Rebuilding a 1728 French Musket

[FlinterNick]

Indian muskets made between 1970 and 1980 were actually made and shipped as firearms, these were high quality reproductions, they’re rare on the market. They were not the same as the guns produced today. They were stocked in African or Turkish walnut and. Distributed and sold by at lot of British vendors such as Henry Krank. Things changed when Indian gun export laws became stricture, but what’s being produced now is nothing compared to what was produced in the past.

 

[Clark Badgett]

What are we looking at here?

 

[springfield art]

The 70s and 80s Indian muskets seem to be pretty well made! This one is dated 1982 - parts are sturdy and strong, just a bit heavy.

Mine has the Udaipour markings that's one of the cities having the factories. I had a good experience years ago with Veteran Arms, very helpful guy, I bought 2 or 3 muskets from him and he wrote me an actual pen-and-ink page about the muskets when I made an inquiry about mine.

 

[springfield art]

This is super interesting! Thanks! I do note mine, from the 1980 approx. period, seems to be very nice quality all around. It belonged to a guy who did the Washington impression going over the Delaware at Christmas re-enactment at Wash. Crossing PA/NJ. It was in his estate auction sale, of course he didn't use it for the George impression, but you know how re-enactors are, they have all sorts of cool stuff! My India Bess has a fine bayonet with it, too. Thanks, FlinterNick!

 

[FlinterNick]

What are we looking at here?

Jean Boudroits French arms sketches 1717-1777 barrels

 

[Clark Badgett]

Jean Boudroits French arms sketches 1717-1777 barrels

Those are pretty cool.

 

[Rudyard]

Jean Boudroits French arms sketches 1717-1777 barrels

Yes excellent work if its all in French you can still follow it . I ran two photo copes at Kinkos the original's being rare so ones a spare to sell . The Muskets Kranks/ Longstaff sold I had a lot to do with I don't recall any with Indian proofs nor especially quality stocks , I just got shattered rejects worked them up & had them Birmingham proofed to sell in the US they went like hot cakes ! Rudyard thusly curious about these early ones. When I was down in India (Allways wanted to say that !)mid 70s I saw Mutiny type Enfield'.s for local trade Proofed at Indian Ordnance factory near Cawnpore . ( They call it Kanpur but I stay with the proper spelling no silly Moombuy or Kolcuta nonsense in my day .)I was born in 1944 We still had the Raj .But then we still had the War Not that I was too aware being young you understand .Ime down as being born in Fleet Street Sheffield but it was a ' Court 'of 4 houses hit by a German bomb killing all the families in 1940 but seemingly number 13 wasn't occupied or escaped major damage I don't remember that house but do remember the bomb damaged Town Center. Story was Gerry mistook the shiny moon lit tram tracks for rail tracks most of the Moor as it was called was flattened .However I digress & seemed to have strayed from Indian muskets , Pardon my transgression Ime 80 today. Rudyard

 

[Millford_P]

Colonial Williamsburg has some great photos of a 1728 they acquired from the George Moller collection.

Link here: 1728 Musket

I'll probably use this specific one as a guide for the rest of the shaping I do on mine, especially around the buttstock and lock.
This leads me to the question - does anyone happen to have measurements from original barrel bands? I'm thinking the best way to get the shape right is adjust my bands to roughly match the originals and then adjust the forestock thickness to fit them.

Thanks!

 

[Millford_P]

Hi everyone,

Here's an update on the musket's progress.

Earlier in the week, I glued in some thin wood shims to each side of the barrel channel to make up for the gap made when the barrel was reduced. It took a quite a bit of time to refit everything - Next time I think I'll just use epoxy.

Today I did a bit of work on the stock, starting by reducing the extra wood on the bottom of the fore end.


I also brought down the bottom of the stock up a bit by the lock and trigger guard and cleaned up the inlet.


Once I was happy with the depth, I went ahead and started to bring everything into shape.


You can see here just how much wood was removed! These barrel bands will need to be cut down and re-welded in order to fit. The single barrel band spring had to be adjusted too.


Finally, everything was sanded down to 180 grit.


It's not a 100% perfect replica, but it's definitely starting to get more of that early French shape compared to where it started!


