Your take on the NRA

[waksupi]

Hardball, it is legal to own a machine gun. All it takes is a background check, and $300 for the Federal license. I know several owners around here, and quite a few more in Canada, than in the states. I have an HK G3 hanging over my door at the time, with a full magazine. That Second Amendment isn't about hunting or re-enacting. We shouldn't need to pay the government extortion. Looking at crime statistics, use of any type of assault weapon is hardly a blip on the screen. But the anti-gun crowd uses them because of what they concieve to be an "ugly gun". When you get right down to it, I'd rather have some hoodlum shooting at me with a poodle shooter, than one man with a good flintlock rifle. The man with the flintlock will probably hit what he is shooting at. The NRA carries the weight on these larger national issues. The state organizations need to tote the load at thier level, mainly because even at the state level, it is somewhat difficult to keep up on what is being put forth, either hidden, or in plain sight. I know our state legislature is currently putting forth bills, that I will be wading through. And I generally find some seemingly innocuous sounding bill that will hurt gun rights, and I contact the local representative about it, to hopefully get it killed. Things can move quickly at state level, and we need to keep up on what is happening in our back yard.

 

[ronnyvous1]

Good to see that this forum has a lot of participants that do some serious thinking and provoke discussion, that's how we learn, and prevent others from taking this all away from us.
I made the NRA comment over on the "Pin" thread, and it looks like I am not alone. Like the NMLRA, I still pay my dues, and after I finally figured out how to get them to quit asking for more money the mailings are down to a sackful a year, not a sackful a week. I belong to the NMLRA because it represents my interests specifically in muzzleloading, although it can't engage in politics overtly due to it's tax status, it can keep us informed. I belong to SCOPE because it is about the best at keeping Albany in check on a state level. (Out of staters should look at the website, these guys really keep at 'em in an essentially anti-gun state) And I belong to the NRA because that's all there is between us and "them". I was very disappointed in the caving on assault weapons. There has been a time honored method of encroachment on rights at work here, that of incremental reduction. Or, plainly stated, "give 'em an ich, they'll take a mile". Will the next step be "Saturday Night Specials", an old term dredged up and twisted by the anti's to cover any handgun that is concealable and costs under $500.00 ? Or will the M1 Garand no longer be legal despite the fact that it is one of the classic tools of freedom? Eventually, it will get to the point that your Bess will be an assault weapon beacause of the large bore and bayonet lug. Look at the black powder restrictions, since 9/11. There hasn't been any, or at least darned few, bombs made with Goex since the days of the old anarchists with the cartoon bombs. Fertilizer and fuel are the new choices, the restrictions on BP sales are strictly regulated, yet more are in the works.
My stance is that I want my organizations to draw the line, to give no more ground. I want them to instead, educate the public that the GCA of '68 restricted machine guns, and sawed off weapons pretty effectively, it just needs to be enforced. I want them to explain that the AK's and MAC 10's that are converted to rock and roll autos are illegal, and that banning them won't magically make the bad guys give them up. Get the lobbyists to push enactment and enforcement of non-negotiable sentences for illegal use of firearms. So, yes, I am critical of them, but better the devil you know than the one you don't! I have a very real fear of someday opening the paper and seeing that someone has exposed a whole herd of financial misdeeds in the organization, or diversion of our money into places other than those directly affecting the fight to protect our rights and promote our sports.

 

[BrownBear]

Been a lifer since the 60's. Got sick of all the calls for bucks and stopped by their national office to see what I was buying. Never saw so many fancy cars as there are in that parking lot. Sure could use some of them in my neighborhood. I don't think there's a building in this whole state as fancy as that headquarters. Visitin and talkin to them about how they spend your money is a whole lot like visitin and talkin to your congressman. Sure got the feeling that all the members are is deep pockets for them- behave and don't make waves in our pond, but please send money.

They may have my vote on some things, but I'm through writing checks. Trust myself better to put my money in the right place than I do them. Don't like being patted on the head and treated like a smuck.

 

[HardBall]

Hardball, it is legal to own a machine gun.

My point was that.. Too many people didn't understand the idiocy of the ban, much less what it meant- heck, I seem to remember it taking them a long time to actually define what an "assault weapon" was? Here is where I think the NRA did a poor job of getting their message across.:imo:

In a perfect world, elected officials would make decisions based on belief, judgment and convictions. However, politicians generally make decisions based on their ultimate goal which is getting re-elected, thus, are supremely influenced in whatever the latest issue that has the voters riled up.


