Post deleted by Claude

[Huntinfool]

Yes please explain what your eyes and ears are seeing. Who's dictating and where!

Chuck

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Well, the overall impression I'm getting is that someone thinks one organization is a waste of time and puts up some sort of wall and that another one is the best one that accomplishes the most and... I could go on, but I don't want to spell out this entire thread any more than it already is.

If this isn't basically saying (to make a long thread short) that I (or whomever) should disregard one and suppport another, then I must have missed the point. If so, someone please explain to me the point the original poster was trying to make... ::

 

If so, someone please explain to me the point the original poster was trying to make... ::

I'd say thet would be better left up to the "original poster" to explain,.... wouldn't you?? (I think many of us were jest as confused with his initial post)

I do wonder about the "overall impression" you speak of tho,.... could you be more specific, I beleive ther is plenty of thread space to be more precise, and to be better understood!!

YMHS
rollingb

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Of course, it's possible that I missed the point, but the initial post didn't seem to have a point at first, and the explanation later went something like this:

My bottom line is I think the formation of the TMA is a mistake.

Then there's this:

And my point is to show that the NMRLA seems to provide everything that the TMA can provide and more.

And this...

The TMA has drawn the line in the sand. The NMRLA welcomes all comers.

This, too:

I can't understand why a group of guys would be willing to put out the effort to form a new organization rather than use the same energy to redirect an existing oganization that appears to have gone astray.

If this doesn't sound like someone is saying we should drop one organization and stick with another, then I guess I really am lost... ::

 

OK,.... I see what you mean now,.... and, I agree with you!!

My confusion in regards to yore post, started when you "clicked" on Huntinfool's post to reply instead of Old Salts post!! :haha:

This has been a rather confuse'n thread from "start to finish"!! :haha:

YMHS
rollingb

 

[Huntinfool]

Yes It has been a confusing thread from the beginning! Sorry Rex as RollinB said you clicked on my name and I thought you were shakin your finger at me! :nono:

Chuck

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Oh. Sorry 'bout that. I usually just read all the posts in order, then click on the last one to make a reply, regardless of who posted it (Wil's post wasn't there yet when I made my reply). I didn't realize that could cause confusion among people reading it. I'll have to be careful about that in the future.

 

[Huntinfool]

Kool Beans Fellers I'm gonna call it a night I'm outa here!

Good Night All
Chuck

 

That's exactly what I thought. Sorry for adding to the confusion. :redface:

 

[BLAHMAN]

I feel like I walked into the middle of a conversation and missed the most important part. Who is the code of ethics for and why is it here? ::

Is it for the TMA?

Danged if I know Claude,.... I was jest want'n to "vote" on sumpthin!! :crackup: :crackup: :crackup: :crackup:

YMHS
rollingb

Hey! Do ya think you can vote me more money? That's something you can vote for! (Doesn't mean I'll get it)

 

[Ohio Joe]

Old Salt,

I did not keep that PM as I DO NOT agree with you about the TMA being a mistake.

TMA being a mistake is your opinion, not mine or a whole bunch more who have come on board and will continue to do so as I see the TMA gaining a lot of momentum.

Trying to make comparisons about the TMA and NMLRA seems to be your mind set. There are no comparisons to be made. TMA offers traditional and traditional alone! TMA does include the T/C Hawken, Lyman GPR, Pedersoli Traditional style muzzleloaders, and any traditional style muzzleloader,,, but it does not include modern muzzleloaders based on designs after 1900. That is the bottom line!

I could care less what the NMLRA's "Code of Ethics" is. I believe in the TMA and its ability to act and uphold all that they say they are and will be.

I will not compare the TMA and the NMLRA. They are two different organizations. It is up to you as to which organization, or both, that you want to belong if you want to belong. That is your right to have that personal choice.

 

[BLAHMAN]

Well, the overall impression I'm getting is that someone thinks one organization is a waste of time and puts up some sort of wall and that another one is the best one that accomplishes the most and... I could go on, but I don't want to spell out this entire thread any more than it already is.

