Any opinions on a .54 smoothie?

[roundball]

I'm trying to hang on to your every word to see if I can learn anything from your experience and need some clarification:

"...For small game it uses too much powder and shot to be economical for squirrel and rabbits etc..."

Can you elaborate and define what you mean by this?
What is the definition of an "efficient" load for squirrels and rabbits??
How much powder does that equate to?

"...If VERY CAREFULLY bored by someone that worked for Manton or some other high grade English shotgun makers in the days before chokes who KNEW how to make a ML shotgun pattern..."

This statement seems to sort of sit out there in space...doesn't seem to end with any point...what does this statement actually mean ??

"...Jug chokes are not HC..."

Do you knoiw how long ago it was that jug chokes were invented?

"...If it patterns well it will likely do OK if the range is close..."

The term "close" is totally vague...need to quantify it...what range in yards are you actually referring to by "close"?

Looking forward to learning, thanks

 

[paulvallandigham]

Dan: I think Roundball has a point here. This is not your usual well-stated posting, and I was wondering if you left somethings out, by accident. You usually are not so vague. What is " Efficient", to you, under the circumstances? What is " Close ", to you, as you use the term here?

Inquiring minds are very interested.

I know a couple of hunters who have sold all their 12 and 20 gauge guns and now only shoot 28 gauge cartridge guns for hunting, and sporting clays, because they love the small cartridge and its wonderful patterns. Neither of them has a full choke barrel in a gun for this gauge, and both love to hunt upland game with the gauge, and the light weight guns that shoot these cartridges. A 5 lb. muzzle loader is not impossible to build to fire 28 gauge loads in BP, either. I do not see this guage being used to shoot pass shooting ducks and geese, but it makes a fine gun to use sneaking up on ducks on creeks, and ponds, for close range shots. ( Using non-toxic shot, of course.)If you can call either geese or ducks into a set of decoys, you can also get close enough shots with this gauge to fill your game bag. For dove hunting, I don't think you can find a finer gauge to shoot.

I don't own a 28 gauge( but wish I did). I intend to download my 20 gauge fowler to 28 gauge loads to hunt dove when I can get out again. As all of us BP shooters know, you can down load any larger gauge shotgun to shoot lighter loads.

 

[buck1]

Mr. Roundball thats a mighty fine lookin gun you got there! and good luck on snekin up on that turkey :thumbsup: I also want to thank you for all the knowledge you have graciously passed on to us. I have studied and talked to every professional gun builder tht I could for the last year about an all round gun that I could use to hunt turkey,squirrill,rabbitt,hog,bear, and deer with and 99%all said the same thing .54 smooth bore.I am now about to finish one in early Va. style iron mounted simple huntin gun with rear sight dove tailed in so I can knock it out if I want to for some compatitions.Thanks again Buck Oh yea, wish me luck on a long beard with my long gun :grin:

 

[Lonegun1894]

I have a test at school tomorrow but going out afterwards to relax seems like a fine idea. I wont get out of school til 5 or so, so should be there around 5:30ish. Think that would work for you?

Paul

Y'all really arend doing much to dissuade me from going ahead with this. Thank God this isnt a support group to help me quit this habit, cause i'm gettimg more addicted by the day.

 

[gunn]

Out here in western Oregon, I have to get out of the car to chase the darn wild turkeys out of the way to go to work. Spring season is about to start, now watch there will not be a turkey within a mile. :hmm GUNN
AUT PAX AUT BELLUM

 

[Lonegun1894]

now this isnt very common, but almost hit one with my truck a couple days ago. wont be able to find one if i try though...

 

[Darkgael]

As always, an interesting read. The old English teacher in me is slightly concerned over one set of ideas (sorry, can't help it)


Dan P. wrote:
"Its a small bore shotgun. For small game it uses too much powder and shot to be economical for squirrel and rabbits etc.
ML shotguns can be very good.
If VERY CAREFULLY bored by someone that worked for Manton or some other high grade English shotgun makers in the days before chokes who KNEW how to make a ML shotgun pattern. But most modern bores are not that good. Jug chokes are not HC for those who take such things into consideration.
If it patterns well it will likely do OK if the range is close.
If I could find a low priced 1"X 42" 50-58 Green Mountain SB I would put it on my 54 as a test piece."
Then RB wrote:
"What is the definition of an "efficient" load for squirrels and rabbits??
Then Paul wrote:
"What is " Efficient", to you, under the circumstances?"

Now, I ask, where in Dan's post did he use the word "efficient"? If y'all want to argue about "economical", then that's different.
Pete

 

[roundball]

Thanks, I corrected that word...responses remain the same...
=================================================
Dan Phariss Said:
[quote[
"...For small game it uses too much powder and shot to be economical for squirrel and rabbits etc..."
[/quote]
Can you elaborate and define what you mean by this?
What is the definition of an economical load for squirrels and rabbits??
How much powder does that equate to?

"...If VERY CAREFULLY bored by someone that worked for Manton or some other high grade English shotgun makers in the days before chokes who KNEW how to make a ML shotgun pattern..."

This statement seems to sort of sit out there in space...doesn't seem to end with any point...what does this statement actually mean ??

"...Jug chokes are not HC..."

Do you know how long ago it was that jug chokes were invented?

"...If it patterns well it will likely do OK if the range is close..."

The term "close" is totally vague...need to quantify it...what range in yards are you actually referring to by "close"?

Looking forward to learning, thanks

 

[KHickam]

I will do my best to get there.

Dan'l Hickham :thumbsup:

 

[Swampman]

I simply mean that without modern loading components (like plastic shot cups)and a choke, the .54 caliber smoothbore will be pretty much like a modern .410.