Regarding things starting at the state level: I completely agree with you that we should keep watch over the politics

 

[ronnyvous1]

The state organizations need to tote the load at thier level, mainly because even at the state level, it is somewhat difficult to keep up on what is being put forth, either hidden, or in plain sight. I know our state legislature is currently putting forth bills, that I will be wading through. And I generally find some seemingly innocuous sounding bill that will hurt gun rights, and I contact the local representative about it, to hopefully get it killed. Things can move quickly at state level, and we need to keep up on what is happening in our back yard.

Very good stand. While we all can log on here and raise cain, we also have to do so with our elected officials and lobbyists!! A really good quote came to mind as I read this post, from someone who was pretty much in step with the real meaning of the freedoms we still have:

"You cannot be, I know, nor do I wish to see you, an inactive spectator....We have too many high sounding words, and too few actions that correspond with them."

Abigail Adams, to John Adams while he was at the Continental Congress in Philadelphia.

 

[HardBall]

My stance is that I want my organizations to draw the line, to give no more ground.

I'm not sure I could make a blanket statement like that... I would love to- no doubt!

I want them to instead, educate the public that the GCA of '68 restricted machine guns, and sawed off weapons pretty effectively, it just needs to be enforced. I want them to explain that the AK's and MAC 10's that are converted to rock and roll autos are illegal, and that banning them won't magically make the bad guys give them up. Get the lobbyists to push enactment and enforcement of non-negotiable sentences for illegal use of firearms.

Now that's exactly what I want them to do!!! The more informed the average voter is, the less likely he'll believe the BS the anti-gunners dish out. The less momentum (popular opinion) they have, the less likely they are to influence congressmen.

 

just a 'thought'..... Do you have a STATE gun owners assocation ????? do you belong??? evere thought of starting one ???? I think you can accomplish more closer to home than by funding an orginaization that is CLEARLY only interested in NATIONAL policies and makin a buck... :m2c:

 

[BLAHMAN]

I was a member for many years, but let it slide. I was also a member of the NMLRA, but that too went by the wayside. I think both groups are needed to protect gun owners and that second ammendment. I really don't think the "gun grabbers" really want to solve the "gun problem" because they would have nothing to actually rally around after that.
Ever notice that the issue of "gun control" as a problem is not consistantly on the forfront of "news"? It comes and goes and I think it is done to stir people up emotionally. Emotional thinking, as opposed to rationale thinking, will grasp at anything and take a stand, no matter how ridiculous.
The arguement should be made that it is not "gun control", but instead "people control". Inanimate objects cannot be forced and should not be demanded to make MORAL decisions. Thus the argument guns don't kill people, people kill people.
That is hard to say, however, when a mother or father loses a loved one to gun violence, or a husband loses a wife to gun violence, or a child plays with a gun. Somethings cannot be prevented and things do happen, that is life and death is part of that circle.
I would like to see the NRA decsribe "gun control" just as "people control" and see what happens. It would also be interesting to keep stats on just how people die in violent situations (I'm sure these are kept) ie: so and so died from a hammer blow, a baby was shaken to death, somebody drank so much they poisened themselves etc, etc, etc. It would also be nice to have a few people in the "press" actually be a gun and hunting advocate (fat chance that will happen). Somebody needs to buy some of those radio talk show host a membership to the NRA, perhaps that may make a difference (Sean Hannity for instance). :m2c:

 

Folks,

I have to say this is the most rational and well written thread I've ever seen on any gun forum regarding the NRA. Usually, it just degenerates into yelling and name-calling. :curse: :haha:

I joined as a teenager in 1972 and am now a current member but lapsed for about 20 or so years in-between. The NRA is a huge political lobby but also the only major pro-gun voice in Washington. I do not care for the rhetoric or politics but where would we be if they did not exist at all? For the most part, gun owners were treated pretty well at the Federal level until the 1968 Gun Bill was passed and then everyone felt betrayed. The NRA and gun owners got on the bandwagon and and the debate has escalated continuously ever since. When a Columbine or some other tragedy happens, the usual media BS starts and all the "talking heads" get on TV to tell us how bad guns are. Then the NRA starts their rhetoric and both sides get a few more days of job security - but the root cause is never solved...I do not say this to diminish the loss but the real reasons are usually overlooked.

