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George said:
I saw a post in another thread on The Muzzleloading Forum where one of our hunters reported that in his area, when it came to wolves, the rule was "shoot, shovel and shut up". He left no doubt that was what he advocated.
Oops, I don't think you're referring to me but I did mention the "3S" rule (which I have never used) in a post I made in the thread about the Jack Russell terrier treeing the mountain lion.

I was thinking about what my reaction would be if a mountain lion showed up in my yard - I still have kids at home. Probably still shouldn't have said that, though. :redface:

Spot
 
Spot said:
Oops, I don't think you're referring to me...
I was not, Spot.

To the thread at large: If you looked at the data from Idaho F&G you probably saw that cougars took a large share of elk, more than wolves in some areas. Three times as many in spite of very high wolf density in Salmon unit, and more than the hunters did.

Just curious, is the cougar hated as thoroughly and widely as the wolf in the western states?

Spence
 
Where? In my area?

I get a tag every year, so I have no points. I just can't get one for ML where I want to hunt.

We are dragging the thread off topic with this, but I'll make one last post on the license subject.

Here are facts as pertain to me and only assumptions as pertains to you;

1. We must draw to hunt ml elk and for any kind of deer tag.

2. We both dearly love hunting with ml in the ml season.

3. We are both in our sixties and have no guarantees of how many more seasons we might be able to hunt.

4. Hunting with ml in the regular rifle season is an option even in years when we draw ml tags.

Given that, I always put in for "statewide" ml elk and for ml deer in an area(s) that will overlap acceptable "statewide" elk areas.

That all changed this year when they went to designated unit draw for ml elk, but I still managed to get what I wanted by being selective about the area chosen. This coming year we will have all the stats we need to select "winning" draw units. In fact, those stats are already on-line.

Sometimes I have put in for archery deer but use the same strategy as far as overlapping areas.

When I don't have any points I put in for a cow and doe tag (unless it's archery deer which is either sex). Some years I put in for bull first choice and cow second choice. About half the time I draw the bull tag with no points. If I don't draw the bull tag, I have nearly always gotten my second choice cow tag. On the rare (two times in about 20 years) occasions when I don't draw either bull or cow I can buy over the counter archery elk. Plus, the next year I am guaranteed to draw a first choice ml bull with only one point.

That's how I do it. Over the years I have had to give up some of "my" areas but it beats not hunting ml season!

This year I drew my (carefully) selected ml elk tage and an ml deer tag good for the same unit as well as three other units adjoining.

Then, I bought a leftover cow tag for first rifle elk only and a left over deer tag for second combined rifle deer and elk.

With all of that, I did not kill anything this year. But, it was not about the units hunted, but rather about unexpected family demands on my time as well as a foot injury that developed just before ml season and continues to the present. Actually, I could be up hunting deer right now but my foot is too dang painful to do any amount of walking.

So, all i'm trying to say is maybe we are both too old to sit at home and lament that we did not draw a certain area. Any year could be our last year to hunt. :shocked2: :( Even though this year was not a great year for killing, it was a great year for hunting. Especially since I get to spend it with family and good friends!
 
"Given the choice between that shameful kind of hunter and the tree huggers, it's no contest with me."

No problem Bob, just dig a bigger hole and plant one of each :idunno:
 
I'll be honest. The whole Colorado system confuses the hell out of me.

Two days ago I called up the DOW, and tried to figure out what I can do to get a ML licence. I told him the laws confuse me. He said they confuse him too. I wasn't feeling too good at that point.

I told him my goal was to hunt the ML season for deer in the areas near BV, and I have no points. He looked at all the figures for 10 minutes. I waited patiently with high hopes.
He finally said to me. You're screwed. What??

He said looking at the figures for 2010. I would be 200 numbers away from getting a licence. Even with 1 point I might not get in. He didn't think 2011 would be much different. With the ML season being the 1st one. Everybody wants it. As you know.