 

[Zoar]

I have two burning questions. The very first opening line of the original post on this thread said: "Have been offered a .54 caliber smoothbore to try a build on..."

QUESTION 1: What do you mean try a build on?

Some extremely erudite and some quite vague posts have followed.

It appears this smooth 54 cal is tauted as being potentially the most versatile for birds to clays to rabbits to wild boar to deer. QUESTION2: Is that correct?

 

[Robert Egler]

It appears this smooth 54 cal is tauted as being potentially the most versatile for birds to clays to rabbits to wild boar to deer. QUESTION2: Is that correct?

A 54 smoothbore is the single best gun ever invented. It can kill wildlife from chipmunks to cape buffalo at 1000 yards, It has absolutely no recoil and all 54 guns are light as a feather. In fact a 54 smoothie can actually lead you to hidden game, like a dousing rod, thereby eliminating the need for dogs for any kind of hunting. In a rain storm a 54 can be easily converted to a large waterproof tent, with a stove. In comparison to anAK47 or M16, the smoothbore 54 is a vastly better weapon, it is so effective that its use in war has been specifically banned by the Geneva convention. With the right accoutrements it can be converted to a hang glider to get you off of those mountains faster and easier than hiking out. :rotf:

Seriously, I have a 54 smoothbore which I got only a couple months ago. I like it, I think it’s a pretty good all around gun if you can only have one gun, and in the right environment. It can’t do everything, and it’s probably not the best choice for a number of applications, but overall I think it’s a good compromise. :v

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

It appears this smooth 54 cal is tauted as being potentially the most versatile for birds to clays to rabbits to wild boar to deer. QUESTION2: Is that correct?

Opinions are like bellybuttons--everybody has one. That said, the 28 gauge is very versatile, but for some of this game you had better be very close. Maybe too close. The 28 gauge won't do a better job than a 20 or a 16 or a 12 or a 10. And it isn't reasonable to expect it to. It can't throw as much shot or as heavy a ball as the bigger bores. Within the ethical ranges for a smoothbore, bigger is better--depending on the game being hunted. If I had to choose a single smoothbore I'd go with 16 gauge or bigger. I like my 20, but would never try to make a "magnum" out of it. And it's worth noting that my new fowler is a 10 bore. A big bore loaded light is a better idea than a small bore loaded heavy in an attempt to make it into something it isn't.

 

[roundball]

Opinions are like bellybuttons--everybody has one.

I couldn't agree more

 

[Swampman]

What he said. I prefer a .20 unless I don't plan to shoot shot in it. The .54 works the best for shooting roundballs according to the most knowledgeable smoothbore shooter I know.

 

[Lonegun1894]

Mark,
Thank you for that clarification. In a way, i have to agree because there have been times when i used a 18.5 inch cylinder bored 12ga for hunting just because it was all i had. At those times, i definitely had to get much closer than usual. I wouldnt even take a shot past 20 yds back then if all i had was #8s. While my singleshot with a modified choke shoots a good pattern out to 45 yds. I wont argue that modern arms provide certain advantages, but at the same time, part of the fun with this is being able to do without all the niceties that modern technology provides and becoming better hunters for the extra effort and practice.

Paul

 

[Lonegun1894]

The barrel i am getting is a .54 caliber flint lock SB, 32 inches long, 15/16", and made by Green Mountain. It has rifle sights on it but needs the tenons installed in the proper places. Aside from that, I dont really know much about it and probably wont til i lay my hands on it. I am not sure weather i will build a dedicated smoothie with, or put it on my GPR and have a "smooth rifle". I love the .54 rifle i have now, but have been itching to play with a SB and have the beginnings of one now. I was trying to find out the wisdom of doing this as opposed to another project with it. And while i realize that it is easier to load a bigger gun down, than load a smaller gun up, as has been said above, y'all have surprized me with how versatile a "small" SB can be. :bow:

 

[Zoar]

Squirreltail--- I thought your post about the 54 cal Smooth Bore being perfect for everything from chipmucks to cape buffalo at 1000 yards says, well, says just about it all. Wow. That is summ gunn.

I now know I do not need another gun in my arsenal. The Geneva convention rulings also were a nice touch.

I know I like my 54 cal rifled flintlock, and when I'm ready to go smooth I will look toward 54 cal.

 

[spaethjm]

I just finished patterning my GM 32 inch 54 SB I have it on my flint deer stalker. I loaded 7/8 oz and 70 gr 3f with 54 sabot nota good pattern holes in them. I switched to 90 gr 3 f one felt lubed wad than 1/8 card 1 0z #5 shot and over card. I shot at 25 yards offhand and I penatrated and old 55 gallon drum. I got between 7 and 10 pellets in the head and neck of a turkey target. I think the pattern and penetration are more than enough for old Tom. That is within reasonable range.

 

[Russ T Frizzen]

I don't want to give you the wrong impression. I think the 28 gauge is great for small game--rabbits, squirrels, quail and such. And with a patched ball it is more than ample for whitetails. And another thing in the 28's favor is its light recoil. In fact, I fully intend to get myself a 28 when funds allow. For the uplands.
I just would not choose a 28 for turkey or larger birds where heavier shot is used. You can't get a heavy enough shot charge in the 28 without getting an elongated shot string. The "square" shot charge spoken of regarding the 28 can be loaded in any bore. It just gives you a heavier charge in the bigger guns. When the old timers went to a bigger bore, it wasn't to raise velocity, but to get a heftier shot charge.
At present I have a 20 gauge and a 14 bore. When my 10 gauge arrives I may sell off the 20 and 14 bores and get myself a fine little 28 gauge fowler. Then I think that I'll have things pretty well covered.