My Kibler SMR Build Log

[wiscoaster]

....It might be time to consider the dowels and avoid the likely pending repair coming down the road.

Thanks. They're on the list as the next (and final) option. So far the epoxy fill seems to holding well enough. So you're thinking failure is certain? I'm not really intending to shoot this rifle all that much, or use it for anything useful and practical, like hunting.

 

[wiscoaster]

Build Log #33

Floppy Pipe Pinned

Background: refer to previous log entries and updates for the story of the "loose" front ramrod pipe.

I've been looking for a solution that would make use of the existing stock pin hole to snug up the front ramrod pipe. I've looked at various solutions offered by forum members. The last solution investigated was hardware store "music wire". I got some in two sizes: 0.062 and 0.078. Trying them out against the existing pin holes, it was obvious 0.062 was too small and 0.078 was too large. So I rigged up a temporary "lathe" to try reducing the diameter of the larger size:

That "music wire" is tough stuff!! If I ever want to make myself a bullet-proof vest, I think that's the material I'm going to use. After some time and running through at least three batteries, and for concern about ruining my best files, I gave up on that. Next idea tried was that for drill bit blanks. Well, I didn't order any, but I've got drill bits and can just cut off the bit part of a 5/64 drill bit to leave the shank, and try it that way:

Pretty much the same result as with music wire. Then I remembered "wire gauge" drill bits at my hardware store. I made a hardware store run and got a selection ranging from #52 (0.0635) up to #48 (0.076):

... and tested their shanks against the existing stock pin hole

When the pipe lug hole was too small, it got drilled out (but the stock hole was not touched):

I discovered the #49 (0.0730) size was just about perfect, and so proceeded to snip off the bit part into the waste basket, and naturally the shank part also fell in there and needed to be discovered and retrieved:

Now, don't tell me these little side-tracks don't count into the four hours allotted build time!!

I rounded off the bit end (the shank end is already rounded) and quickie-blued it:

... and pinned the pipe nice and snug without further opening up the stock pin hole:

... making sure the ramrod slips easily through multiple pipes when against the channel:

... so problem solved!!

Even though none of the suggestions offered were used as the final and perfect solution, they were all useful to identify, try out, and narrow the options in the search for that final and perfect solution. Thanks to all that offered input.

It's worth noting this process isn't practicalble for making multiple pins. Here it was used to resolve a one-pin one-piece problem resulting from a build error, and probably needn't be applicable if the builder doesn't make the same error. But it's useful documenting as a problem solving process, which includes overthing the problem as a method of finding a solution. No overthinking: no solution.

 

[64Springer]

Maybe it's an optical illusion, but your pin heads look much too flat with sharp corners.

If so, radius the snot out of them, or gently taper them, so they're not cutting wood each time they're removed and installed.

This radius or taper also helps them enter the holes in the tenons and pipes.

And while you're at it, chamfer the holes on the tenons and pipes.

This doubles your chances of the pin entering the holes properly.

 

[wiscoaster]

...

If so, radius the snot out of them, or gently taper them, so they're not cutting wood each time they're removed and installed.

....

They're modestly rounded for first install, and when they get clipped to final length will definitely get the snot radiused out of them. Thanks.

 

[64Springer]

Radius them NOW.

NOW is when you're taking them in and out of the stock.

For all that's good and decent in the world, please accept some advice.

 

[wiscoaster]

Radius them NOW.

NOW is when you're taking them in and out of the stock.

For all that's good and decent in the world, please accept some advice.

OK, got it. They won't be pulled in and out without better radiusing. I just hadn't been planning on doing any more in and outs, with the next time being the final.

I think maybe they look worse to you in the pics, because at this point I only round out the one end that goes in. The other end only gets smoothed for burrs around the circumference. I think maybe you're seeing that end in the pics. The two ends are pretty easy to distinguish one from the other on close visual inspection.

 

[kansas_volunteer]

What do you mean by THIS rifle? MY rifle? No way. Not for sale. Never. Not any ANY price.* If you mean a Kibler SMR kit, buy it from Kibler Long Rifles NOW. They're on sale.

* well, OK, maybe if you paid me retail for the rifle and materials, $50 an hour for the build labor, and $100 an hour for the build log creativity, compositon, production and posting, and I might consider it. At present, it would come to about:

rifle kit $1300
misc material $250
build labor $175
build log $8800
total $10,525

More, when it's finished.

Man, are you off your lithium or what? All this self aggranding e-gabbing says delusion rather than clear thinking. That's why I believe your $10,525 "build" will likely be an assembly worth $500 when done.

Your challenge went as wild as Dr Fauci's pitch. I have two Kibler SMR kits to assemble after I finish my Woodsrunner. I paid a premium price for each to get stocks like few others will have. You can bet they will be assembled in a calm, careful, craftsman-like manner. Your log reveals you are nether calm, careful nor craftsman.