I was born in the late 1950's and grew up on the outskirts of a large metropolitan city. Most of the boys that I grew up with either hunted or had some exposure to firearms. Combat!, Rawhide and The Rifleman were on TV and fistfights happened almost every day but we did not take guns to school and kill each other. I now have four grown sons, two of which are still in high school. We live in a rural area but many of their friends are not gun savvy. They do play a lot of video games and fistfights are now grounds for assault charges. I am not going to blame any specific thing for the trend but I do believe that gun awareness and education within the public has decreased over the years. If there is no voice speaking for the gun owner in the future, then the anti-gun forces will eventually achieve their agenda. The NRA is not perfect but better than nothing :m2c:

 

[GregK]

Folks,

I have to say this is the most rational and well written thread I've ever seen on any gun forum regarding the NRA. Usually, it just degenerates into yelling and name-calling. :curse: :haha:

I joined as a teenager in 1972 and am now a current member but lapsed for about 20 or so years in-between. The NRA is a huge political lobby but also the only major pro-gun voice in Washington. I do not care for the rhetoric or politics but where would we be if they did not exist at all? For the most part, gun owners were treated pretty well at the Federal level until the 1968 Gun Bill was passed and then everyone felt betrayed. The NRA and gun owners got on the bandwagon and and the debate has escalated continuously ever since. When a Columbine or some other tragedy happens, the usual media BS starts and all the "talking heads" get on TV to tell us how bad guns are. Then the NRA starts their rhetoric and both sides get a few more days of job security - but the root cause is never solved...I do not say this to diminish the loss but the real reasons are usually overlooked.

I was born in the late 1950's and grew up on the outskirts of a large metropolitan city. Most of the boys that I grew up with either hunted or had some exposure to firearms. Combat!, Rawhide and The Rifleman were on TV and fistfights happened almost every day but we did not take guns to school and kill each other. I now have four grown sons, two of which are still in high school. We live in a rural area but many of their friends are not gun savvy. They do play a lot of video games and fistfights are now grounds for assault charges. I am not going to blame any specific thing for the trend but I do believe that gun awareness and education within the public has decreased over the years. If there is no voice speaking for the gun owner in the future, then the anti-gun forces will eventually achieve their agenda. The NRA is not perfect but better than nothing :m2c:

Well said Anvil. I'm a Life Member. Don't contribute the dollars like I used to (I'm tired of all the solicitations and Sunday afternoon phone calls). But they are the only game in town for the gun owners. I give them credit for getting as much pro gun legislation passed as possible and for getting as many pro gun politicians elected as possible.

 

the NRA is NOT the 'only' game in town... nor is the NMLRA..how about http://www.gunowners.org or as i said before your own STATE organizations ??? or R.K.B.A. ??? http://www.keepandbeararms.com
http://www.rkba.org there ARE others fighting for us...........

 

[roundball]

the NRA is NOT the 'only' game in town... nor is the NMLRA..how about http://www.gunowners.org or as i said before your own STATE organizations ??? or R.K.B.A. ??? http://www.keepandbeararms.com
http://www.rkba.org there ARE others fighting for us...........

Greg, I may be wrong, but I don't think those others have formally, legally established lobbyist organizations like the NRA does...ie: we know the NMLRA does not.

A few years ago some gun magazine articles started floating around advocating that the variety of individual pro-gun, pro-rights groups (there were about a dozen) approach the NRA to start hammering out some sort of confederation with the NRA, to get even more voter population and 'weight' into and behind the established NRA lobbying machinery in Washington...don't know if that ever went anywhere though, I guess not or we'd have heard about it
:m2c:

 

I could almost swear to it that the GOA was some off shoot of the NRA. I am sure I used to get solicitations for it from the NRA. I actually think I joined them back then but sometimes I suffer from CRS.

This has been an informative thread and I guess it's time to give the NRA another thought.

I hope opinions will continue to be added to this discussion.

