pedersoli 50 cal frontier

[fatman]

I recently purchased a Pedersoli frontier 50 cal. At the time I was not aware that the max load of powder for this gun was 50 gr.
I am a bit shocked at this since my 50 TC renagade shoots 100gr. I measured the barrel thickness and there is an 1/8 "
difference between the two.My question is can I shoot 70 gr through this gun? I want to hunt white tail and not have to worry about taking 50-60 yd shots. My black powder journal has stated that many guns have set loads for accuracy and the load does not indicate the strength of the barrel. I have shot 60 gr 777 through it with out any problem other than the delayed ignition.Any one have any thoughts?

 

[Rebel]

I don't know where you got that info on the Frontier rifle. When i had mine i shot 80-90 grs of 3f in it all the time. Any well made modern .50 cal should be able to handle those charges. The Frontier is a good gun and i think you will find that it shoots well with 70-80 grs of 3f Goex powder.

 

[fatman]

Rebel, That info came right out of the pedersoli handbook which came with the gun.Believe me I was shocked.
I have been shooting 2f, why did you shoot 3f in your frontier?

 

[Rebel]

Mine was a flinter and the 3f was a little easier to ignite, or at least i thought so at the time. And besides, i use 3f in everything up to and including my .20 ga. N.W. Tradegun smoothbore. I will also use 2f in the Tradegun now that i have learned more about flinters, and have found out that 2f ignites just about as well as 3f. Also, 3f normally fouls less than 2f does.

 

[fatman]

Thanks for the info.

 

[Rebel]

No problem, that's what we're here for.

 

[HardBall]

Rebel, That info came right out of the pedersoli handbook which came with the gun.Believe me I was shocked.

Fatman- That sounds, to me, like a "suggested load" based off of some "rule of thumb" for determining a load, not a maximum load. Regardless of how it's worded in the manual; I can't see 50gr of 2F being a true "max" load.

Dixie Gun Works used to have a policy against stating "max" loads- they would only give a single, suggested load which may or may not be a most accurate load, or a preferred load for hunting. For whatever reason, that's just what they did.

Traditions states 110gr 2F or 105gr of 3F as a max load in their .50 cal "Kentucky" rifle which has a 7/8" across the flats barrel. According to Lyman's 2nd edition Black Powder manual; 105gr of 3F generates much more pressure than 110gr of 2F, why they have such a "max" load- who knows.

IMO, if you did not exceed 100gr 2F or 80gr 3F with a patched round ball, you'd certainly not have to worry.

 

[Zonie]

I may be wrong, but a 50 grain max load in a .50 caliber gun sounds like the lawyers have gotten in on the act.

As the manufacturer has no control over what sort of bullet you load they will assume the worst case and then double its weight. I suppose if you were shooting a 550 grain slug, 50 grains would be a pretty safe max limit.

IMO, if your shooting round balls (179 grains), there should be no problem with going to 70 or 80 grains of 2Fg.

 

[steve hill]

I just got a cabelas kentucky rifle by pedersoli and it
said the same thing.I tried more but seemed like any more
than 60 grains 2f and accuracy goes down hill fast! This
is just my limited experience though I am most definately
a rookie but man is this stuff fun! :results:

 

[swank]

I have a Pedersoli Blue ridge 1/2" flinter that I bought from Cabelas. The chart in my pedersoli manual listed the powder charge for a .50 cal frontier percussion at 50 grs while it was 60 grs for a flint :youcrazy:. As previously posted my manual does not state maximum on the chart only "powder charge." I shoot 3f so that I can prime and shoot the same. I found that it shoots best with 70-75 grs 3f and that is my deer load.

As a side note, the Cabelas manual that came with the rifle listed 70 grs 3f and 90 gr 2f as the Maximum loads for the rifle.

 

G'day,

:relax: I own a few Pedersoli firearms. My reading of the manual is the load is the recommended starting amount only. In the text for loading it states "Load the powder (see loading chart) ..."

I have on more than one occasion emailed Pedersoli who have not only emailed replies to me but often post detailed information by snail mail.

Here are examples of the loads for a Pedersoli Kodiak Double Rifle in .58 calibre that was emailed to me by Pedersoli in Italy. The suggest load in their owner's manual is 75 gns.
-----------------------------

Loading data for Kodiak .58 cal.
Thank you for your inquiry and for the preference in our guns.
We have various loads that gave all good results:
75 grs. of black powder (Swiss no.2) round ball .575" patch .010"
85 grs. of Swiss no.2 round ball .570" patch .010"
85 grs. of Swiss no.2 mini

 

[fatman]

I pulled out my manuel and where it tells you to load..see chart recomendations.. 50 gr..followed by BUT : make sure you are using recomended powder and don't over charge gun.I have to agree lawyers are involved...the recomended charge is for target as stated at the top of the recomended load page. I have read in other publications that you should double your target load for deerhunting. I don't believe that to be gospel but I find Hardballs post on the traditions interesting, 7/8" across the flat, the same as my pedersoli, shooting 110 gr, or Aussie Bobs letter from pedersoli with more detail on charging his gun over the load listed in the manuel. I will try shooting 70-80 gr black powder and see how the gun handles. With 60 gr of 777 there was no kick but that delay in ignition stinks.Back to black powder.