So, I asked him to give me the best odds I can get. After hashing back and forth with a lot of combos. We came up with 2nd season as 1st pick in area 48, and 3rd season in area 48 for a 2nd pick. He said my 3rd pick wouldn't matter, because he was sure i'd get my 1st or 2nd pick.

Are 48 isn't too bad, because it includes are 48, 481, 56, and 561. I can hunt all 4 areas. More than I could ever cover in a week. I can only shoot a buck.
So, that's my choice. I can use any gun I want. I'm so tempted to use a CF with scope to give me more of a chance at longer shots.

I wanted to hunt area 55 next year. It's where greenmtnboy hunts, but he thought i'd have no chance to get a draw.

I have to be careful. If I don't choose right I could end up with nothing but a point. I want to hunt even if it's not exactly what I want.

One of my problems is I don't camp. My old back needs a bed at night. So, I need to stay sort of close.

If you have some ideas on how I can get a better deal, or get a point plus a place to hunt. Please tell what to do. Be specific, or you'll lose me. I hate this Co. system and it baffles me.
 
If things are that big of a mess I would take a look at out of state opportunities, if they were not procced out of reach, forget Oregon the non-resident cost are way high compared to the quality/availability of game.
 
There's a reason that it's hard to get a licence. The hunting is so good they come from out of state to grab half the licences.

Kind of silly for me to go to their states. :wink:

I'm only 30 minutes from great hunting. That's why it's hard to get a licence in my area.

I'll figure it out.
 
George said:
Capper said:
If we can trust those figures.
Oh, yeah, I forgot. Of course we can't. Never trust the man.

Sayonara.

Spence


Those numbers are WAY out dated. Here is a document from the governor Butch Otter.

http://fishandgame.idaho.gov/cms/wildlife/wolves/esa/govOtterLetter10_18_10.pdf

Notice that in the third paragraph it reads
“ IDFG already has identified several zones across the state where wolves are devastating our deer, elk, and moose.”
The number of wolves have skyrocketed since 2005 and permit number are dropping. Men that used to hunt the wilderness area called the selway and frank church have given up killing elk. Elk numbers have plummeted and so has the money from elk hunting. That is what sparked the letter from Butch Otter. The fact is people in eastern states rammed these vial vermin down our throats. Also YES Mountain lions have devastated our mule deer numbers. IDFG have started a project a few years ago called the mule deer initiative. This has been almost a total waste of time. While deer and elk are being studied the numbers continue to fall and the number of wolves continues to grow. At the same time revenue from tag sales is also plummeting. Non-residents will not pay very high prices to hunt areas that have wolves.
Would you pay over 150 dollars for a hunting license to go to a state with high numbers of wolves?
Would you pay over 400 dollars for an elk tag in an area with high numbers of wolves?
Would you pay a guide $$$$$$ to take you into an area to hunt with large numbers of wolves?
Most people will say no, but some might still say yes. WHY!! Well our southern areas of the state don’t have wolves yet. YET! Elk numbers on the Nevada and Utah lines are HUGE. Numbers are good and the bulls are very HUGE. Well the non-resident could draw there. Yes, they could. You buy the 150 plus dollar hunting license. Then you are allowed to apply for a permit. The odds are running right at 50 to 1 in most of the good elk hunts that means you will buy about 50 hunting licenses and 50 6.50 permit applications. That will cost you about 7800 dollars and it will be for all practical purposes a once in a life time draw. Actually after I read that I was wrong. The odds for a resident is 50-1. A non resident can only apply for 10% of the tags so The odds are WAY WAY higher than 50-1.
I know some people love the idea of wolves but they are not the ones that have to live with them. Come on think about it. Ron
 
And I want you fellers to remember what I said in a post previously.
I was told by the head of the forest service in boulder that he would stop all hunting on federal (remember, PUBLIC!) lands if he could. So, maybe this is speculation on my part, but could the forest service be infiltrated by bunny huggers? And are they working with the wierdos to introduce wolves to ruin the hunting?
We don't have that problem, yet. But I'm seeing forest service people more and more and they're not friendly anymore.
I'm not one to freak out at the first sign of trouble, but if you analyze what's going on, and look at the way anti's are acting now, it might just bring you to the realization that something sinister is going on.
 