Many screwed up rifles are often presented on the forum, and they net a few attaboys written in two or three words by members just trying to be polite. Keep patting yourself on the back as when done pats on the back aren't likely to be effusive. Neither will the log be cheered by the crowd.

 

[wiscoaster]

....Your log reveals you are nether calm, careful nor craftsman....

Your response to humor where you are the subject reveals something about yourself as well.

 

[wiscoaster]

.... Neither will the log be cheered by the crowd.

I am not, have never been, have no desire to be a part of any crowd, or crave the crowd's approval. I stay away from crowds. Don't forget what happens to the crowd in the end of fables about crowds.

 

[wiscoaster]

Build Log #34

Just Scraping By

I started scraping the stock once before, then interrupted it for something else, and now that all the iron is mounted, the scraping is the last job to finish before stock sanding. I'm not going to post a bunch of pics and updates on scraping because I've already described what I'm doing in the previous log entry for that task, and this is just finishing it up, so nothing new about scraping except for:

... now I'm using my new set of scrapers from Woodcraft. That handle, though ... seems big? Maybe I'll just scrape by hand and hope these sharp metal things don't cut me and make me bleed all over my nice walnut stock.

So no more log entries planned until beginning the stock sanding. Have a great weekend!!

 

[64Springer]

Bleeding on your stock would simply add more iron to your iron mounted rifle.

 

[mikesto44]

Maybe I do things wrong but I never sand after I scrape a stock. I see know need. JM2C

 

[wiscoaster]

Maybe I do things wrong but I never sand after I scrape a stock. I see know need. JM2C

By "sand" wrt my build process I mean where material needs to be removed to make the contour match the part. I suppose you can do that before or after "final" sanding. I include it with final sanding because it's the last step before staining, and after contouring by sanding and/or filing I plan to do one more last once-over sanding. That's my "final" sanding. I wouldn't ever delay scraping until after sanding because sanding before scraping just accentuates the mill marks that haven't been scraped off yet, and seems to me just makes that job harder.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

I didn't know that about sanding. Never ran into that problem myself. Learn something new every day.

 

[wiscoaster]

I didn't know that about sanding.

Ya, you can't take out mill marks very well by sanding. The sandpaper, even if it's on a block, just rides up and down the hills, sanding the valleys as well as the hills. You need to lop off the tops of the hills and leave the valleys. By "scraping" I don't mean for it to be confused with the process by which you raise the grain with water and then smooth it out by removing the whiskery raised grain. I suppose that can also be done by scraping; I've usually heard that process referred to as "dewhiskering" or just "whiskering" and is not the same process as removing mill marks, and I usually just do it with one step finer grit sandpaper than the last grit used. LOTS faster than using a scraper to do the same thing.

And I'm planning to use a water-based stain, which affects the whole dynamic anyway.

 

[wiscoaster]

Build Log #35

All Cracked Up

I was just finishing up my scraping task, ending at the muzzle end, and I discovered my stock had cracked:

Now I have no clue or guesses when, how or why; it is what it is. I removed the hardware and the barrel and found it had propagated along the side of the front barrel lug slot, and appears to have terminated at the front pipe lug slot:

I suppose I could just glue it and "cover it up" ... but ... though I've never had to repair a cracked stock, I already know from another forum's discussions on cracked milsurp stocks that's not a proper repair; and also it's not in the spirit in which I'm posting this log.

So, even though some of you may be hooting and hollering in glee, at this point I'm actually pausing and looking for helpful and informative advice on the best way to proceed. You may post here, or you may post to my dedicated help thread here:

https://www.muzzleloadingforum.com/threads/cracked-stock-repair.167173/

 

[64Springer]

Grease the underside of your barrel.

Use toothpicks to spread the crack wider.

Insert some tite-bond III wood glue.

Remove toothpicks and let everything come together.

Put greased barrel back in the stock channel.

Bind tightly with a wrap of small rubber hose, electrical tape, etc. that won't stick to wood glue.

Allow to dry 24 hours, unwrap and very carefully remove the barrel.

Finally, do not ever clamp that stock nose in a vise without having the barrel in the channel. Going forward, any sanding or scraping gets done with the barrel in the channel.


PS: Find where that crack ends and go all Liberty Bell on it. Drill a small hole so the crack won't keep running. From the pictures it looks like the crack terminates at the pipe cutout. But look to be sure.

Oh.....And round off or taper those pin ends. We talked about this. At the risk of sounding like a ****, you need to listen to people who try to help.

 

[Comfortably_Numb]

That was caused by a bind when you were driving in a pin that wasn't lined up properly.

 

[TDM]

 

[64Springer]

That was caused by a bind when you were driving in a pin that wasn't lined up properly.

I warned him about the pins.

You can lead a horse to water............