With a properly sized ball ambient moisture is not going into the front of the cylinder. Especially not if you put a dab of lube over the ball. I believe the critical point is a good cap to nipple fit. Humidity can be dealt with. Swimming not so much so.
1858 truck gun.
- Thread starter nick_1
- Start date
Help Support Muzzleloading Forum:
- Joined
- Dec 25, 2011
- Messages
- 9,386
- Reaction score
- 4,558
There is a reason military ammo used shellac to seal the bullets in the cases and compression fit primers in the case primer cup ! Sealing off percussion chambers has exactly the same requirements for reliable ignition.
most of us are at the mercy of what caps we can find. I suspect that whatever issues i am haveing come from the nipple end. But who knows. I was shooting my trapper yesterday and had a really slow hangfire from a charge that I had just loaded. granted thats a side hammer and our revolvers are in lines but they are still not modern cartridge guns,
I've had 2 1851 Pietta 44s sitting in my garage for the last 2.5 years since I shot them last, both pistols loaded and ready to fire, one is a Sheriff model and the other is the same but I slapped a 1860 snubby barrel on it. Point is, I'm in Phoenix, and in the summer I bet it gets up to 130 easily in my garage, these things have been loaded, all 6 cyclinders in both, 30gr of powder and Remmy caps on both seperate cyclinders. They even had blue coppering around the bottom rim of the caps they've been loaded for so long. Last Friday morning I went to go sight some red dots in at Phx Rod and Gun so I threw both the 1851 .44s in my range bag. After sighting in my Trijicon, I took pistols out and every single cylinder went bang in both of them, no misfires, so second strikes, all worked first try and smoked the place out. I was absolutely impressed, even bought a new nipple wrench the week before because I figured I was going to be taking these things apart to get the powder and balls out. Nope all shot perfect after at least 2.5 years loaded surviving the AZ heat!
Last edited:
rodwha
58 Cal.
Me either. We moved to a place without an outdoor range that wasn’t over an hour away so it sat for 6 years and loaded with Triple7 that people feel degrades over time. They each went off with the same authority as when freshly loaded. Same happened a few years later when we moved back. As long as there’s priming compound in the Rem #10 it goes bang instantly.
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
I would imagine Hickok knew enough about percussion guns to know that a good cleaning, AND DRYING THE INSIDE OF THE CHAMBERS AND NIPPLES before loading will keep everything dry for weeks or months at a time if not fired. The only variable might be getting a bad cap once in a while.
I know from experience that a percussion revolver can be loaded for 5 of 6 months, and even after being carried 3 or 4 days a week while working in the woods cutting down trees and splitting wood and other outdoor chores, it will fire without fail all 6 chambers every time with monotonous regularity.
I have a Uberti 1860 Army and an 1851 Navy I have done this with several times.
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
At times he was pretty busy being a city Marshal every day and a gambler and chasing tail most of the night. Winter days and nights in some parts of the country he lived in and travelled through could have -40 wind chill temperatures at times. On those days I doubt if shooting and cleaning his guns was a high priority.
Heat due to climate doesn't degrade black powder, far from it. As long as the action operated, I'd expect such a revolver loaded in 1870 to be quite dangerous, and if the first cap didn't fire, replacing all the antique caps with modern caps would likely due the trick for the old loads.
They have had recovered ACW exploding shells detonate after being placed next to a hearth with a roaring fire, the possessor/collector assumed the powder within was no longer viable due to age, etc.LD
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
Drying the chambers with any kind of alcohol is a good practice. I don’t believe in using grease on the chamber mouths and prefer to seat greased 1/8” thick felt wads that I punch out myself under the balls on top of the powder. Too messy and does nothing to prevent chain fires.
Never had any problems with the grease spoiling any of the powder. Most people don’t know it, but BP will still burn just fine even with a little grease in it.
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
After Robert E. Lee’s death in 1870 someone in the family or close friend decided to fire off the loads in his Navy Colt. Every shot went off without hesitation.Heat due to climate doesn't degrade black powder, far from it. As long as the action operated, I'd expect such a revolver loaded in 1870 to be quite dangerous, and if the first cap didn't fire, replacing all the antique caps with modern caps would likely due the trick for the old loads.
LD
The gun had been loaded by his personal aide sometime during the last half of the war, which ended in the spring of 1865.
I used to load the exact same way. But after watching and Old Ranger test video on YT and then going out and doing my own bench rest test. I found the same thing he did. My revolvers shot better without the felt wad. So ever since then I just use grease over the chamber mouths.
- Joined
- Jan 31, 2009
- Messages
- 13,054
- Reaction score
- 7,302
Used to live in southeast Texas where the trees literally rained dew each morning and the heat and humidity were always higher than the insects, reptiles and amphibians needed.
Something I'd thought about but never have tried is plastic wrap, like for food. To put a stamped out piece at the bottom of the chamber to let the compacted powder push it against the nipple, thus sealing off both the nipple hole and threads. Perhaps a dot stamped out of plastic sided freezer paper would work but I wanted to try the very very thin plastic film. As someone said above, putting lube (waxy, greasy, whatever) over the bullets seals off the front.
Something I'd thought about but never have tried is plastic wrap, like for food. To put a stamped out piece at the bottom of the chamber to let the compacted powder push it against the nipple, thus sealing off both the nipple hole and threads. Perhaps a dot stamped out of plastic sided freezer paper would work but I wanted to try the very very thin plastic film. As someone said above, putting lube (waxy, greasy, whatever) over the bullets seals off the front.
smoothshooter
50 Cal.
Mine happen to be VERY accurate with the wads. No mess either.
I make my own lube by blending heated cooking oil and beeswax.
Seems from what I read that Hickok made his own schedule. He was a shootist. I have zero doubt that he shot every day or close to it. What really did he have to do? wake up and go to the caffe for breakfast and a newspaper. gather the shooting gear and go practice for a few hrs. back to the hotel room to clean his guns . get himself cleaned up and then go to the bar for a game of cards. long night of whisky cards and women. sleep in untill 10am or so and do it all over again. You do not get really good with pistols without constant practice and thousands of rounds down range. You do Not stay good without continuing to practice. By all accounts he was very good.
Ballshooter
50 Cal.
100 percent agree..you have to shoot on a regular basis or you will not be proficient. Muscle memory is only by repetition. Oh and don't forget to wear a cowboy hat.
Attachments
not shure when the last time I shot the 58? one week or two? anyays I had 5 really good accurate shots @ 25yrds but my very first shot was a bad cap. no spark at all. complete dud. put a fresh cap on and perfect ignition. I will shoot the spare cylinder tomorrow if I get a chance and see how that one does. been focusing on shooting my trapper for states in September.
I shot my spare cylinder today that was loaded either the day of or day after the cylinder I shot yesterday and it was perfect. was the one misfire from a bad cap yesterday? the result of oil contamination from being in the pistol? 71% humidity a bunch of days this week or just bad luck? any way you look at it these guns are not as reliable as modern cartridge guns. I suspect the folks reporting 100% reliability with cap and ball revolvers simply don't shoot enough rounds to have a reliable sample size?
Good thing you found nipples that the caps fit snugly. Pinched caps are the main reason for chain fires.
Cci caps?
