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Early Virginia Longrifle with 48 3/4 inch barrel

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I believe it was built between 1770 and 1780. I doubt it was built "specifically for the NDN trade, nothing about this gun would suggest that theory.I have nothing to base this on other than 30 years of looking at these things and listening to other people research who know way more than I do about these things.
I would not believe a word that comes out of Alexander's mouth.
 
I get the impression that a preconcieved notion was supported by using data and info from other originals that could bend in the wanted direction?
 
tg said:
I get the impression that a preconcieved notion was supported by using data and info from other originals that could bend in the wanted direction?
Beats me.
I handled both goehrings gun and the one Gusler was showing around and they were nearly identical in architecture. The buttplate and trigger guards probably came from the same master.
 
Hey Mike! which one of Wallace's guns are you talking about? I got a quick look at the Goehring gun at the CLA last year but don't remember it all that much.I do remember the little woodsrunner gun from Shumway{October 1982}when Earl brought it down from Kindig's.I wonder if that's the sister gun. I guess I'll have to get that article on Reaves's gun if only for the pictures.I have to make a couple of phone calls before I respond on it.
Tom Patton
 
Tg, it is not pictured in RCA. It is in the collected Longrifle Articles, vol. II, pages 16-19, which is where I saw it. RCA was published in 1980, I believe, so I expect it wasn't brought to Shumway's attention until after the book was published.
As others have said, it is wise to take Alexander's conclusions with more than a bit of salt. His essay on the origin of the longrifle contained in The Gunsmith of Grenville County is chock full of logical errors.
 
I've seen one of these guns. It is WIERD. It is crooked in every way. Rather bizarre. At first glance, it doesn't look all that unconventional, but pick it up....

It has a slight step in the wrist, by the way.

I think it's 1770's, though I believe Mr. Gusler thinks it is earlier.

Oh, and before Claude gets in trouble, Track of the Wolf does NOT like people to paste in their copyrighted photos. You can make a link to the page, but they get testy when you put up the picture, so it would be best to take it down.
 
"As others have said, it is wise to take Alexander's conclusions with more than a bit of salt."

I had wondered about this when he started connecting the dots when and useing comparisons of the Feather gun to some others that really had no solid provenance to the south,I guess I am not completely out of the ballpark in questioning the date on the Feather gun, probably the origin as well,thanks all fro the replies. I think if TOW complained about a picture one should suggest that they keep their descriptive writeups a bit more based in reallity, I have seen some of the worse, history twisting stuff written there when describing metal finishes, locks and general details.
 
I haven't seen the Alexander articles, so I can't comment on them.

The gun could be from the Shenandoah valley, but I don't know just what makes it "attributable" to Virginia....

It's neat in its own way. I made up a drawing for this gun, but haven't yet gotten around to building one. I don't think I could make it as crooked as the real one is...lock panels cocked out of whack, butt stock leaning to one side...

A couple of years ago, I made a Berks county barn gun that I sold on Track of the Wolf. Somebody (not me) posted Tracks photos on the American Longrifles board, and as I understand it, the administrator really got an earful.
 
The rifle in question {a copy by Chris Moyer} which will be referred to as the Feather rifle is one of two rifles {the other one being the rifle shown by Shumway in his Muzzle Blast articles Vol.II PP.16-19 and also illustrated by Wallace Gusler in Muzzle Blasts Jan.,2003,PP.4-5} which are usually discussed together as being possibly from Shenandoah County,Virginia.I have seen and handled both of these guns, the Feather rifle at last years CLA and the other {which I have always referred to as the "little woodsrunner" rifle} on several occasions and especially some 20 years ago when Earl Lanning bought it from the Kindig collection and brought it down to the Robin Hale show.The woodsrunner gun has been thought to be as early as the 1760-1770 period and possibly made by Christian Huffman or a member of his family.The two guns could perhaps be the product of one man or possibly a father and son.Without a thorough examination of the Feather rifle I wouldn't venture a guess as to its age although I accept Mike's statement that the gun on TOW is a very accurate copy of the feather gun and is close to its sister {the woodsrunner gun} and can use the pictures posted here to a great degree.I do think that the two guns are certainly related in some fashion either as the product of one or more makers somehow related or one maker and separated in time.Wallace and Earl have both placed the woodsrunner gun into the 1760-1770's period and I concur.As to where these guns were made, Virginia seems a very possible location and members of the Huffman family{Christian and others}of Shendoah County,Virginia have been mentioned as the possible makers.As to the Virginia attribution,as always, there is no solid proof given the absence of early signed specimens. There are a couple of details that are suggestive of Southern/Virginia manufacture but not really enough for a solid attribution.RCA Vol.II No.119 was long thought to have been made by a member of the Bullard family but a recently discovered signed gun by the same hand{John Newcomer the younger ?}showed that attrbutions without solid evidence can be dangerous.

