Zeroing Advice Needed

[Valkyrie]

I finally got my TVM Late Lancaster in .50 a couple weeks ago. I took her to the range yesterday to start getting it zeroed.

I started at 20 yards and using a standard pumpkin on a post sight picture I got the windage good and started at 50 yards. My groups are a couple inches to the right and and with judicious file work I'm two inches low.

A couple issues. I had my patches actually burning through like a donut. They were prelubed .10 and obviously too thin. I switched to pillow ticking and a lube recipe I was given for 3:1 deer tallow to coconut oil. My gun loads great and the patches have nothing but rifling streaks on them. Groups at 50 are about 1 1/2".

I'm just a little wary of these last couple inches of adjustment. A file stroke here and a drift of the sights there.

My question is I want to go with a 70 yard zero. I'm an old service rifle competitor so I'm very good with iron sights. I'm using 70 gr of FFFg powder under a .490 ball. Is 70 yards realistic or should I stick with a 50 yard zero and use a little guesstimate at further distance?

 

[Zonie]

Many think 70 yards or so is an excellent distance to use to sight in a rifle that's going to be used for hunting.

That's because sighted in at 70 yards, a gun shooting a patched roundball will be shooting around 1 1/8" high at 50 yards and 4 1/2" low at 100 yards.

If the gun was sighted in at 80 yards it would be shooting about 1 7/8" high at 50 yards and 3 1/8 low at 100 yards.

Had it been sighted in for 50 yards it would be dead center at 50 but it would be shooting 6 3/4" low at 100 yards.

On a deer sized critter, 4 1/2" low isn't too bad but almost 7" low could be out of the area of the vitals.

 

[excess650]

I would want to be a little high at 50, not more than 2" high, and still want to know where to expect impact out to 100 yards.

 

[Col. Batguano]

You have to find your best load for your primary use of the gun before you start messing with the sights. If it's primarily going to be a target gun, there is no good reason to be developing loads and adjusting your sights for 100+ grain charges.

50 grain charges are going to have a different POI than 70 grain charges.

 

[azmntman]

I'd run a 100 er so balls through it before I filed much more. Once its brokein it may change

 

[Valkyrie]

I put about 60 round through it yesterday. I'm gonna try to get it a little more adjusted tomorrow. It's a hi to g gun and I don't think I'll be using 100gr loads. I started with 40 and moved up to 70 just to see how it shot. I'll see what 80 does tomorrow before I do any more work on the sights.

I'm curious if anyone stakes the sights after it's zeroed? I mean staking as in using a center punch to tighten up the dove tail around the sight base.

 

[mooman76]

Finalize your load before you finish adjusting the sights. Final load configuration, patch lube you want to use and powder load. You don't want to adjust to what is working for now only to change later. It think most do set the sights once they are where we want. It still isn't totally permanent, even set so if some day you decide to change, you can still adjust or buy new sights.

 

[Valkyrie]

Sounds good. That's why I stopped where I did. I got it a little low and the widage looked perfect at 20 but out at 50 she's 2" right shooting three shot groups. So I am going to take some time over the next few days and see what works best. I whacked a buck on the archery opener on Saturday so I have a lot of time, archery season lasted about two hours this year. Lol. Last year was even less. Saving my do tag for winter flintlock!

ETA. This is my first flintlock that wasn't a factory mass produced gun. All I can say is wow. I had two FTF where the pan didn't ignite but a wipe with an alcohol pad on the flint edge and the frizzen fixed it both times. After 60 or so shots I'm still on the same untouched flint too. Never had that with either of my TCs. They shoot good but nothing like this it is a fast gun.

 

[coloradoclyde]

I'd run a 100 er so balls through it before I filed much more. Once its brokein it may change

:thumbsup:

 

[Valkyrie]

I ran another 50 rounds then did a good cleaning. Sat back down at the bench and got the windage perfect. Over another 60 rounds I dialed in the elevation to 1 1/2" high at 50 yards. Groups are holding steady at about an inch but it's tough because I need to put a facet on the front sight blade to get a better picture. I'm very happy. I am on the second flint so far. The first lasted close to 100 shots. I knapped it twice.

I did touch the top barrel flat with the file edge. It went through the tape I had around the sight. It's very very small spot though maybe 1/32" so I'm gonna use a little cold blue to cover it.

 

[BrownBear]

Is 70 yards realistic or should I stick with a 50 yard zero and use a little guesstimate at further distance?

