandwich! That's a first for me. That's hilarious. I guess the flip-side to that would be when known carcinogens don't rate a consumer warning at all. Sometimes, people don't know and would maybe take a precaution if they did. I saw a discussion on bullet molding where people were posting pics of their setups and someone started a 'I started my kids in bullet molding young' thread. Cue all the pictures of grandpas teaching their toddler grandkids to melt, pour, handle and sort lead balls and bullets. Finally a member who happened to be a pediatrician made a comment about how incredibly toxic lead is to developing brains. Well, he turned out to be from California, so you can imagine the hate and vitriol he got dipped in before they finally booted him from the group. For warning these guys that they were poisoning their grandchildren. :/

Agreed but when you put a warning on everything people get tired of seeing it and then it starts to lose all meaning. Kind of like how everything is racist these days, roads, trees, history, pretty soon no one listens