Thanks

 

I'm an "easy pay life" (life membership on the installment plan) NRA member . Back before I got married , became a father , and eventually a divoriced father , I would send the NRA some money now and then . It seemed like the more money I sent , the more letters I would get saying they needed more money :hmm: :bull: . If you stop sending them money , you will , after a while , stop getting the letters . After I finish paying for my life membership , I will still send the NRA an annual donation , since they do alot to promote shooting activities and gun ownership as well as the political stuff , and IMHO if it wasn't for the NRA , the only thing we might be shooting today would be slingshots :: . :m2c:

 

[GregK]

the NRA is NOT the 'only' game in town... nor is the NMLRA..how about http://www.gunowners.org or as i said before your own STATE organizations ??? or R.K.B.A. ??? http://www.keepandbeararms.com
http://www.rkba.org there ARE others fighting for us...........

I'm also a member of the Illinois Rifle Association. The NRA is the only "significant" game in the town of Washington DC, that has the clout to make the politicians take notice. :imo:

 

[Zonie]

34 year member here.
To the best of my knowledge, the NRA never sold my name to any other organizations. Ya, I sometimes got ads from places I didn't know, but they could have found my name and address from some of the other magazines I subscribed to.

To the best of my knowledge, GOA and the others are not a part of the NRA. They have tried to get me to join by hinting that they are affiliated with the NRA, and at other times they seem to stress how the NRA isn't doing all it could, so I should join their group. They haven't convinced me that they could do anything that the NRA isn't already doing so I haven't joined them.
If I am going to send my money to anyone, it will be the NRA because at least some of it is going towards a position I (usually) agree with and they have the Lobby to get it heard by the Congress.
The NRA also seems to have a considerable amount of power when it comes to the election of the President. Two anti-gunners aren't in office at the moment and I think the NRA had a great deal to do with that.

 

Ineresting question. I have been an NRA member off and, mostly on, since I was able to join. I too have some problems with the way they approach members and certain issues. For example -- they were constantly sending me notices that I needed to renew my membership when in fact, I did not. In one instance they literally tried to double bill me and the letters I got from them were at the point of being threatening. I eventully got in touch with Mr. LaPeare and laid my cards on the table. They made things right. Now -- with all that in mind I have to keep in mind that the NRA is the only organization we have that has the power to defend the Second Amendment and defend the right of gun ownership. I recently heard a left wing politician say on a radio show that the only rights American have are ".. to read a newspaper and own a gun an I am not happy with the last one." The man who said that is not only a fascist but a danger to freedom wherever it is. If I need to put up with some ogranazational inepatude that the NRA has its basically okay with me as long as they keep fighting the good and right fight.

 

[RussB]

Zonie seez: "If I am going to send my money to anyone, it will be the NRA because at least some of it is going towards a position I (usually) agree with and they have the Lobby to get it heard by the Congress.
The NRA also seems to have a considerable amount of power when it comes to the election of the President. Two anti-gunners aren't in office at the moment and I think the NRA had a great deal to do with that."
....................................................................................
This reflects my own position as well as I could say it myself.
I don't like the constant reminder that the organization needs funds to operate, to fight this bill, or that bill, or whatever "we" are faced with, many of them I had no idea was happening...but I try hard to understand.

If a "bad" bill passed in Oregon, and Idaho, you can bet your last dollar it is going to pass in Washington state whether I know about it or not!

I try hard to be positive, but I find myself saying "Damnit, not again", everytime I open one of those letters....about 45 years as a member and things have changed, and it's all for the worse. But, again...I try to understand.

Freedom is not free. And, private ownership of guns is not free either...somebody must fight the good fight, and NRA is the best I've seen in this lifetime....now this, I do understand.

Russ

 

[Maestro]

The NRA is not perfect but better than nothing :m2c:

:agree:
I give them credit for getting as much pro gun legislation passed as possible and for getting as many pro gun politicians elected as possible.

:agree:

I can't afford to pay dues to all the organizations that I would like to support (NWTF, TU, United Bowhunters of PA, Pheasants Forever, etc., etc..) but I pay my dues to the NRA every year. Without that basic right, I couldn't enjoy the others. :m2c:

BTW, I called and requested to have all the mailings stop about five years ago and they've honored that request totally - the only mailing I get is one re: renewal.

 

[Maestro]

... not that I use a 12 gauge for trout or profess to have a ".50 cal. bow"!

:what: