Exactly so!
For anyone considering an Indian manufactured Flintlock
- Thread starter Surfinator58
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Because some folks want to criticize and need someone to sneer at. Like in any hobby.
Also exactly. What I like about Dave Persons and yourself, is that you are willing and try to help others. That is one of the best parts of the hobby.
maybe sharing those would help someone. That kind of thing is great for the hobby.
FlinterNick
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A 1728 French musket is actually a rather easy kit to build.
For all of the work and effort put into defarbing and Indian gun you might as well invest in the real thing. Shaping the barrel flats (which i would not do) stock shaping, barrel band cutting and welding, lock defarbing… you’re looking at 60-80 hours of research and work.
There are also plenty of sources for parts on making a kind of marine greandiers fusil which is a slightly slimmer 1728 using an L&R tulle lock.
Many folks think defarbs are the cheap easy and efficient way out… however good luck finding someone to do it for you now, i. Know many in the muzzle loading communizing have stopped that work completely. I won’t do it anymore, complete waste of money and time.
Lots of guys just can’t build a RS kit. And many just don’t have that kind of time.
Something that would be nice is a way to get better parts to update one’s current gun. You said that the rs stuff is too big for a pedersoli Bess. What can one do?
I know Ethan from 11 Bang Bang uses RS parts on his Indian Charlesville. Would that help for an Indian Bess?
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My one Indian musket I like very much. It is a 1795 Springfield and it is simply beautiful. All I have done to it is refinish the stock and antique the barrel and the hardware. It took a very short time to do what I did to the gun, and cost very little money accomplish. I used left over chemicals from other projects. The fit of metal to the stock is very good, and it shoots just fine.
FlinterNick
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Ethan’s moved on from Indian guns….
FlinterNick
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If you can defarb an Indian made 1728 then you could build your own 1728 form a kilt, the only real complication is the lock assembly and there are plenty of folks who assemble them.
What can one do do? Save your pennies for what your really want, or settle for joan rivers.
Oh, I’ve seen his other stuff. But again, not everyone can RS kits. There has to be a happy medium.
You know my thoughts… this is not a gun I was issued. It’s bad enough that I have $800 in MY pedersoli. I’d flip out to mess up a dead-on balls accurate one.
Where do you draw the line? I can see both sides. It’s a hobby. Hobbies are supposed to be fun. If it’s not fun, why do it? I’m not all in on total hand-stitching either — I can’t see it unless I’m holding it in my hands with reading glasses on… except for button holes… you can see that.
Are we checking underwear? I’m wearing micro fiber
glasses? Socks? You can see where I’m going. If the gun is your focus, do the gun. A lot of revwar people I’ve met have never fired live. To them, it’s a prop. 
Something about reenactors. I've had this for a long time (And I’ve posted in other places) and it rings true. Everyone has a different reason to do the hobby and none are more valid than any other.
Types of Reenactors
An old friend once told me that he had a really good take on the hobby; he said there were certain types of reenactors who come to the events.
• The “Cap Busters” (or powder burners) – the ones who live to burn powder and shoot.
• The “Poets” – those who think of it as some dreamy, ethereal thing. The “honor” of it all.
• The “Scholars” – Events and history and battles. Dates and times and places.
• The “Tactic Gurus” – need I say more. To them, this is so important. Even though many hobby events are scripted.
• The collectors – Again, need I say more. They worry about each bit of minutia and place high value on things that people back then couldn’t care less about. Soldiers, to this day, really can’t tell you a lot of details of the uniforms and kit they carried. Sure, they can remember bits, but not intricate details.
• The “Dress-Up Kings” – Again, need I say more. “Stand and preen” events are their thing and they like to be looked at. Or they HAVE to be an officer. And a corallary to this is...
• The “Janitor General” – This person has a low status job, but on weekends he (or she) is a King, General or senior ranking officer.
• The “Gun Nuts” – they’re in it for the guns and weapons. They usually shoot their guns live and cringe when they see some dork not clean his gun.
• The “Stocking Stuffer” – This person has every single accessory, as well as things they MIGHT have had. And by golly, they bring it to the event to show you.
• The “Experiencer” – Those of us who want to "feel" the time period or try and experience what they did. Of course, without the dirt, disease, pain, starvation, etc. i.e. the ickyness. Just a smidgeon of what they had or a "taste" of the period.