If this isn't basically saying (to make a long thread short) that I (or whomever) should disregard one and suppport another, then I must have missed the point. If so, someone please explain to me the point the original poster was trying to make... ::

I like this forum, otherwise I wouldn't be here. There are some very creative folks on this thing and we all share one common interest: black powder. If you look through all the indexes there are two that deals with something untraditional: Inlines and inline hunting. The rest deal with the more traditional stuff.

I think, personally, that the TMA is a GOOD thing simply because it allows me a choice of what group I want to join.

As for drawing "lines in the sand"....well, I disagree with that statement in it's entirety. Not long ago Claude asked us to vote as to wether or not to keep the inline stuff on this forum. I noticed those that responded WANTED the inline guys included.....where then is this "line in the sand"? It can only be in your imagination.

Fact of the matter is that traditional muzzleloading is so fascinating and alluring that it begs those that shoot just about any weapon to join us. Look at this forum for an easy example. We have a builders forum, a flintlock forum, a smoothbore forum, a persona forum and all kinds of stuff. Don't you think the poor guy stuck with an inline is wondering what it's all about? That guy can't decide to build his own inline to look like them plastic things they sell at Wall Mart.

I think the TMA has great potential, a naturel off-shoot of this forum, and there is no arm twisting that I can see. I'm sure the NMLRA has their own forum, but I don't see why you post here, if there is the thought of "the TMA is a mistake". I feel insulted by that comment. I'm kinda thrilled about getting involved with this on a "groundfloor" sort of thing.

All in all, I'm refering to Old Salt's queries, not just your's Rex. And I'm not trying to slap the inline guys.

What the hell, we all play in the same sandbox.

 

[Huntinfool]

Well stated Blahman!

As I said before the TMA has no ax to grind with the NMLRA and as Rex said we don't need to be told where to put our loyalties. They lie right where they belong in the TMA!

Instead of drawing a line in the sand we welcome all comers. We don't have any thing that keeps a modern gun shooter from joining our ranks. I believe a person can belong to more than one assoc. just as I belong to the NRA and the Bowhunters Assoc.

And never have we asked anyone to drop their membership to the NMLRA! I don't see it as you do Old Salt I can't see why someone can't belong to both!

I was one of those who voted keep the modern forums in both of Claudes votes this last one as well as the first one! As Blahman said we're all in the same sandbox just some of us are using fine wood handled shovels and some are using cheap plastic ones! :crackup: :crackup: Sorry folks I couldn't resist!

Chuck

 

[Griz]

:applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause: :applause:
The preverbial nail just got hit in the head. Good work Blahman

 

[Dave Poss]

I can imagine that in 1933 when the NMLRA was created, that some people said "why do we need an organization for old type guns....they went out of style when the cartridge was invented."

Had the "other" organization held to it's original concept, there would have been no TMA. But, they did not.
Thusly, people whose Only interest is traditional guns formed and/or became members of the TMA.

So, now we hear statements on the order of,"why do we need an organization for traditional guns...they went out of style when the inline was invented."
We are not in competition with the NMLRA, nor do we care about what their organization does or thinks. The TMA is an alternative for people to consider and join if they wish to. It is what it is andthat is spelled out as clearly as we could make it.

So, it's not a matter of which organization to be a member of, it's a matter of what your interest is. No one says you can't be a member of both! Each has something to offer it's members. What the TMA offers is "specialized"...and that's Traditional preservation.

Dave (Longknife) Poss- VP of the TMA

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

I believe a person can belong to more than one assoc. just as I belong to the NRA and the Bowhunters Assoc.

And never have we asked anyone to drop their membership to the NMLRA! I don't see it as you do Old Salt I can't see why someone can't belong to both!

That's what I was thinking!

Why does everyone have to be forced to decide between two different groups? Even more, why should one group (no matter how new it is) disband itself and join an older one just because someone thinks the new group is a waste of time?