 

[Java Man]

Fatman,

Here is a copy an e-mail I just received directly from Pedersoli, answering those same questions. A friend of mine was interested in one.

Dear Mr. Coffey,

Thank you for your inquiry. We apologise for being late in answering your mail.
The Frontier rifle .50 cal. has 7/8" flats, 6 grooves, 1:48" twist.
We had good target results loading 60 grs. of FFg, round ball .490" and patch .010", while for hunting the load can be increased to 90 grs. of FFg.
We would suggest not to exceed the 10% of the hunting load, considering the a larger load does not mean better accuracy.

Best regards,
Customer Service

 

[fatman]

Java man,
Thanks for that copy of email.It just backs up what the forum has stated. Thanks again.

 

[brpc]

Fatman:

I have the same gun in 50 cal, also from Cabelas.

80grs. 777, .495 roundball, .10 dry lube Ballistol patch and a .20 denim over powder patch shoots right at 2 inches at 50 yards for me. Been using it safely for over a year.

I use the above load but with 50 grs 777 for plinking.

My hunting load is: 80grs 777, 385 Buffalo Bullet conical with a .20 denim over powder patch. Shoots under 2 inches at 50 yards. Stiff, but safe enough so far.

Jim

 

[fatman]

brpc,
Do you get that delayed ignition with the 777? I get it and don't like it. I hate to go back to bp but if the delay continues I will.
My 50 shoots around 3 to the right with 60 grs.777.

 

[aragorn]

I recently bought a Pedersoli Kentucky 45 cal flintlock and was also perplexed to see their recommended load, 38 gr! Being a complete beginner, I erred on the side of caution and began target shooting with 40 g Goex FF - fine up to about 30 yds, but drops a good six to eight inches by 50 yds. 45 gr doesn't seem to be much different, and today I'm going to do the same shooting - 5 rounds from bench at 10 yd intervals to 50 yds - to see how 50 gr works, then 55. When I'm satisfied with the load I'll be filing the front sight down v carefully (I get a one-inch group exactly one inch low at ten yds).
I'm going to e-mail Pedersoli to see what they say, but my guess is they're referring to FFF (or Swiss powder), and to an absolute minimum load for close-range targets.
PS I love my rifle - I know its not a Jim Chambers, etc and is only a 'generic' Kentucky of perhaps c 1810-30 period, but is the most elegent and best put together factory-made I've seen plus seems to shoot very nicely - a good one for a beginner, and really spurs me to look towards building a Chambers or similar (I'm hooked too!)

 

[Rebel]

Strider, i used 60-70 grs of Goex 3f in my Pedersoli Blue Ridge (Frontier) Rifle, and it worked great. They are a very good sparking, accurate shooting rifle.

 

[aragorn]

Rebel, thanks for this. I'm intrigued that you use 3f, and note this variously in this forum for 45/50 cal. The very knowledgeable people I bought from pushed 2f in my direction, but I suspect they were accustomed to shooting 50 cal or greater. Should I be using 3f instead of 2f for my 45 cal? What are the advantages either way? I certainly seem to get quite a lot of fouling after about ten shots with 2f, but then I have no benchmark to compare this to - one of the disadvantages of being a beginner shooting alone at the back of our woods, learning painfully by trial and error! All advice much appreciated.
Incidentally I use 4f for priming, which seems to do the trick perfectly, but maybe 3f would be just as good?

 

[Rebel]

Strider, I use 3f in everything up to and including my .62 smoothbore. 3f is a little easier to ignite, cleaner burnig, you use less of it than 2f for the same velocity, and you can also prime with it too. I have used both 4f and 3f for priming, and can't tell the difference in ignition speed. 2f will work in your .45, but i would get some Goex 3f and give it a try. My Pedersoli would shoot 1 hole groups at 25 yds using it. Hope this helps. Good shooting.
P.S. another thing you should do if you haven't already done it is to drill the hole in the vent liner out to 1/16". This will help your ignition speed and reliability a lot. The factory vent holes are too small. You can do this with the liner in the gun. Just remove the lock and drill it out. I also remove the liner though and drill the inside hole out as much as i can and still have enough to thread it in. This seems to help get the powder closer to the pan easier. Hope this is all making some sense to you.