As to the slim wrist on the Feather rifle, the slim wrist and high comb combination is not uncommon on very early guns.Besides these two guns one should note the slim wrist/high comb combination on the Schreit rifle {RCA II No.18}, the Free Born rifle {RCA Vol,II No.114 and the Hankla web site},and the "42" rifle {RCA Vol.I No.42}. An interesting note here is that four of these rifles{I didn't have measurements for the Feather gun and had to guess relying on Mike's statement and assumed that the measurements were basically the same as the woodsrunner gun} have wrists slimmer than an early French Fusil de chasse which surprised me a little.

I have always admired the "little woodsrunner gun"and it along with a very few others made up my fantasy wish list.I have loved that gun for better than 25 years since I first saw it in Neuman and Kravic {P.233 No.9}and still do.It handles and points like a dream and I suspect the Feather rifle does likewise.I hope Reaves brings it to the CLA and look foward to seeing it again.I hope this helps
Tom Patton
 
Okwaho said:
An interesting note here is that four of these rifles{I didn't have measurements for the Feather gun and had to guess relying on Mike's statement and assumed that the measurements were basically the same as the woodsrunner gun} have wrists slimmer than an early French Fusil de chasse which surprised me a little.
That is a very interesting note.Slimmer than an Fusil de chasse.
Tom, is it possible to show us a pic of that "little woodsrunner gun"? :hmm:
:hatsoff:
 
Undertaker, I can't send a picture but I cited the references for illustrations.They are:
1."longrifle Articles" by George Shumway,published in Muzzle BlastS,1965-2001;Vol.II PP.16-19
2."Muzzle Blasts"Jan.2003,article by Wallace Gusler,PP.4-6.
Both of these are excellent, the first one has several views and the second one has measurements.
Like you I was surprised by the comparison with the Fusil de chasse which is actually a little thicker in the wrist than the rifles cited.The French Fusil de chasse was a very slim light yet sturdy gun.The one I used for comparison dates to Ca.1720-1730 and has a 47" barrel.I think that the feather gun{using the the copy for comparison} and especially the woodsrunner gun definitely show French influence on the architecture and this has been largely ignored by many early as well as later students of the long rifle.I'm sure that there are those who will disagree with me here but that's to be expected.
Tom Patton
 
Okwaho said:
Undertaker, I can't send a picture but I cited the references for illustrations.They are:
1."longrifle Articles" by George Shumway,published in Muzzle BlastS,1965-2001;Vol.II PP.16-19
2."Muzzle Blasts"Jan.2003,article by Wallace Gusler,PP.4-6.

:hmm:
I'm not a member of the NMLRA, so i didn't get the Muzzle Blasts magazine.I know that i can buy the "Longrifle Articles Vol.I & II" from TotW.
So i have to spend the next $70.00 in new books. :grin:

:hatsoff:
 
I have a stock tracing of the "little woods runner gun" around here somewhere with all the measurements as well. Let me see if I can dig around in the dungeon and find them. :hmm:
 
Longrifle Articles Vol 2 - the rifle is on pages 112 through 115. The page numbers 16-19 are from the pages of Muzzle Blasts where the article originally ran
 
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