Lots of shooters are members of the NRA. Lots of those card-carrying members of the NRA are also members of the GOA, the JPFO, and various other national and state-level pro-gun organizations. Of all of them, the NRA is the oldest group with the most clout in D.C. Does that mean that the other groups are a waste of time and people should only be members of the NRA? The other groups have a right to exist, and I have a right to join whichever of them I choose. It's the unenlightened person, in my opinion, who creates divisions between them and argues that one is all we need and the rest are pointless.

I believe we need as many pro-gun organizations as possible. The more pro-gun groups there are, and the more people join those groups, then the more power and influence they will have politically, and the easier it will be to preserve our right to own guns, and the harder it will be for the anti's to try to take away our guns. The smart person will join both the NRA and one or more other pro-gun organizations in order to increase the number of members of more groups and help boost their political influence. Dividing ourselves and choosing one group while condemning another is exactly the sort of in-fighting the anti's like to see among us, because that makes their cause that much easier.

I'm not trying to turn this into a pro-gun vs. anti-gun thread, I'm just using the NRA as an example that everyone here can relate to.

It's the same thing with blackpowder organizations. Old Salt, you say you don't understand why a bunch of guys would waste their time and energy creating a traditional blackpowder organization when there's already an older one out there. I say that all the energy and enthusiasm you appear to have for this topic is being wasted trying to argue this point. I think all that energy and enthusiasm would be better spent by joining both the NMLRA and the TMA and thereby really showing your support for the blackpowder sports (traditional or otherwise) and helping to advance your cause.

United we stand, divided we fall.

 

[Holley]

My membership in the NMLRA goes back to 1974 with a low number of 5227#, but I am tired of paying 40.00$ a year for a magazine that does not give me much to read or use. Also, I am a bit of a traditionalist...I am not the shooter that MANY of you are...but I do support organizations that support my interest. I feel that the NMLRA has gotten too expensive and does not go along with my interests. The TMA does. I would love to support both...but with gas and living expenses going up>>>>> :shocking: :shocking:I must now make a choice and which better serves my life style. :imo:

I will still go to their events...but would rather pay the extra 10.00$ to attend than to pay 40.00$ a year for all the extra mail I seem to be getting from NMLRA. :sorry:

 

[SquirrelsaurusR]

Tipis,
that's cool, and there's nothing wrong with making your choice. I can't afford to join every organization that I'd like to, either. My post wasn't meant to be taken as saying that everyone should join both of these groups. My point was just that joining both is an option, and it's certainly a better option than turning it into a war by telling a bunch of people that they're wasting their time by trying to create their own group. I think the new group is a great thing, and from what I've seen so far, the TMA doesn't profess to be anti-NMLRA, so I guess I'm still trying to figure out why this thread is here in the first place...

 

[Holley]

LOve your avitar BTW, I think it is one of my favorite Creatures and movie. But I have strange tastes...I am on this site...aren't I ::

I understand what you are saying...and agreeeeeee. Too bad we are not all face to face to see more of the expressions that go with our words. :: ::

That may change a bit when the first Rendezvous comes around. Hope I can make it, but may not be able too because of a conference I am giving a paper at in Rapid City, South Dakota on Tipi liners...Also will be doing the filming for the meeting. Three days of great fun, great people and good parties. :blah: :blah: Kind of a Rendezvous in a Swanky Hotel. I get back just as the "Campout" for TMA is planned. :cry: :cry:.

But I love this group and that they can express their ideas without us killing each other. :hmm: :hmm:

Anyway....keep expressing those :imo:. It is what keeps this group looking at the other side of the mountain. :master: :master: :redthumb: :results:

 

Old Salt,.... Back up a couple of steps and think about this,.... If the year was 2001 would you have came to Claude's new Muzzleloading Forum and told the fellas "here" thet they should forgit about this forum and put ther "support" behind a ML forum thet was already in place on the "web" before Claude's??????? :shake:

This Muzzleloading Forum is now undisputedly the VERY BEST on the web today, even tho it warn't the first'un!!.... wouldn't you agree???

People are naturally "drawn" to things thet represent ther "interests", wether it's a forum or an organization especially when it's "managed" with an "open ear" towards it's members!!

rollingb