I'm a sincere fan of 75 yard zeros. Your 70 grains of 3f likely will drop a little more than my 80 grains of 3f in my own 50's, but with a 75 yard zero I'm about 5" low at 100 and approx an inch high at 50, and pretty much dead on at 25. Hard for me to come up with a better combo for a "100 yard gun."

 

[Valkyrie]

Is 70 yards realistic or should I stick with a 50 yard zero and use a little guesstimate at further distance?

I'm a sincere fan of 75 yard zeros. Your 70 grains of 3f likely will drop a little more than my 80 grains of 3f in my own 50's, but with a 75 yard zero I'm about 5" low at 100 and approx an inch high at 50, and pretty much dead on at 25. Hard for me to come up with a better combo for a "100 yard gun."

I tried shooting 80 and 90 grains. At 90 it seemed I would get slightly larger groups. I didn't see a difference between 70 and 80. 70 works for now. I'll keep shooting it to see how it settles in. But I'm pretty happy with it.

 

[mooman76]

Well what it really comes down with is what you are happy with. It doesn't matter how good the advice is we give you if in the end you are not happy with the results.

 

[Valkyrie]

Well what it really comes down with is what you are happy with. It doesn't matter how good the advice is we give you if in the end you are not happy with the results.

Well I was able to break a few clay pigeons at 60 yards but from a rest. I held right on. I have to admit I probably would have tighter groups but my 19 year old flight physical eyes that were 20/10 are now correctable to 20/20 with a pair of bifocals that I forgot at home. That front sight is a little tough. I'm gonna paint the blade fluorescent green.

Not even sure I need a 100 yard gun. I hunt my own property and haven't killed a deer that was over 50 yards in ten years. But the challenge of learning to shoot these guns at distance sounds fun.

 

[Wes/Tex]

I didn't see that you specifically mentioned what rifle you're using or it's barrel length but an old trick that Sam Fadala got going again is to sight in at 13 yards instead of the traditional 50. The trick is to get near 1800 fps which is usually obtainable with a 80 grain load in many rifles but gives a trajectory of dead on at 13 yards, +1" at 50 yards, -1" at 100 yards but drops -6" at 125 yards. This makes a dead on hold out to 100 yards with no more than a 1 inch difference up or down possible. If you're not shooting beyond that distance, it may be just the ticket and it's a lot easier getting on paper at only 13 yards. Good luck with whatever you do. :thumbsup:

 

[BigBoreBLR]

Sounds like your doing good.

I'm a 45 and 54 guy, no 50s except for a loaner gun I have.

54s for hunting are 100 yards dead on.

45s for target/hunting are 75 dead on.

 

[Loyalist Dave]

No matter what, IF you are planning on being able to engage a deer out to 100 yards, or even to 70 you will need to practice not only the shooting part, but the range estimation part....even if that's walking the ground that you hunt and knowing "from point A it's X yards to that tree, and Y yards to that opening in the woodline", etc.

Zero'd to 50 yards you need to know the "hold over" if the deer is at 75 to 100 yards, but I like to zero the rifle out farther, and then practice to know the "hold under" sight picture if the animal is closer.

LD

 

[Valkyrie]

No matter what, IF you are planning on being able to engage a deer out to 100 yards, or even to 70 you will need to practice not only the shooting part, but the range estimation part....even if that's walking the ground that you hunt and knowing "from point A it's X yards to that tree, and Y yards to that opening in the woodline", etc.

Zero'd to 50 yards you need to know the "hold over" if the deer is at 75 to 100 yards, but I like to zero the rifle out farther, and then practice to know the "hold under" sight picture if the animal is closer.

LD

Definitely. It's a lot of fun. I think I am going to stick with her being a little high at 50 right now. Groups are decent and the load seems to shoot well. I'm low on balls and powder so I need to make a run to the gun shop and get the lead pot fired up this weekend.

And I want a 45 now. Lol.

 

[BigBoreBLR]

I buy surveyors tape and surveyors paint. I walk out 50, 75, 100, and 125. I mark them. I shoot out to 125 with a peep sighted 54. I'd only do 75 with iron on deer.

Drop calculator
http://www.ctmuzzleloaders.com/ctml_experiments

Goex guess at your velocity, might want to reduce by 75fps for the pressure vented by a flintlock touch hole. Of course, best bet is a crono....
http://www.goexpowder.com/load-chart.html

 

[excess650]

Shooting at 100 yards is good practice. While I would prefer to NOT shoot game at that distance, having experience shooting at that distance will lend confidence (or not)in the ability to make the shot if presented.