Next up will be re-working those barrel bands, staining the stock and polishing the metal. Just a few more weekends to go!

 

[Clark Badgett]

Hi everyone,

Here's an update on the musket's progress.

Earlier in the week, I glued in some thin wood shims to each side of the barrel channel to make up for the gap made when the barrel was reduced. It took a quite a bit of time to refit everything - Next time I think I'll just use epoxy.

Today I did a bit of work on the stock, starting by reducing the extra wood on the bottom of the fore end.
View attachment 353384

I also brought down the bottom of the stock up a bit by the lock and trigger guard and cleaned up the inlet.
View attachment 353382

Once I was happy with the depth, I went ahead and started to bring everything into shape.
View attachment 353385

You can see here just how much wood was removed! These barrel bands will need to be cut down and re-welded in order to fit. The single barrel band spring had to be adjusted too.
View attachment 353387

Finally, everything was sanded down to 180 grit.
View attachment 353383

It's not a 100% perfect replica, but it's definitely starting to get more of that early French shape compared to where it started!
View attachment 353386

Next up will be re-working those barrel bands, staining the stock and polishing the metal. Just a few more weekends to go!

Oh , just as an FYI. Nick and I managed to figure out that there was a top flat on infantry 1728 muskets.

 

[PathfinderNC]

Very interesting thread

 

[Millford_P]

Oh , just as an FYI. Nick and I managed to figure out that there was a top flat on infantry 1728 muskets.

Yes, thanks for those helpful posts! I had made sure to leave a top flat on my barrel - this extends to just about 5in from the muzzle.

 

[FlinterNick]

Hi everyone,

Here's an update on the musket's progress.

Earlier in the week, I glued in some thin wood shims to each side of the barrel channel to make up for the gap made when the barrel was reduced. It took a quite a bit of time to refit everything - Next time I think I'll just use epoxy.

Today I did a bit of work on the stock, starting by reducing the extra wood on the bottom of the fore end.
View attachment 353384

I also brought down the bottom of the stock up a bit by the lock and trigger guard and cleaned up the inlet.
View attachment 353382

Once I was happy with the depth, I went ahead and started to bring everything into shape.
View attachment 353385

You can see here just how much wood was removed! These barrel bands will need to be cut down and re-welded in order to fit. The single barrel band spring had to be adjusted too.
View attachment 353387

Finally, everything was sanded down to 180 grit.
View attachment 353383

It's not a 100% perfect replica, but it's definitely starting to get more of that early French shape compared to where it started!
View attachment 353386

Next up will be re-working those barrel bands, staining the stock and polishing the metal. Just a few more weekends to go!

When you weld the bands you’ll have a height and width problem, i would first cut vertically top and bottom and fit closer, see where that gets you.

What are you welding with? Tig mig or gas?

 

[Millford_P]

When you weld the bands you’ll have a height and width problem, i would first cut vertically top and bottom and fit closer, see where that gets you.

What are you welding with? Tig mig or gas?

Good advice.

Not sure about the welding system- I have no experience with it myself. An auto mechanic friend of mine said he'll take a look at it though. Worst case scenario, I'll just silver solder -wouldn't be ideal, but it should at least hold for a while.

 

[FlinterNick]

Good advice.

Not sure about the welding system- I have no experience with it myself. An auto mechanic friend of mine said he'll take a look at it though. Worst case scenario, I'll just silver solder -wouldn't be ideal, but it should at least hold for a while.

I wouldn’t silver solder the bands, they’re friction fit bands, they don’t just slide on and off.

The cut band edges will need to be keyed together i suggest matching 30-40 degree angles.

Tack weld one end so you can work without a clamp.

If you’re going to oxy acetylene weld the bands, pre-heat the bands to red/orange and use a neutral flame equal parts gas and oxygen. I would use 6013 rods, not flux coated. You can also use annealed picture frame wire (black color) from true-value, it works great, (not zinc coated).

TIG welding will work best as it produces a nice weld pool to get a through weld, with amps between 30-50, slowly accelerating with a cross dressed weld bead.

MIG welding might work well too, but i woudlnt’ use flux core, you’ll end up with splatter inside and out. I’m not experienced with a MIG welder, i know it works great for sheet steel.