Why should the USFS be "friendly?" Everyone AND their lawyer hates their guts. If you think the bunny huggers like them, think again. They start more lawsuits against the USFS than anyone I think.

And with 10s of thousands of employees, you can find some that hate just about any group you want. I know a bunch that hate cattle "ranchers".
 
Idaho Ron said:
Wolves are a disease that is infecting the whole north west. I understand that Idaho Fish and Game is down over 6 million dollars in revenue due to decreased sales of tags due to wolves. Non- residents do not want to buy tags that is simple fact. Our deer hunting is poor in most of the units south of the Salmon river. Our elk hunting is very poor everywhere north of I-84. I have seen what wolves will do with my own eyes. I hate wolves and long for the day we exterminate them for ever. I will be there with a call and a centerfire rifle. I took these pictures while I was deer hunting. I came over a hill and saw two wolves playing tug a war with this young and healthy buck. I wish there would have been a season that day for wolves. Ron

Wolftrack35.jpg


Wolftrack25.jpg


wolfkill35.jpg


wolfkill25.jpg


I agree 100 percent!!!!
Canandian Grey wolves ARE NOT INDIGINIOUS !!!
to the lower 48, they are big aggressive and WAY OUT OF COMTROL!!

All you forum members who advocate the introduction on a non indiginous wolves needs to go to
saveelk.com and educate yourself!!

Here is a big North Western MT white tail, WOLF KILL.
No exactly the weak and sick.
I will kill any wolf I see until we have a control program in place.


DSCF4713.jpg
 
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Capper said:
I've been reading about the Wolf problem in Idaho. I was wondering if they've moved into Colorado yet?

When I was hunting today I could have swore I saw some wolf tracks. Since it was snowing pretty hard they couldn't have been that old.

What say you?

YES!!
I picked up wolf scat in the Fossil Ridge wilderness are three years ago and submitted it to the CO DOW to test to see if it was a domestic deer eating hybred.
They :bull: me all summer than said,oops we lost the scat sorry.
:shake: :bull: :shake: :bull:
 
Idaho Ron said:
I wish there would have been a season that day for wolves. Ron

I don't avocate poaching but we are under attack.
And the arm chair bunny huggers making fed policy will drag their feet until we have no ungulated.
It's long past time to take matters into our own hands.
 
Vigilantism of any sort is usually illegal and the helter -skelter killing of wolves is uncontrolled as are other forms of vigilantism. Also some want the annihilation of wolves which is counter to good ecology {oh,oh...naughty word}. Somewhere in the middle a solution will be found....just have some patience.....Fred
 
There's something about wolves that seems to trigger a very primal response in humans. We get multiple bear maulings every year up here, including some right in Anchorage proper. But people don't get too worked up about it. Bears are just bears. We all know bears, and we respect them. But whenever the local packs start to muscle into town and snatch up some dogs it's major panic time. I think it has to do with the way the wolves seem to be almost as smart as we are. Nobody would accuse a bear of that. They have smart *stomachs* and noses, but they don't really have grand schemes of evil in those small brains.

These wolves, in contrast, seem to plan ahead, organize their pack and then execute the plan. No other animal but man can plan ahead and divide labor like that.

A few years back, the last time the pack came into town, they would have one wolf entice the dogs, then dart off into the bushes. The dog would follow, and the pack would pounce on the hapless hound like velociraptors. Killing and devouring them before the owners could catch up.

There are also instances of even large guard dogs just flat-out vanishing without a bark in the night. The owner finding only an empty collar and a few blood spots amidst the flurry of wolf prints. There are tales from the bush of packs marauding through villages killing whole teams of sled dogs.

Personally, I like having them around though. It makes life more interesting.
 
You're forgetting that Grey Wolves don't belong here. They never should have been brought here, and now it's a problem.


btw..We can hunt bears.
 
your allowed to control wolves in AK, trap,shoot put the fear of man into them.
way different down here and ours are not indiginious.
 
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