Anyway, most people are combinations of these. I’m sure that you’ll recognize yourself somewhere.
Types of Reenactors
An old friend once told me that he had a really good take on the hobby; he said there were certain types of reenactors who come to the events.
• The “Cap Busters” (or powder burners) – the ones who live to burn powder and shoot.
• The “Poets” – those who think of it as some dreamy, ethereal thing. The “honor” of it all.
• The “Scholars” – Events and history and battles. Dates and times and places.
• The “Tactic Gurus” – need I say more. To them, this is so important. Even though many hobby events are scripted.
• The collectors – Again, need I say more. They worry about each bit of minutia and place high value on things that people back then couldn’t care less about. Soldiers, to this day, really can’t tell you a lot of details of the uniforms and kit they carried. Sure, they can remember bits, but not intricate details.
• The “Dress-Up Kings” – Again, need I say more. “Stand and preen” events are their thing and they like to be looked at. Or they HAVE to be an officer. And a corallary to this is...
• The “Janitor General” – This person has a low status job, but on weekends he (or she) is a King, General or senior ranking officer.
• The “Gun Nuts” – they’re in it for the guns and weapons. They usually shoot their guns live and cringe when they see some dork not clean his gun.
• The “Stocking Stuffer” – This person has every single accessory, as well as things they MIGHT have had. And by golly, they bring it to the event to show you.
• The “Experiencer” – Those of us who want to "feel" the time period or try and experience what they did. Of course, without the dirt, disease, pain, starvation, etc. i.e. the ickyness. Just a smidgeon of what they had or a "taste" of the period.
Anyway, most people are combinations of these. I’m sure that you’ll recognize yourself somewhere.
Unless you are going to an invitation only event, usually small and centered around an actual focus living history you will encounter a majority of farbs. So, most public events, especially battles, are farbfests. This thread is proof. Everyone is quick to spout excuses why they willingly carry muskets that are grossly inaccurate representations of what they are supposed to be. If you can’t tell the difference, you probably are one.
FlinterNick
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You know my thoughts… this is not a gun I was issued. It’s bad enough that I have $800 in MY pedersoli. I’d flip out to mess up a dead-on balls accurate one.
Where do you draw the line? I can see both sides. It’s a hobby. Hobbies are supposed to be fun. If it’s not fun, why do it? I’m not all in on total hand-stitching either — I can’t see it unless I’m holding it in my hands with reading glasses on… except for button holes… you can see that.
Are we checking underwear? I’m wearing micro fiber
I think people should buy what they can afford to buy, nothing more.
I’ve never said nobody should buy Indian made guns, i just give my honest thoughts and opinions on them,;…. They are junk, I’ve even directed people on where to purchase them knowing they’re junk. I’m not trying to convince someone not to buy them, but again, this thread is asking for opinions on buying them….so here we are.
With that said, i certainly don’t think anyone should sink additional money and time into junk. If you’re going to invest in your gun, invest your money wisely.
Again, call the spade the spade. If someone buys an Indian made gun, fine. accept what it is, and understand it will always be what it is as it was meant to be, shoot it, clean it, care for it.
Don’t go attempting to fit rifle shoppe castings on them, stupid … useless, these are the same people saying Indian guns are a great fit and finish, yet will invest a few hundred in rifle shoppe parts to make them work better. Dumb.
Same with Italian guns, they will always be Italian no matter what you get done to them.
You are a problem for the hobby.
Richard$58
32 Cal
What is the risk of burst on any reproduction gun? I was told blanks can spike if not rammed properly.
Do these makers proof?
im on board with that....
You really are a dried leaf in the breeze. I remember quite well you agreeing with what I’ve said on this subject in the past. You are king flip flop. Go with that breeze.
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All hand made anything is not going to be perfect, that’s a given. At what point did barrels start to be bored from a solid? It was a long number of years before the US had the technology to stop forming wrought iron around a mandrel. Even the highly advanced French gunmakers had problems holding anything under .040” tolerances on gun barrels. So comparing 260 year old tech against correct DOM metal tube practice is silly.
I do not disagree with the part about being a farb at some point. But to knowingly linger at that part is a failure to do your best. I will always look in pity at those who purposely stagnate themselves.
You just go on and on. I’m always the same on reenacting. You have to get new people in the right way. Not be a gate keeper. I’ve got to go drive. You be you.
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